Holmesdale flags and fundraiser

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twcpfc Today 8.10am
Originally posted by SnapperKain I think you might of shot yourself in the foot here as essentially this is an admission that the HF is holding the club to ransom over the banner, but also that people's money has been collected (and used) without full disclosure of what the intention was (i.e. would only be used if the club agree to the banner coming back). We didn't give money for the flags for that to then be used as a negotiating tactic with the club about the banner and I say that despite being in support of the banner being reinstated. We though the flags would be used at West Ham and my impression was that they would be reusable for the rest of the season. What your saying is that this hasn't happened because it's being used as a pawn in getting the club to reinstate the banner. If the HF used the display as a bargaining chip with the club before collected the money then that would have been fine, but not afterwards. Not cool man. They're not just reusable for the season, but the nest season and the next etc etc. They're not going anywhere just delayed. I want as mush as anyone for this to be sorted especially given our current form but once sorted it will be great - again, hopefully sooner rather than later
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twcpfc

Today 8.10am

Originally posted by SnapperKain

I think you might of shot yourself in the foot here as essentially this is an admission that the HF is holding the club to ransom over the banner, but also that people's money has been collected (and used) without full disclosure of what the intention was (i.e. would only be used if the club agree to the banner coming back).

We didn't give money for the flags for that to then be used as a negotiating tactic with the club about the banner and I say that despite being in support of the banner being reinstated. We though the flags would be used at West Ham and my impression was that they would be reusable for the rest of the season. What your saying is that this hasn't happened because it's being used as a pawn in getting the club to reinstate the banner. If the HF used the display as a bargaining chip with the club before collected the money then that would have been fine, but not afterwards.

Not cool man.

They're not just reusable for the season, but the nest season and the next etc etc. They're not going anywhere just delayed. I want as mush as anyone for this to be sorted especially given our current form but once sorted it will be great - again, hopefully sooner rather than later

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eagleman13 On The Road To Hell & Alicante Today 8.17am
Originally posted by twcpfc The flags have been ordered mate. Also the banner everyone is referring to is the "holmesdale fanatics" banner which has in some shape or form represented the support of palace fans in the stadium and behind the scenes for years and there are banners like it allowed in almost every other stadium across the uk and europe. The banner does NOT represent the fans, it represents the hf, end of. I'm a blind man, i'm a blind man, now my room is cold, When a blind man cries, Lord, he feels it from his soul. [Link]
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eagleman13

On The Road To Hell & Alicante Today 8.17am

Originally posted by twcpfc

The flags have been ordered mate. Also the banner everyone is referring to is the "holmesdale fanatics" banner which has in some shape or form represented the support of palace fans in the stadium and behind the scenes for years and there are banners like it allowed in almost every other stadium across the uk and europe.

The banner does NOT represent the fans, it represents the hf, end of.

I'm a blind man, i'm a blind man, now my room is cold,
When a blind man cries, Lord, he feels it from his soul.
[Link]

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twcpfc Today 8.39am
Originally posted by eagleman13 The banner does NOT represent the fans, it represents the hf, end of. I said the "support". I didn't say it represents the political views or your thoughts on the club or the way you wipe your ass or anything crazy. But I think a lot of the people in the stadium who care about having a part to play in the stands, who have been going to palace for a few years, about having a strong atmosphere when it is dying in england, or care about moving forwards or improving as a fanbase or a club, the banner has a sense of representation for the support of selhurst from the noise to the tifos and a lot of people who support palace would agree with my point on this. Other fans and neutrals see it is a representation of the class atmosphere generated by selhurst so why can't we at times. Not a problem if you disagree but I think a lot of people prefer to take a less than fully negative view on the subject
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twcpfc

Today 8.39am

Originally posted by eagleman13

The banner does NOT represent the fans, it represents the hf, end of.

I said the "support". I didn't say it represents the political views or your thoughts on the club or the way you wipe your ass or anything crazy. But I think a lot of the people in the stadium who care about having a part to play in the stands, who have been going to palace for a few years, about having a strong atmosphere when it is dying in england, or care about moving forwards or improving as a fanbase or a club, the banner has a sense of representation for the support of selhurst from the noise to the tifos and a lot of people who support palace would agree with my point on this.

