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Badger11 Beckenham 09 Jan 18 2.22pm | |
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The FA has announced that future appointments will be governed by the Rooney rule. I think this is fine for the FA if they want to go this way but I am against it for Premier League clubs. In The US the Rooney rule has worked however they do not have relegation. If they sack a coach they can afford to take their time and go through a process as there are no financial implications. We don't have the luxury of time in the Premier league. Additionally what is the point if you have already decided who you want. I once went to an interview and it was obvious that the candidate before me had the job. As it was council they had to advertise it but it was a farce. I was not annoyed that they knew who they wanted but that they had wasted my time. Could we see BME candidates constantly on the road going from one interview to another. That doesn't seem fair. I think the better solution is to identify BME candidates before there is a vacancy. I hope at Palace we have a shortlist of future managers we keep an eye on. Getting a BME candidate on that shortlist should be the goal. Final point there aren't enough BME candidates with the right qualifications. I believe that Dalian Atkinson was appointed by the FA to try and drum up more interest from players. We have to have a bigger gene pool to select from. Anyway over to you thoughts?
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davenotamonkey 09 Jan 18 3.21pm | |
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Originally posted by Badger11
The FA has announced that future appointments will be governed by the Rooney rule. I think this is fine for the FA if they want to go this way but I am against it for Premier League clubs. In The US the Rooney rule has worked however they do not have relegation. If they sack a coach they can afford to take their time and go through a process as there are no financial implications. We don't have the luxury of time in the Premier league. Additionally what is the point if you have already decided who you want. I once went to an interview and it was obvious that the candidate before me had the job. As it was council they had to advertise it but it was a farce. I was not annoyed that they knew who they wanted but that they had wasted my time. Could we see BME candidates constantly on the road going from one interview to another. That doesn't seem fair. I think the better solution is to identify BME candidates before there is a vacancy. I hope at Palace we have a shortlist of future managers we keep an eye on. Getting a BME candidate on that shortlist should be the goal. Final point there aren't enough BME candidates with the right qualifications. I believe that Dalian Atkinson was appointed by the FA to try and drum up more interest from players. We have to have a bigger gene pool to select from. Anyway over to you thoughts? Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter.
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Badger11 Beckenham 09 Jan 18 4.29pm | |
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Originally posted by davenotamonkey
Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter. Of course I should have said that. The presumption was that the BME person has the talent but not the profile.
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Hrolf The Ganger 09 Jan 18 4.41pm | |
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Ridiculous. Thr FA logic is that there a lots of Black footballers so we should have more Black coaches. I hope we all still remember the disgraceful treatment of the women's coach.
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Mr_Gristle In the land of Whelk Eaters 09 Jan 18 4.48pm | |
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Originally posted by davenotamonkey
Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter. My name is Bert Apache and I assert my right to a guaranteed interview.
Well I think Simon's head is large; always involved in espionage. (Name that tune) |
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Badger11 Beckenham 09 Jan 18 4.50pm | |
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Originally posted by Mr_Gristle
My name is Bert Apache and I assert my right to a guaranteed interview. Certainly Mr Apache but would you mind moving your horse into the car park first.
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Bangell Oxford 09 Jan 18 9.00pm | |
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Don't see why anyone has a problem with the Rooney Rule. Not a quota system or anti-meritocratic - it just ensures that candidates who might otherwise be overlooked at least get a chance, and the rule's effectiveness in the US has demonstrated that indeed decent candidates had previously been overlooked.
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davenotamonkey 09 Jan 18 9.08pm | |
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Originally posted by Mr_Gristle
My name is Bert Apache and I assert my right to a guaranteed interview. Attachment: respect.jpg (104.72Kb)
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Username Horsham 10 Jan 18 2.50pm | |
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Originally posted by davenotamonkey
Meritocracy please. Best person for the job, even if they identify as an attack helicopter. No one is forced to hire someone they don't want, they just have to make the effort to interview a BAME candidate. It doesn't effect anyone already on the shortlist, other than adding more competition. That BAME candidate who gets on the list then gets the chance at an interview they probably wouldn't get normally. They still have to be qualified, and occasionally they will convince someone to give them a job. On the occasions they don't, they get interview practice and a chance to learn what is required in the future.
Employee of the month is a good example of how someone can be both a winner and a loser at the same time. |
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Hrolf The Ganger 10 Jan 18 5.49pm | |
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Originally posted by Bangell
Don't see why anyone has a problem with the Rooney Rule. Not a quota system or anti-meritocratic - it just ensures that candidates who might otherwise be overlooked at least get a chance, and the rule's effectiveness in the US has demonstrated that indeed decent candidates had previously been overlooked. The problem for me is not the idea but the reasons for implementing it.
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black eagle. south croydon. 10 Jan 18 5.56pm | |
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I think it's a great idea. If a black or asian is guaranteed an interview for the England job that is progress. I will also say the best person should get any future England job regardless of colour.
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davenotamonkey 10 Jan 18 6.26pm | |
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Originally posted by Username
No one is forced to hire someone they don't want, they just have to make the effort to interview a BAME candidate. It doesn't effect anyone already on the shortlist, other than adding more competition. That BAME candidate who gets on the list then gets the chance at an interview they probably wouldn't get normally. They still have to be qualified, and occasionally they will convince someone to give them a job. On the occasions they don't, they get interview practice and a chance to learn what is required in the future.
It does affect people on the shortlist, as: i) they were there by virtue of merit, not by whatever pigeon-hole identity-politiks has put them in (if indeed you can fit an attack helicopter into a pigeon-hole). This makes a value statement on the candidates, and a two-tier one at that. They should "make the effort" to interview a "BAME" candidate if said candidate has the skills and qualities they sodding well desire in an employee. Businesses should not have to adopt tokenism to sate the bloodlust of Common Purpose and the likes. I agree implicit bias in candidate selection needs to be monitored: if HR systematically chuck out the CVs of people "sexually-identifying" as an Attack Helicopter, then that's wrong. That's why I support non-identifying job applications with no ethnographic or gender data. But I stand by my comment: the best candidates should be shortlisted, and the best person should get the job. Otherwise, you'll end up looking utterly hypocritical when you ram an agenda down our throats and serve up this at the same time:
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