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Training the Newbies
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 Mapletree  Croydon 15 Feb 14 2.03pm |
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There is a general view on HOL that new generation supporters won't fit in very well and won't add to the atmosphere. Thinking about that, the people that don't sing much - although they are improving - are primarily in the Main Stand. Most of those guys are long-standing supporters who just don't feel the need to sing. Hard to get them going and they feel more embarrassment about singing than about not singing. But the newbies are there to be moulded. Could it be that when they first arrive they will see the singing and assume they really should participate? And maybe many of them are coming because we have a reputation for atmosphere and will want to add to it.
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| est1905 15 Feb 14 5.05pm |
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Quote Mapletree at 15 Feb 2014 2.03pm
There is a general view on HOL that new generation supporters won't fit in very well and won't add to the atmosphere. Thinking about that, the people that don't sing much - although they are improving - are primarily in the Main Stand. Most of those guys are long-standing supporters who just don't feel the need to sing. Hard to get them going and they feel more embarrassment about singing than about not singing. But the newbies are there to be moulded. Could it be that when they first arrive they will see the singing and assume they really should participate? And maybe many of them are coming because we have a reputation for atmosphere and will want to add to it. The majority of football supporters don't sing. There is usually a hardcore section of a few hundred that may sing continuously and a couple of thousand that tend to join in when trying to lift the team or get behind them. The entire stadium will only cheer when a goal goes in. even then they wont sing. This is the same with all football clubs everywhere. You wont change it.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Feb 14 7.10pm |
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I have been going to Selhurst Park for more than 60 years. We have always been able to create a good atmosphere but I go to football matches to watch football, and not to sing or jump up and down. In fact I have been amazed at the antics of some "supporters" who seem more concerned about the noise they generate than in actually watching the game. I have seen some who spend more time with their backs to the action than facing it. Beats me! Each to their own but it seems more than a little presumptive to suggest that anyone needs "training". Edited by Wisbech Eagle (15 Feb 2014 7.13pm)
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Dweeb East London 17 Feb 14 11.27am |
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Quote Mapletree at 15 Feb 2014 2.03pm
There is a general view on HOL that new generation supporters won't fit in very well and won't add to the atmosphere. Thinking about that, the people that don't sing much - although they are improving - are primarily in the Main Stand. Most of those guys are long-standing supporters who just don't feel the need to sing. Hard to get them going and they feel more embarrassment about singing than about not singing. But the newbies are there to be moulded. Could it be that when they first arrive they will see the singing and assume they really should participate? And maybe many of them are coming because we have a reputation for atmosphere and will want to add to it.
When I first started supporting Palace some 50 years ago now no one moulded me I joined in becuase I wanted to, and despite whatever the HF membership think of the singing, noise and supportive atmosphere they create today, it is NOTHING as compared to 50,000 plus fans shouting Eagles, or singing the songs of our day! Also, having been supporting the club for this length of time and as my body moves towards its 60th year I also have to admit I no longer have the ability to vocally sustain that support. It does not mean I don't do it, but rather I am more selective as to when, how loud and for how long. I wish I could stand for up to 3 hours, and shout as loud as I once did for PCFC, but humans get older and bodies change, no matter how much we may resist. So, how about encoruaging people instead of berating or trying to mould, which is another word for indoctrinate. Each generation finds its own way to support it doesn't need an "either or choice" from anyone.
Taking the Sorry to see Lee Hills go, did we ever see Alex Marrow? We did January 2013 |
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bungy jump since 1964. Never to see John Jackson in a 
| Hoof Hearted 17 Feb 14 11.36am | |
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People are individuals not sheep.
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| sydtheeagle England 17 Feb 14 12.34pm |
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I rather think, or fear, that the OP is a product of the world he lives in and as such he's just reverting to type. Wisbech correctly points out that some of today's lads don't even face the pitch. That's because, these days, it's all about ME being the centre of attention, not the team or anyone or anything else. Why do you think reality shows (with their zero production costs) have supplanted proper dramas (which are expensive to make) on TV? Answer: Because skill-free people grabbing for their 15 minutes of fame has become more important than serious entertainment. In fact, ME /MYSELF/I has become entertainment. Today, satisfying ME is the point of almost everything. The same is true with the notion of "training", as Hoofie points out. These days, love (of someone or something) is not enough of a motivator...if you want the pre-fabricated, unalloyed, live-in-technicolour football experience then you train your supporters to provide it. They don't have to love the club or even, for that matter, like football as long as they sing an behave as expected and get their 15 minutes on TV. A corollary of this is the number of fans happy to accept "your team is awful but everyone thinks our supporters are great" as representing some sort of achievement...hey, Palace may be crap but we're famous...that's what it's all about. We live in a fcuked up world, that's for sure. I'm with those who remember when supporting Palace was about, well, supporting Palace. To be honest, if we start having to give our supporters lessons in behaviour then I think I'll be off for good.
Sydenham by birth. Selhurst by the Grace of God. |
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| Mapletree Croydon 18 Feb 14 9.44am |
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Quote Dweeb at 17 Feb 2014 11.27am
Quote Mapletree at 15 Feb 2014 2.03pm
There is a general view on HOL that new generation supporters won't fit in very well and won't add to the atmosphere. Thinking about that, the people that don't sing much - although they are improving - are primarily in the Main Stand. Most of those guys are long-standing supporters who just don't feel the need to sing. Hard to get them going and they feel more embarrassment about singing than about not singing. But the newbies are there to be moulded. Could it be that when they first arrive they will see the singing and assume they really should participate? And maybe many of them are coming because we have a reputation for atmosphere and will want to add to it.
