It's not deemed sexy,because they aren't Palestinian!!

Pro USA & Israel

Anti zionism is anti the existence of Israel.

However, should Israel be in the west bank?

If you're for the long term existence of Israel then you are probably resigned to that having to be the case....and then after that Gaza.

If you're against the long term existence of Israel then no....they shouldn't be there.

I'm resigned to the fact that if Israel is going to be a permanent nation in the middle east then the Palestinians have to be moved out.

I think that's what they are basically doing bit by bit.

Edited by Stirlingsays (22 Nov 2018 11.19am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Do the English have the right to English land?

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Yes.

Now, you have a hint.... do Palestinians have a right to Palestinian land?

"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

On an ethical basis Israel has no right to exist on the land it occupies.....but ethics are for individuals, the state of nations are the results of far larger forces.

Carving out a new country based upon a religious book, guilt over the attempted geocide and where your ancient descendants partly came from is no defence for it.....I've always agreed with Einstein's views at the time over it.

That said, who do I prefer?......the Israelis or the Palestinians (Hamas). I prefer the Israelis because they are pro western, partly European and rational....but I recognise that it has nothing to do with fairness.

Israel exists....it's not going away. There's too much generational hatred for them to ever be accepted in the region. So they have to remove their enemies or be removed themselves.....might is right, whether we like it or not.

Whatever happens it's horrible. As a young man I used to believe in the peace process....but that was naive...like a lot of things I used to believe in...more hope than realism.

I certainly don't believe that Israel deserves the support of America to the extent that it gets it. The power of the Jewish lobbies over there in all levels of politics and business creates a disfigurement.

I also certainly don't agree with this idea that you can't criticise Israel because it's somehow anti semitic.....Sure some people are anti semitic but most aren't, and the levels of censor over criticising another country's government is wholly ridiculous and inappropriate.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Nov 2018 3.14am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

I'm not sure nine percent is very relevant. I wouldn't agree with you either that people like the evangelicals are stupid.....misguided perhaps but not stupid.

Most Jews are secular rather than particularly religious. The protection of Israel by US Jews is entirely expected....it doesn't take a genius to work out the reasons why.

I'm a secular atheist/aghostic though, so from my perspective I just see a disfigured political system where the US protects and affords Israel far more favour than it has any particular right to.....the lobbies have the political and media system rigged in their favour and significant financial clout.

That said....like I say....Israel is European and western facing....so while I view the Machiavellian behaviours of its advocates entirely negatively.....I can't say the anti western Palestinians have played their hand at all intelligently over the years......No western country could back them.

Edited by Stirlingsays (23 Nov 2018 5.53pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)