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Jeremy Corbyn
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 matt_himself  Matataland 22 Sep 15 5.50pm |
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Quote DanH at 22 Sep 2015 5.44pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 5.40pm
Quote Sedlescombe at 22 Sep 2015 4.47pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 2.19pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 22 Sep 2015 1.34pm
I'd like to see public transport free at point of use, with a focus on reducing the demand for private automobile use etc, and recouping costs through taxation.
How much would your proposal cost? How much extra would people have to pay in tax in order for this to happen? How would you get people out of their cars and on to public transport? What is your source for the £70m?
Network Rails debts are 34 billion. Matter of public record. In 2004 then Chanceelor said that to renationalise rail it would cost 22 billion. Conservatively, add 20% for increase in asset base plus legal and admin fees and you come to 70 billion. Has that answered your question?
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Mapletree Croydon 22 Sep 15 6.42pm |
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If someone else posted something like that you would slaughter them Matthew
I don't get your logic. Why would renationalising cost the £34bn that is already a debt? Would it somehow crystalise the debt? Also, when talking about the cost of renationalising in 2004, I believe the Chancellor may have been including the cost of buying out existing franchises which is not the proposal here. Not saying I think it's either a good or a bad idea but let's at least be objective about the costs. Edited by Mapletree (22 Sep 2015 6.42pm)
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| matt_himself Matataland 22 Sep 15 6.56pm |
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Quote Mapletree at 22 Sep 2015 6.42pm
If someone else posted something like that you would slaughter them Matthew
I don't get your logic. Why would renationalising cost the £34bn that is already a debt? Would it somehow crystalise the debt? Also, when talking about the cost of renationalising in 2004, I believe the Chancellor may have been including the cost of buying out existing franchises which is not the proposal here. Not saying I think it's either a good or a bad idea but let's at least be objective about the costs. Edited by Mapletree (22 Sep 2015 6.42pm)
Taking into account the Network Rail liabilities, the cost of purchase and legal costs, conservatively the liabilities to the taxpayer would be 70 billion. The fact is that due to EU law, you cannot simply 'run down' the franchises and not re-tender. Read the article I posted in response to Sedlescombe. This is being objective. You may not like it but renationalising the railways is nigh on impossible from a legal and cost perspective unless someone can offer a costed view to the contrary rather than emotive posts about subsidies and train companies charging huge ticket costs as somehow a reason for renationalisation. Edited by matt_himself (22 Sep 2015 7.01pm)
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| Sedlescombe Sedlescombe 22 Sep 15 8.06pm |
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Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 5.40pm
Quote Sedlescombe at 22 Sep 2015 4.47pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 2.19pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 22 Sep 2015 1.34pm
I'd like to see public transport free at point of use, with a focus on reducing the demand for private automobile use etc, and recouping costs through taxation.
How much would your proposal cost? How much extra would people have to pay in tax in order for this to happen? How would you get people out of their cars and on to public transport? What is your source for the £70m?
