The moaning about Parish/Hodgson/Freedman thread

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The moaning about Parish/Hodgson/Freedman thread

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Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 22 Jan 20 3.15pm
Originally posted by PatrickA Surely the central point is that it’s not one poor performance. We have amassed a reasonable points total (albeit still only 7 points above the relegation line) but we are the lowest scorers in the division and rarely create more than a couple of opportunities a game. Some will point to lack of resources and injuries , but I genuinely believe it’s largely attributable to Hodgson’s rigid approach. Football is about attacking as well as defending and Hodgson’s focus seems to be dedicated exclusively to the latter. Nobody will convince me that our attacking play this season has warranted us scoring more goals than the paltry amount that we have registered. It certainly is a very hard watch for us supporters. Instead of playing with real tempo, pressing the opposition when they have the ball we just retreat into our defensive shape, get behind the ball and invite the opposition on.By the time attacks break down, we are so deep and a long way from goal.Our offensive play is slow and laborious and we find it hard to string a succession of passes together, perhaps in part due to a lack of movement off the ball.We are risk averse and playing in a straight-jacket. In the final analysis, if we survive this year,Hodgson will be lauded for his tactical approach and the owners will be beaming like Colgate toothpaste models, holding up placards with "Mission accomplished on limited funds" Edited by Willo (22 Jan 2020 3.18pm)
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Willo

South coast - west of Brighton. 22 Jan 20 3.15pm

Originally posted by PatrickA

Surely the central point is that it’s not one poor performance.
We have amassed a reasonable points total (albeit still only 7 points above the relegation line) but we are the lowest scorers in the division and rarely create more than a couple of opportunities a game.
Some will point to lack of resources and injuries , but I genuinely believe it’s largely attributable to Hodgson’s rigid approach.
Football is about attacking as well as defending and Hodgson’s focus seems to be dedicated exclusively to the latter.
Nobody will convince me that our attacking play this season has warranted us scoring more goals than the paltry amount that we have registered.

It certainly is a very hard watch for us supporters.

Instead of playing with real tempo, pressing the opposition when they have the ball we just retreat into our defensive shape, get behind the ball and invite the opposition on.By the time attacks break down, we are so deep and a long way from goal.Our offensive play is slow and laborious and we find it hard to string a succession of passes together, perhaps in part due to a lack of movement off the ball.We are risk averse and playing in a straight-jacket.

In the final analysis, if we survive this year,Hodgson will be lauded for his tactical approach and the owners will be beaming like Colgate toothpaste models, holding up placards with "Mission accomplished on limited funds"

Edited by Willo (22 Jan 2020 3.18pm)

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MikeCrete Crete 22 Jan 20 3.20pm
Originally posted by southnorwoodhill Top post. He turned the crop of England's best players into clueless numpties with his negative tactics by the end of his tenure. I hope he leaves at the end of the season and gets a good thank you farewell for what he achieved in the first season. It really is not acceptable that we defend at home from the start of a game, which has been the norm over the past couple of seasons. You can draw a line down the middle of the pitch & all players are on the same side; that has to be down to the manager, players like to get into space etc.Change is desperately tactic wise before we get dragged into the relegation dog fight & our run in does not inspire confidence.
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MikeCrete

Crete 22 Jan 20 3.20pm

Originally posted by southnorwoodhill

Top post. He turned the crop of England's best players into clueless numpties with his negative tactics by the end of his tenure.
I hope he leaves at the end of the season and gets a good thank you farewell for what he achieved in the first season.

It really is not acceptable that we defend at home from the start of a game, which has been the norm over the past couple of seasons. You can draw a line down the middle of the pitch & all players are on the same side; that has to be down to the manager, players like to get into space etc.Change is desperately tactic wise before we get dragged into the relegation dog fight & our run in does not inspire confidence.