Other fans and neutrals see it is a representation of the class atmosphere generated by selhurst so why can't we at times.

Not a problem if you disagree but I think a lot of people prefer to take a less than fully negative view on the subject

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eagleman13 On The Road To Hell & Alicante Today 9.26am
Originally posted by twcpfc I said the "support". I didn't say it represents the political views or your thoughts on the club or the way you wipe your ass or anything crazy. But I think a lot of the people in the stadium who care about having a part to play in the stands, who have been going to palace for a few years, about having a strong atmosphere when it is dying in england, or care about moving forwards or improving as a fanbase or a club, the banner has a sense of representation for the support of selhurst from the noise to the tifos and a lot of people who support palace would agree with my point on this. Other fans and neutrals see it is a representation of the class atmosphere generated by selhurst so why can't we at times. Not a problem if you disagree but I think a lot of people prefer to take a less than fully negative view on the subject What the hell are you on about? This has nothing to do with atmosphere or tifo's, it's about fans/supporters being fleeced by lies. When you started this thread, you said the flags would be ready & available for the West Ham game, 21st April. You then kept coming on here & all of a sudden it's then about a banner, then you said y/day, you haven't even got the flags, but they've been 'ordered'. You also say that nothing will be done unless the banner, which by the way , is for the hf, NOT the whole of the fanbase, is 'restored'. That is pathetic. I use the word 'you' colloquially & as someone has pointed out, you are like a very poor politician, but, fair play for doing it. I'm a blind man, i'm a blind man, now my room is cold, When a blind man cries, Lord, he feels it from his soul. [Link]
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eagleman13

On The Road To Hell & Alicante Today 9.26am

Originally posted by twcpfc

Other fans and neutrals see it is a representation of the class atmosphere generated by selhurst so why can't we at times.

Not a problem if you disagree but I think a lot of people prefer to take a less than fully negative view on the subject

What the hell are you on about?

This has nothing to do with atmosphere or tifo's, it's about fans/supporters being fleeced by lies. When you started this thread, you said the flags would be ready & available for the West Ham game, 21st April. You then kept coming on here & all of a sudden it's then about a banner, then you said y/day, you haven't even got the flags, but they've been 'ordered'. You also say that nothing will be done unless the banner, which by the way , is for the hf, NOT the whole of the fanbase, is 'restored'. That is pathetic.

I use the word 'you' colloquially & as someone has pointed out, you are like a very poor politician, but, fair play for doing it.

I'm a blind man, i'm a blind man, now my room is cold,
When a blind man cries, Lord, he feels it from his soul.
[Link]

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eritheagle Erith Today 10.08am
Originally posted by twcpfc I’ll come back to this once the holmesdale is a sea of red and blue flags. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean it won’t. The intention is always to improve the atmosphere at selhurst park. Lots of people on here believe money was collected and then the flags were used as a type of “bargaining technique”. This is a) not true as the group has enough flags, people didn’t need to go out of their way to spend time creating more. b) it was stated in the initial statement before the fundraiser was even sent discussing the plans for when the banner is restored, so the message has always been clear Edited by twcpfc (09 May 2024 8.05am) Blah, blah, blah!!!
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eritheagle

Erith Today 10.08am

Originally posted by twcpfc

I’ll come back to this once the holmesdale is a sea of red and blue flags. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean it won’t. The intention is always to improve the atmosphere at selhurst park.

Lots of people on here believe money was collected and then the flags were used as a type of “bargaining technique”. This is a) not true as the group has enough flags, people didn’t need to go out of their way to spend time creating more. b) it was stated in the initial statement before the fundraiser was even sent discussing the plans for when the banner is restored, so the message has always been clear

Edited by twcpfc (09 May 2024 8.05am)

Blah, blah, blah!!!