When I first started supporting Palace some 50 years ago now no one moulded me I joined in becuase I wanted to, and despite whatever the HF membership think of the singing, noise and supportive atmosphere they create today, it is NOTHING as compared to 50,000 plus fans shouting Eagles, or singing the songs of our day! Also, having been supporting the club for this length of time and as my body moves towards its 60th year I also have to admit I no longer have the ability to vocally sustain that support. It does not mean I don't do it, but rather I am more selective as to when, how loud and for how long. I wish I could stand for up to 3 hours, and shout as loud as I once did for PCFC, but humans get older and bodies change, no matter how much we may resist. So, how about encoruaging people instead of berating or trying to mould, which is another word for indoctrinate. Each generation finds its own way to support it doesn't need an "either or choice" from anyone. I don't think my post mentioned age. I have supported Palace longer than you. I did not say there is anything wrong with people who don't want to sing. What I did say is don't knock new generation supporters. Just maybe they will bring added passion, and not less passion, to SP. With any luck they will copy what they see and learn to have no inhibitions about singing. I find it frustrating that we all acknowledge we are the '12th man' yet many people feel no responsibility towards that. We SHOULD increase our noise when we are one down. Football is interactive, it isn't telly. Ask Delia. But, despite what you suggest, on HOL I won't encourage you to sing because I would only come under attack. See the posters on this thread.
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| Stirlingsays 18 Feb 14 9.53am |
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Quote Mapletree at 18 Feb 2014 9.44am
I don't think my post mentioned age. I have supported Palace longer than you. I did not say there is anything wrong with people who don't want to sing. What I did say is don't knock new generation supporters. Just maybe they will bring added passion, and not less passion, to SP. With any luck they will copy what they see and learn to have no inhibitions about singing. I find it frustrating that we all acknowledge we are the '12th man' yet many people feel no responsibility towards that. We SHOULD increase our noise when we are one down. Football is interactive, it isn't telly. Ask Delia. But, despite what you suggest, on HOL I won't encourage you to sing because I would only come under attack. See the posters on this thread.
If a fan buys their ticket and wants to watch in peace and quiet then that is just as valid as a fan who wants to jump around. Different strokes for different folks. There is no 'should' in how a fan chooses to support their team.....Their money, their choice. From my own perspective I'm welcoming to all fans.....The more the merrier. We can't become a bigger club without more fans and fans come in all types.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| Moose In the sewer pipe... 18 Feb 14 9.58am |
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Quote Dweeb at 17 Feb 2014 11.27am
I wish I could stand for up to 3 hours, and shout as loud as I once did for PCFC, but humans get older and bodies change, no matter how much we may resist.
Goodness is what you do. Not who you pray to. |
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| Moose In the sewer pipe... 18 Feb 14 10.05am |
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Quote sydtheeagle at 17 Feb 2014 12.34pm
Goodness is what you do. Not who you pray to. |
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| Hoof Hearted 18 Feb 14 11.09am | |
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Quote sydtheeagle at 17 Feb 2014 12.34pm
I rather think, or fear, that the OP is a product of the world he lives in and as such he's just reverting to type. Wisbech correctly points out that some of today's lads don't even face the pitch. That's because, these days, it's all about ME being the centre of attention, not the team or anyone or anything else. Why do you think reality shows (with their zero production costs) have supplanted proper dramas (which are expensive to make) on TV? Answer: Because skill-free people grabbing for their 15 minutes of fame has become more important than serious entertainment. In fact, ME /MYSELF/I has become entertainment. Today, satisfying ME is the point of almost everything. The same is true with the notion of "training", as Hoofie points out. These days, love (of someone or something) is not enough of a motivator...if you want the pre-fabricated, unalloyed, live-in-technicolour football experience then you train your supporters to provide it. They don't have to love the club or even, for that matter, like football as long as they sing an behave as expected and get their 15 minutes on TV. A corollary of this is the number of fans happy to accept "your team is awful but everyone thinks our supporters are great" as representing some sort of achievement...hey, Palace may be crap but we're famous...that's what it's all about. We live in a fcuked up world, that's for sure. I'm with those who remember when supporting Palace was about, well, supporting Palace. To be honest, if we start having to give our supporters lessons in behaviour then I think I'll be off for good.
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| est1905 18 Feb 14 6.53pm |
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Quote Mapletree at 15 Feb 2014 2.03pm
There is a general view on HOL that new generation supporters won't fit in very well and won't add to the atmosphere. Thinking about that, the people that don't sing much - although they are improving - are primarily in the Main Stand. Most of those guys are long-standing supporters who just don't feel the need to sing. Hard to get them going and they feel more embarrassment about singing than about not singing. But the newbies are there to be moulded. Could it be that when they first arrive they will see the singing and assume they really should participate? And maybe many of them are coming because we have a reputation for atmosphere and will want to add to it. What right has any one got to even think they can 'mould' another fan anyway. We will all do what we want. Ever so sorry to disappoint!
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