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Ghostship Norfolk 22 Jan 20 3.23pm
Originally posted by Willo In terms of 'Throw-in' I recall early in the game, Kelly taking a thrw-in and it landed on the head of an opposition player who was unchallenged.I was one unimpressed hombre. Apropos not shooting from distance, the QPR manager Mark Warburton forbids his players from shooting from over 22 yards from goal. Finally, Roy Hodgson has secured 2 survivals with very limited funds and should he do so again this season,it will be 'Mission accomplished' as far as the owners are concerened whilst all of us have had to endure some dross this season,last night being the lowest of the low.Disgraceful. Edited by Willo (22 Jan 2020 2.22pm) Willo our throw ins really are a sore point with me everytime we get one it is just thrown down the line looking for a knock on rather than going to a player in space. It is not the fault of the thrown in taker as they have no option but to go down the line as nobody makes themselves available in space. Of course every other team seems to find a man in acres of space when playing against us. Just the small basics like this and losing possession easily really gets me hacked off.
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Ghostship

Norfolk 22 Jan 20 3.23pm

Originally posted by Willo

In terms of 'Throw-in' I recall early in the game, Kelly taking a thrw-in and it landed on the head of an opposition player who was unchallenged.I was one unimpressed hombre.

Apropos not shooting from distance, the QPR manager Mark Warburton forbids his players from shooting from over 22 yards from goal.

Finally, Roy Hodgson has secured 2 survivals with very limited funds and should he do so again this season,it will be 'Mission accomplished' as far as the owners are concerened whilst all of us have had to endure some dross this season,last night being the lowest of the low.Disgraceful.

Edited by Willo (22 Jan 2020 2.22pm)

Willo our throw ins really are a sore point with me everytime we get one it is just thrown down the line looking for a knock on rather than going to a player in space. It is not the fault of the thrown in taker as they have no option but to go down the line as nobody makes themselves available in space.

Of course every other team seems to find a man in acres of space when playing against us. Just the small basics like this and losing possession easily really gets me hacked off.

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Ghostship Norfolk 22 Jan 20 3.26pm
Originally posted by Ian-VI When we had Loftus-Cheek Roy used him as an attacking midfielder, and we were playing him with Cabaye, Andros, Wilf and a striker, and we produced some of the best attacking football we played recently (ex. 3-0 vs Leicester). If he has an attacking midfielder, he'd play him, but he hasn't got it. Unless you're trying to tell me that Meyer is at Loftus-Cheek level, because it's like comparing a Fiat Panda with a Porsche... I agree Meyer is not as good as RLC but at least give him half a dozen starts as an attacking midfielder and see how it goes rather than just the odd couple of starts he has had once in a while. Let's just try something different for once.
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Ghostship

Norfolk 22 Jan 20 3.26pm

Originally posted by Ian-VI

When we had Loftus-Cheek Roy used him as an attacking midfielder, and we were playing him with Cabaye, Andros, Wilf and a striker, and we produced some of the best attacking football we played recently (ex. 3-0 vs Leicester).
If he has an attacking midfielder, he'd play him, but he hasn't got it.
Unless you're trying to tell me that Meyer is at Loftus-Cheek level, because it's like comparing a Fiat Panda with a Porsche...

I agree Meyer is not as good as RLC but at least give him half a dozen starts as an attacking midfielder and see how it goes rather than just the odd couple of starts he has had once in a while. Let's just try something different for once.

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Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 22 Jan 20 3.41pm
Originally posted by Ghostship Willo our throw ins really are a sore point with me everytime we get one it is just thrown down the line looking for a knock on rather than going to a player in space. It is not the fault of the thrown in taker as they have no option but to go down the line as nobody makes themselves available in space. Of course every other team seems to find a man in acres of space when playing against us. Just the small basics like this and losing possession easily really gets me hacked off. Liverpool have a throw-in coach by the name of Thomas Gronnemark.
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Willo

South coast - west of Brighton. 22 Jan 20 3.41pm

Originally posted by Ghostship

Of course every other team seems to find a man in acres of space when playing against us. Just the small basics like this and losing possession easily really gets me hacked off.

Liverpool have a throw-in coach by the name of Thomas Gronnemark.

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Painter Croydon 22 Jan 20 3.46pm
Originally posted by Ghostship I agree Meyer is not as good as RLC but at least give him half a dozen starts as an attacking midfielder and see how it goes rather than just the odd couple of starts he has had once in a while. Let's just try something different for once. Meyer can’t play 90 minutes in the Premier, he hasn’t the strength or stamina, that’s his problem and I expect why Roy doesn’t start with him often, he tends to go missing.
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Painter

Croydon 22 Jan 20 3.46pm

Originally posted by Ghostship

Meyer can’t play 90 minutes in the Premier, he hasn’t the strength or stamina, that’s his problem and I expect why Roy doesn’t start with him often, he tends to go missing.