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Nutmeg London Today 10.43am
Originally posted by twcpfc I’ll come back to this once the holmesdale is a sea of red and blue flags. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean it won’t. The intention is always to improve the atmosphere at selhurst park. Lots of people on here believe money was collected and then the flags were used as a type of “bargaining technique”. This is a) not true as the group has enough flags, people didn’t need to go out of their way to spend time creating more. b) it was stated in the initial statement before the fundraiser was even sent discussing the plans for when the banner is restored, so the message has always been clear Edited by twcpfc (09 May 2024 8.05am) How was the message clear exactly? I'm not sure where that image is from but that information is certainly not on the go fund me page. You can't pick and choose what information to show to those willing to donate, only to share a completely separate statement and claim it was clear all along! When the banner isn't restored, what then? Because I genuinely don't think it will be. Why would the club give up much needed advertising revenue to make way for a group of fans' banner
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Nutmeg

London Today 10.43am

Originally posted by twcpfc

Edited by twcpfc (09 May 2024 8.05am)

How was the message clear exactly?

I'm not sure where that image is from but that information is certainly not on the go fund me page. You can't pick and choose what information to show to those willing to donate, only to share a completely separate statement and claim it was clear all along!

When the banner isn't restored, what then? Because I genuinely don't think it will be. Why would the club give up much needed advertising revenue to make way for a group of fans' banner

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SnapperKain SE25 6PU Today 11.13am
Originally posted by twcpfc I’ll come back to this once the holmesdale is a sea of red and blue flags. Just because it hasn’t happened doesn’t mean it won’t. The intention is always to improve the atmosphere at selhurst park. Lots of people on here believe money was collected and then the flags were used as a type of “bargaining technique”. This is a) not true as the group has enough flags, people didn’t need to go out of their way to spend time creating more. b) it was stated in the initial statement before the fundraiser was even sent discussing the plans for when the banner is restored, so the message has always been clear Edited by twcpfc (09 May 2024 8.05am) Just to be clear, I'm not against the HF doing what they do and appreciate the time and effort that people put in, however, what you've put there isn't correct. That screenshot you included was first posted on here by yourself on the 19th April in this post Originally posted by twcpfc Target of £4k was beaten by a few hundred, amazing backing from the fanbase as per. 1,000 flags ordered and ready for the West Ham game to be distributed and used presuming the club restores the banner to the Holmesdale. I've attached a full message if anyone is interested. which was only after the 4k was reached and this was the first any of us knew about the "battle for the banner". The go fund me doesn't mention anything about the banner having to be restored before this would go ahead (see attached from your post on the 7th March) so we've contributed without knowing our money would be used in this way. So please don't say this was known from the beginning, perhaps those closer to the organisers knew, but from the perspective of someone who only knows about this from the HOL, this definitely wasn't the case. This is what has irritated people who have put money into this and trying to change the facts to fit a narrative isn't going to help. I look forward to seeing the display from the Arthur, I'm sure it will be amazing and you'll be able to post the photos on here with a "told you so" and I hope that people bring the flags to more games (think you might be a bit optimistic there though now we've reached the end of the season). That's not the issue though, the issue is that the HF have moved the goal posts and haven't been up front about using this as a tactic to get their banner back and if I'm completely honest, I don't even know what it looks like as you can't see it from the back of the Arthur. Thing is that what we contributed to was bringing some flags into the Holmesdale, even though not all of us sit there and won't actually get a flag, to raise the atmosphere and all that for potentially the last few home games of the season. Whilst we appreciate that people do this in there own time and didn't have to "bother making more flags", what we didn't do was contribute to a fund that would be used in essence by the HF as a tactic for their own personal issue over getting a flag resinstated, which let's be honest is only something that the HF is bothered about. Edited by SnapperKain (09 May 2024 11.15am) Attachment: 3862178_124873B6-B5F5-4FD5-BCA8-4D7A697C8B48.png (301.14Kb) The trouble with computers, of course, is that they're very sophisticated idiots
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SnapperKain

SE25 6PU Today 11.13am

Originally posted by twcpfc

Lots of people on here believe money was collected and then the flags were used as a type of “bargaining technique”. This is a) not true as the group has enough flags, people didn’t need to go out of their way to spend time creating more. b) it was stated in the initial statement before the fundraiser was even sent discussing the plans for when the banner is restored, so the message has always been clear

Edited by twcpfc (09 May 2024 8.05am)

Just to be clear, I'm not against the HF doing what they do and appreciate the time and effort that people put in, however, what you've put there isn't correct.

