Catalonia

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Catalonia

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Stirlingsays 06 Oct 17 10.11am
Taken from a BBC article: 'The Spanish government refuses to hold negotiations on Catalonia's independence bid. The Catalan leaders say they want international mediation and have repeatedly urged the EU to get involved.' This is the wonderful EU that so many short sighted people defend and prefer to our own union. A union that gave Scotland a vote on independence and said that it would honour the result. Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Oct 2017 10.11am) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

06 Oct 17 10.11am

Taken from a BBC article:

'The Spanish government refuses to hold negotiations on Catalonia's independence bid. The Catalan leaders say they want international mediation and have repeatedly urged the EU to get involved.'

This is the wonderful EU that so many short sighted people defend and prefer to our own union. A union that gave Scotland a vote on independence and said that it would honour the result.

Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Oct 2017 10.11am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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legaleagle 06 Oct 17 10.50am
Which,in your haste to gratuitously bash the EU misses the point...the point being that the referendum in Scotland was in accordance with the constitution and thus lawful whereas the nationalists in Catalonia have proceeded unlawfully and ,through excellent spinning and heavy handed central government response,have spun themselves as the angels in the picture
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legaleagle

06 Oct 17 10.50am

Which,in your haste to gratuitously bash the EU misses the point...the point being that the referendum in Scotland was in accordance with the constitution and thus lawful whereas the nationalists in Catalonia have proceeded unlawfully and ,through excellent spinning and heavy handed central government response,have spun themselves as the angels in the picture

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Stirlingsays 06 Oct 17 11.00am
Originally posted by legaleagle Which,in your haste to gratuitously bash the EU misses the point...the point being that the referendum in Scotland was in accordance with the constitution and thus lawful whereas the nationalists in Catalonia have proceeded unlawfully and ,through excellent spinning and heavy handed central government response,have spun themselves as the angels in the picture The only difference between the UK and Spain in regards to 'in accordance with the constitution' is that the UK allowed negotiation and came to an agreement, whereas the Spanish government won't and haven't. The movement for independence is much larger in Catalonia than Scotland it seems and that's the real difference. Criticism of the EU is entirely justified and people should see your comments for what they are. A supporter of the EU even when its decisions make slaves of Greeks and deny democracy when it is inconvenient to their project. Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Oct 2017 12.30pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

06 Oct 17 11.00am

Originally posted by legaleagle

The only difference between the UK and Spain in regards to 'in accordance with the constitution' is that the UK allowed negotiation and came to an agreement, whereas the Spanish government won't and haven't.

The movement for independence is much larger in Catalonia than Scotland it seems and that's the real difference.

Criticism of the EU is entirely justified and people should see your comments for what they are. A supporter of the EU even when its decisions make slaves of Greeks and deny democracy when it is inconvenient to their project.

Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Oct 2017 12.30pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 06 Oct 17 11.24am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Taken from a BBC article: 'The Spanish government refuses to hold negotiations on Catalonia's independence bid. The Catalan leaders say they want international mediation and have repeatedly urged the EU to get involved.' This is the wonderful EU that so many short sighted people defend and prefer to our own union. A union that gave Scotland a vote on independence and said that it would honour the result. Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Oct 2017 10.11am) You want to leave the EU because you feel they get involved with our sovereignty, yet complain when the EU don't get involved with a sovereign matter. You'd have gorn mad had the EU got involved in the battle of Orgreave.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 06 Oct 17 11.24am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Taken from a BBC article:

'The Spanish government refuses to hold negotiations on Catalonia's independence bid. The Catalan leaders say they want international mediation and have repeatedly urged the EU to get involved.'

This is the wonderful EU that so many short sighted people defend and prefer to our own union. A union that gave Scotland a vote on independence and said that it would honour the result.

Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Oct 2017 10.11am)

You want to leave the EU because you feel they get involved with our sovereignty, yet complain when the EU don't get involved with a sovereign matter.

You'd have gorn mad had the EU got involved in the battle of Orgreave.

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Stirlingsays 06 Oct 17 11.47am
Originally posted by nickgusset You want to leave the EU because you feel they get involved with our sovereignty, yet complain when the EU don't get involved with a sovereign matter. You'd have gorn mad had the EU got involved in the battle of Orgreave. No Nick.....typical dissonance. I want to leave due to immigration and EU interference in our laws. I'm not supporting the EU controlling Spain (which they effectively do) and supporting repression of the democratic will. What you don't seem to understand Nick.....is that the EU are very much involved indeed. Never mind, go back to your fantasy land, where capitalism falls and socialism/communism rises and we are all so much the better for it. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

06 Oct 17 11.47am

Originally posted by nickgusset

You want to leave the EU because you feel they get involved with our sovereignty, yet complain when the EU don't get involved with a sovereign matter.