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doombear Too far from Selhurst Park 22 Jan 20 5.09pm
An interesting mix of recent comments on this thread. We brought in FdB to change the way we played but dumped him pretty quick when he tried to do that from the off. Unless: we can identify in advance the manager we want and he is willing to come AND the board are prepared to back him with the funds he'll need to change things, then be careful what you wish for. I'm not saying Roy is brilliant but he has kept us up thus far. I, too find our football turgid and uninspiring. I'm in the Glaziers part of the Main stand. The only home game I've missed is the Norwich game and so I am still waiting for Palace to score a goal down our end of the pitch. The way the team is set up, I'm not betting on that changing before the end of the season.
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doombear

Too far from Selhurst Park 22 Jan 20 5.09pm

An interesting mix of recent comments on this thread. We brought in FdB to change the way we played but dumped him pretty quick when he tried to do that from the off. Unless:
we can identify in advance the manager we want and
he is willing to come AND
the board are prepared to back him with the funds he'll need to change things,
then be careful what you wish for.
I'm not saying Roy is brilliant but he has kept us up thus far.
I, too find our football turgid and uninspiring. I'm in the Glaziers part of the Main stand. The only home game I've missed is the Norwich game and so I am still waiting for Palace to score a goal down our end of the pitch. The way the team is set up, I'm not betting on that changing before the end of the season.

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est1905 22 Jan 20 5.16pm
Originally posted by jeeagles Looking at all our results this year. I think we've been awful, but very lucky. We've had an extrodinaty amount of last minute goals and a fair few reds against us. The only convincing win we've had this season is Burnley away. Looking at our last 10 fixtures. Southampton (L) City (D) last min Arsenal (D) 10 men Derby (L) Norwich (D) last min Southampton (D) West Ham (W) last min Newcastle (L) Brighton (D) Watford (D) That's 9 points from a possible 27 and knocked out of the cup to a lower league team. Out of the teams in that list, only 1 is above 9th place. We havent scored first in any of those games, 4 of the points we won in the last minute and 1 against a side with 10 men. The more I look into this season the more frightening it seems. All this stacks up to the fact we have done incredibly well because of the one fact you decided not to mention, we have had massive injury problems throughout this period. At one point 11 first teamers out! For a few of the games you list there as few as 3 players would have played if everyone had been fit. Who thought we'd get anything at City? If you say yes I am sorry, I do not believe you. AMAZINGLY WELL!
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est1905

22 Jan 20 5.16pm

Originally posted by jeeagles

Looking at all our results this year. I think we've been awful, but very lucky.

We've had an extrodinaty amount of last minute goals and a fair few reds against us.

The only convincing win we've had this season is Burnley away.

Looking at our last 10 fixtures.

Southampton (L)
City (D) last min
Arsenal (D) 10 men
Derby (L)
Norwich (D) last min
Southampton (D)
West Ham (W) last min
Newcastle (L)
Brighton (D)
Watford (D)

That's 9 points from a possible 27 and knocked out of the cup to a lower league team. Out of the teams in that list, only 1 is above 9th place. We havent scored first in any of those games, 4 of the points we won in the last minute and 1 against a side with 10 men.

The more I look into this season the more frightening it seems.

All this stacks up to the fact we have done incredibly well because of the one fact you decided not to mention, we have had massive injury problems throughout this period. At one point 11 first teamers out!
For a few of the games you list there as few as 3 players would have played if everyone had been fit.
Who thought we'd get anything at City? If you say yes I am sorry, I do not believe you.
AMAZINGLY WELL!

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est1905 22 Jan 20 5.20pm
Originally posted by Rachid Rachid Rachid With the number of players who can travel with the ball injured and the imbalanced teams we’ve been fielding the surprise has been the number of points we’ve nicked over the last few weeks rather than result tonight. Kelly has looked vulnerable in recent weeks and my main criticism of Roy would be that he didn’t put Ward straight back in. I don’t think th3 ten points we need to stay up are a given and the owners need to sort their lives out and get some quicker players in who’ll bring some intensity and quality. Edited by Rachid Rachid Rachid (22 Jan 2020 12.23am) Kelly is not a full back. He is a centre half and if he cant play centre half he should stay on the bench. Last night proved this.
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est1905

22 Jan 20 5.20pm

Originally posted by Rachid Rachid Rachid

With the number of players who can travel with the ball injured and the imbalanced teams we’ve been fielding the surprise has been the number of points we’ve nicked over the last few weeks rather than result tonight.