That screenshot you included was first posted on here by yourself on the 19th April in this post

Originally posted by twcpfc

Target of £4k was beaten by a few hundred, amazing backing from the fanbase as per. 1,000 flags ordered and ready for the West Ham game to be distributed and used presuming the club restores the banner to the Holmesdale. I've attached a full message if anyone is interested.

which was only after the 4k was reached and this was the first any of us knew about the "battle for the banner". The go fund me doesn't mention anything about the banner having to be restored before this would go ahead (see attached from your post on the 7th March) so we've contributed without knowing our money would be used in this way.

So please don't say this was known from the beginning, perhaps those closer to the organisers knew, but from the perspective of someone who only knows about this from the HOL, this definitely wasn't the case. This is what has irritated people who have put money into this and trying to change the facts to fit a narrative isn't going to help.

I look forward to seeing the display from the Arthur, I'm sure it will be amazing and you'll be able to post the photos on here with a "told you so" and I hope that people bring the flags to more games (think you might be a bit optimistic there though now we've reached the end of the season). That's not the issue though, the issue is that the HF have moved the goal posts and haven't been up front about using this as a tactic to get their banner back and if I'm completely honest, I don't even know what it looks like as you can't see it from the back of the Arthur.

Thing is that what we contributed to was bringing some flags into the Holmesdale, even though not all of us sit there and won't actually get a flag, to raise the atmosphere and all that for potentially the last few home games of the season. Whilst we appreciate that people do this in there own time and didn't have to "bother making more flags", what we didn't do was contribute to a fund that would be used in essence by the HF as a tactic for their own personal issue over getting a flag resinstated, which let's be honest is only something that the HF is bothered about.

Edited by SnapperKain (09 May 2024 11.15am)

Attachment: 3862178_124873B6-B5F5-4FD5-BCA8-4D7A697C8B48.png (301.14Kb)

The trouble with computers, of course, is that they're very sophisticated idiots

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Dubai Eagle Today 11.58am
If I was someone (a commercial entity) who had paid £......... for the LED advertising space / message in the stadium, I would think that somewhere in that advertising space contract with the club would be words / a section that confirms to me that my paid for display will remain in full public view throughout the game without some other entity blocking my message. Would that not be fair ?
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Dubai Eagle

Today 11.58am

If I was someone (a commercial entity) who had paid £.........
for the LED advertising space / message in the stadium, I would think that somewhere in that advertising space contract with the club would be words / a section that confirms to me that my paid for display will remain in full public view throughout the game without some other entity blocking my message.

Would that not be fair ?

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est1905 Today 4.57pm
Originally posted by twcpfc The flags have been ordered mate. Also the banner everyone is referring to is the "holmesdale fanatics" banner which has in some shape or form represented the support of palace fans in the stadium and behind the scenes for years and there are banners like it allowed in almost every other stadium across the uk and europe. Ordered? But were they not supposed to be available for the West Ham game? Meaning you have taken people's money and not produced what you promised. How is that so hard to understand? As for your banner representing 'Palace fans'? Rubbish. You only want to include all fans when it suits you. I'm a Palace fan but I dont see what right you think you have to say you represent me. You dont. The Holmsdale Fanatics are a group of spoilt children that are in fine mood as long as they get their own way. I sincerely hope the club does not give in to your whining and refuses your banner. As for the money, you rip off merchant. I'm thankful I didn't donate anything. Its the fans that want to think the best of you lot I feel sorry for. Guessing you have no intention of refunding any of them despite not delivering on your promise for the WEST HAM GAME?
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est1905

Today 4.57pm

Originally posted by twcpfc

Ordered? But were they not supposed to be available for the West Ham game? Meaning you have taken people's money and not produced what you promised. How is that so hard to understand?
As for your banner representing 'Palace fans'? Rubbish. You only want to include all fans when it suits you. I'm a Palace fan but I dont see what right you think you have to say you represent me. You dont. The Holmsdale Fanatics are a group of spoilt children that are in fine mood as long as they get their own way.
I sincerely hope the club does not give in to your whining and refuses your banner. As for the money, you rip off merchant. I'm thankful I didn't donate anything. Its the fans that want to think the best of you lot I feel sorry for. Guessing you have no intention of refunding any of them despite not delivering on your promise for the WEST HAM GAME?

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