Network Rails debts are 34 billion. Matter of public record. In 2004 then Chanceelor said that to renationalise rail it would cost 22 billion. Conservatively, add 20% for increase in asset base plus legal and admin fees and you come to 70 billion. Has that answered your question? yes you would have to service the ongoing debt bit that is not the came as saying it would cost that amount. That would come out of income
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| oldcodger 22 Sep 15 8.24pm |
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We subsidise the railway to the tune of 4-5bn a year as it is. Edited by oldcodger (22 Sep 2015 8.24pm)
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| Mapletree Croydon 23 Sep 15 8.50am |
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Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 6.56pm
Quote Mapletree at 22 Sep 2015 6.42pm
If someone else posted something like that you would slaughter them Matthew
I don't get your logic. Why would renationalising cost the £34bn that is already a debt? Would it somehow crystalise the debt? Also, when talking about the cost of renationalising in 2004, I believe the Chancellor may have been including the cost of buying out existing franchises which is not the proposal here. Not saying I think it's either a good or a bad idea but let's at least be objective about the costs. Edited by Mapletree (22 Sep 2015 6.42pm)
Taking into account the Network Rail liabilities, the cost of purchase and legal costs, conservatively the liabilities to the taxpayer would be 70 billion. The fact is that due to EU law, you cannot simply 'run down' the franchises and not re-tender. Read the article I posted in response to Sedlescombe. This is being objective. You may not like it but renationalising the railways is nigh on impossible from a legal and cost perspective unless someone can offer a costed view to the contrary rather than emotive posts about subsidies and train companies charging huge ticket costs as somehow a reason for renationalisation. Edited by matt_himself (22 Sep 2015 7.01pm)
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 23 Sep 15 9.14am |
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Quote Sedlescombe at 22 Sep 2015 8.06pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 5.40pm
Quote Sedlescombe at 22 Sep 2015 4.47pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 2.19pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 22 Sep 2015 1.34pm
I'd like to see public transport free at point of use, with a focus on reducing the demand for private automobile use etc, and recouping costs through taxation.
How much would your proposal cost? How much extra would people have to pay in tax in order for this to happen? How would you get people out of their cars and on to public transport? What is your source for the £70m?
Network Rails debts are 34 billion. Matter of public record. In 2004 then Chanceelor said that to renationalise rail it would cost 22 billion. Conservatively, add 20% for increase in asset base plus legal and admin fees and you come to 70 billion. Has that answered your question? yes you would have to service the ongoing debt bit that is not the came as saying it would cost that amount. That would come out of income Network Rail is already owned by the Government (if you've included that in your calculation). It has been since the collapse of railtrack. Plus you could also remove the 5bn or so in Public Subsidy.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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Kermit8  Hevon 23 Sep 15 9.25am |
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Wouldn't have to pay shareholder dividends or fat cat bonuses for failure either.
Big chest and massive boobs |
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| topcat Holmesdale / Surbiton 23 Sep 15 10.09am |
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Quote Kermit8 at 23 Sep 2015 9.25am
Wouldn't have to pay shareholder dividends or fat cat bonuses for failure either. Possibly. However whoever does run it is unlikely to do it for free.
It's 106 miles to Chicago, we got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark... and we're wearing sunglasses. |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 23 Sep 15 10.19am |
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Quote Kermit8 at 23 Sep 2015 9.25am
Wouldn't have to pay shareholder dividends or fat cat bonuses for failure either. I think it this case it would be Fat Controller bonuses.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| matt_himself Matataland 23 Sep 15 12.19pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 23 Sep 2015 9.14am
Quote Sedlescombe at 22 Sep 2015 8.06pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 5.40pm
Quote Sedlescombe at 22 Sep 2015 4.47pm
Quote matt_himself at 22 Sep 2015 2.19pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 22 Sep 2015 1.34pm
I'd like to see public transport free at point of use, with a focus on reducing the demand for private automobile use etc, and recouping costs through taxation.
How much would your proposal cost? How much extra would people have to pay in tax in order for this to happen? How would you get people out of their cars and on to public transport? What is your source for the £70m?
Network Rails debts are 34 billion. Matter of public record. In 2004 then Chanceelor said that to renationalise rail it would cost 22 billion. Conservatively, add 20% for increase in asset base plus legal and admin fees and you come to 70 billion. Has that answered your question? yes you would have to service the ongoing debt bit that is not the came as saying it would cost that amount. That would come out of income Network Rail is already owned by the Government (if you've included that in your calculation). It has been since the collapse of railtrack. Plus you could also remove the 5bn or so in Public Subsidy.
And what would happen the subsidy? The subsidy is appears to be largely used for maintenance and rail development so that money would still need to be spent.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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| matt_himself Matataland 23 Sep 15 12.21pm |
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Quote Kermit8 at 23 Sep 2015 9.25am
Wouldn't have to pay shareholder dividends or fat cat bonuses for failure either.
"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02 |
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