Kelly has looked vulnerable in recent weeks and my main criticism of Roy would be that he didn’t put Ward straight back in.

I don’t think th3 ten points we need to stay up are a given and the owners need to sort their lives out and get some quicker players in who’ll bring some intensity and quality.

Edited by Rachid Rachid Rachid (22 Jan 2020 12.23am)

Kelly is not a full back. He is a centre half and if he cant play centre half he should stay on the bench. Last night proved this.

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est1905 22 Jan 20 5.22pm
Originally posted by Eaglecoops Our current league position flatters us beyond belief. Hopefully what will save us from relegation this year is three worse teams. However having said that, given that there aren’t three worse teams than us, perhaps three less lucky teams will save us. When you look at Villa Norwich, Burnley, Brighton, Watford, Southampton, Newcastle Bournemouth and West Ham I can’t find 3 teams worse than us and the worrying stat is that they are all starting to win matches. 38 points won’t be enough this year. 40 points is the minimum. My goodness you talk hysterical rubbish. Are you honestly saying that all of the teams you list above are better than us? Really? Whatever you tell yourself pal, the league table doesn't lie.
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est1905

22 Jan 20 5.22pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

Our current league position flatters us beyond belief. Hopefully what will save us from relegation this year is three worse teams. However having said that, given that there aren’t three worse teams than us, perhaps three less lucky teams will save us.

When you look at Villa Norwich, Burnley, Brighton, Watford, Southampton, Newcastle Bournemouth and West Ham I can’t find 3 teams worse than us and the worrying stat is that they are all starting to win matches. 38 points won’t be enough this year. 40 points is the minimum.

My goodness you talk hysterical rubbish. Are you honestly saying that all of the teams you list above are better than us? Really?
Whatever you tell yourself pal, the league table doesn't lie.

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est1905 22 Jan 20 5.23pm
Originally posted by Ian-VI With a much needed break that will rest the players who played basically 8 matches in a month, and with a few more players coming back from injury we'll be on 40 points by mid March. This
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est1905

22 Jan 20 5.23pm

Originally posted by Ian-VI

With a much needed break that will rest the players who played basically 8 matches in a month, and with a few more players coming back from injury we'll be on 40 points by mid March.

This

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est1905 22 Jan 20 5.28pm
Originally posted by PatrickA Ray Lewington said some months ago that Roy always plays the same way regardless of the opposition. The implication seemed to be that this simplified the game for the players and they had no excuses for not knowing their roles. Problem is that it also simplifies the game for the opposition and there is no danger of them being confused or surprised by our tactics. I’ve heard of the expression protecting a lead. Under Hodgson we seem to play to protect a 1-0 loss when we fall behind. Bizarre. Hmm, if you actually believe that ask yourself how come RH is still managing/coaching at the top level 40 years on from when he started. He gets results. Its laughable how when we do well on here its just luck and when we do badly its a big fat I told you so. Recruitment is an issue, our squad is getting old and the club is not keeping pace with that issue but this is a Parish/Freedman problem not a RH one.
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est1905

22 Jan 20 5.28pm

Originally posted by PatrickA

Ray Lewington said some months ago that Roy always plays the same way regardless of the opposition.
The implication seemed to be that this simplified the game for the players and they had no excuses for not knowing their roles.
Problem is that it also simplifies the game for the opposition and there is no danger of them being confused or surprised by our tactics.
I’ve heard of the expression protecting a lead.
Under Hodgson we seem to play to protect a 1-0 loss when we fall behind.
Bizarre.

Hmm, if you actually believe that ask yourself how come RH is still managing/coaching at the top level 40 years on from when he started. He gets results.
Its laughable how when we do well on here its just luck and when we do badly its a big fat I told you so.
Recruitment is an issue, our squad is getting old and the club is not keeping pace with that issue but this is a Parish/Freedman problem not a RH one.

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