You'd have gorn mad had the EU got involved in the battle of Orgreave.

No Nick.....typical dissonance.

I want to leave due to immigration and EU interference in our laws.

I'm not supporting the EU controlling Spain (which they effectively do) and supporting repression of the democratic will.

What you don't seem to understand Nick.....is that the EU are very much involved indeed.

Never mind, go back to your fantasy land, where capitalism falls and socialism/communism rises and we are all so much the better for it.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 06 Oct 17 12.05pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays No Nick.....typical dissonance. I want to leave due to immigration and EU interference in our laws. I'm not supporting the EU controlling Spain (which they effectively do) and supporting repression of the democratic will. What you don't seem to understand Nick.....is that the EU are very much involved indeed and the are to blame for Francophiles gathering in fascist demonstrations in Madrid. Never mind, go back to your fantasy land, where neoliberal capitalism falls and socialism rises as a balance to keep capitalism in check and we are all so much the better for it. EFA
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 06 Oct 17 12.05pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

No Nick.....typical dissonance.

I want to leave due to immigration and EU interference in our laws.

I'm not supporting the EU controlling Spain (which they effectively do) and supporting repression of the democratic will.

What you don't seem to understand Nick.....is that the EU are very much involved indeed and the are to blame for Francophiles gathering in fascist demonstrations in Madrid.

Never mind, go back to your fantasy land, where neoliberal capitalism falls and socialism rises as a balance to keep capitalism in check and we are all so much the better for it.

EFA

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Stirlingsays 06 Oct 17 12.12pm
Originally posted by nickgusset EFA Your relationship with accuracy is as poor as your relationship with ethics. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

06 Oct 17 12.12pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

EFA

Your relationship with accuracy is as poor as your relationship with ethics.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 06 Oct 17 12.22pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Your relationship with accuracy is as poor as your relationship with ethics. Ethics? I'm from Kent.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 06 Oct 17 12.22pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Your relationship with accuracy is as poor as your relationship with ethics.

Ethics? I'm from Kent.

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Stirlingsays 06 Oct 17 12.29pm
Originally posted by nickgusset Ethics? I'm from Kent. After your earlier comment about your regrets in participating in what was actually the right thing to do. I really do honestly think we shouldn't interact. Reply to those who you have time for and I should do the same. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

06 Oct 17 12.29pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

Ethics? I'm from Kent.

After your earlier comment about your regrets in participating in what was actually the right thing to do. I really do honestly think we shouldn't interact.

Reply to those who you have time for and I should do the same.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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eaglelad 27 Oct 17 6.41pm
Wow, so Catalonia have announced Independence today but Spain have refused it! I remember there being Basque (North East Spain) separatists a few years ago wanting to break away, but have there been any Catalonian attacks over the years? Things are going to get Messi in Spain :/ (lame pun intended). Any Spanish/Catalan/Ex-Pat Palace fans there able to tell us the animosity/confusion amongst the people gente there? Are there fascist Spanish right wingers ready for war and are there Catalonians for or against this? Edited by eaglelad (27 Oct 2017 6.48pm)
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eaglelad

27 Oct 17 6.41pm

Wow, so Catalonia have announced Independence today but Spain have refused it!

I remember there being Basque (North East Spain) separatists a few years ago wanting to break away, but have there been any Catalonian attacks over the years?

Things are going to get Messi in Spain :/ (lame pun intended).

Any Spanish/Catalan/Ex-Pat Palace fans there able to tell us the animosity/confusion amongst the people gente there?

Are there fascist Spanish right wingers ready for war and are there Catalonians for or against this?

Edited by eaglelad (27 Oct 2017 6.48pm)

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rob1969 Banstead Surrey 27 Oct 17 7.12pm
Do not see how this 'independence' can work anymore than if Scotland declared UDI from the UK. They would be excluded from the EU - who both discourage and fear such nationalism. Likewise few nations with similar problematic minorities would recognise their independence. Spain certainly cannot afford to let this go unpunished so can expect a very strong reaction from Madrid which I fear will include yet more violence. Edited by rob1969 (27 Oct 2017 7.13pm)
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rob1969

Banstead Surrey 27 Oct 17 7.12pm

Do not see how this 'independence' can work anymore than if Scotland declared UDI from the UK.
They would be excluded from the EU - who both discourage and fear such nationalism. Likewise few nations with similar problematic minorities would recognise their independence.
Spain certainly cannot afford to let this go unpunished so can expect a very strong reaction from Madrid which I fear will include yet more violence.

Edited by rob1969 (27 Oct 2017 7.13pm)

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johnfirewall 31 Oct 17 12.06pm
Racists
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johnfirewall

31 Oct 17 12.06pm

Racists

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