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npn Flag Crowborough 22 May 14 12.24pm Send a Private Message to npn Add npn as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 12.21pm

Quote npn at 22 May 2014 12.16pm

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 11.54am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 11.42am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 8.38am

If the most significant concerns are 1. not supporting product safety standards and 2. not turning up enough to the European parliament, then why does every one keep banging on about them being racist?

Quote
Did I say they were the most significant?

No. You said they were "very significant".

What do you think then are the most significant concerns?


You said they were the most significant implying that was what I said.

My most significant concern? That people are being duped by a party that is to the right of the tories and have more neoliberal agenda than the 3 main parties.


In what way 'duped' Nick?
Is it not just that they are in the right place at the right time and have gained a bit of momentum due to the current frustrations of the populace?

Are they doing anything different from any of the other parties? Are they any less trustworthy (given that all the main three parties have been guilty of some pretty horrendous acts in very recent history, be that unfulfilled manifeso promises, dodgy expenses etc)


Duped in the way that they have come across as 'the man on the street' when in fact, through their barely mentioned ideals, they will be f***ing 'the man in the street.'


Ah, they may act like politicians, you mean?

 

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taylors lovechild Flag 22 May 14 12.27pm Send a Private Message to taylors lovechild Add taylors lovechild as a friend

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 11.44am

Quote taylors lovechild at 22 May 2014 11.07am

to use a football analogy, if you think of the EU as the Premier League and Britain as the mighty Palace then imagine what would happen if Palace decided they wanted to leave the Premier League membership but still play the games and be in the league. Would they still get their fair share of the TV money? Would they get to vote on decisions that affect the league?

Of course, there are many who stated they preferred it when Palace were in the Championship with less money, no chance of regenerating the stadium or improving facilites, etc.

I mean why shouldn't we get all the benefits of the league without having to be a member?

The reality is, the Premier League has its flaws, just as the EU has its flaws, but without it we are just a tiny voice that no one will listen to. There is strength in unity (see Palace) whereas blaming everyone else (Cardiff) will see us relegated to a footnote in the world.

Nice analogy, but the premise that being in the EU (Premiership) is a step up financially to not being in the EU (Championship) is very debatable.

What's the Scottish independence? The Johnson's Paint Trophy?

I'm not a nationalist/patriot and believe that which country you happen to drop out of your mother's v***** in should not limit your right to a job, a living wage and to feel safe and secure. I believe the EU is the best route to providing this for Europe as a whole.

On the plus side, if we got rid of all the migrant workers then Man City would be relegated and Palace would be in Europe...oh wait, "we" don't want to be in Europe?!!

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 22 May 14 12.27pm

Quote npn at 22 May 2014 12.24pm

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 12.21pm

Quote npn at 22 May 2014 12.16pm

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 11.54am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 11.42am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 8.38am

If the most significant concerns are 1. not supporting product safety standards and 2. not turning up enough to the European parliament, then why does every one keep banging on about them being racist?

Quote
Did I say they were the most significant?

No. You said they were "very significant".

What do you think then are the most significant concerns?


You said they were the most significant implying that was what I said.

My most significant concern? That people are being duped by a party that is to the right of the tories and have more neoliberal agenda than the 3 main parties.


In what way 'duped' Nick?
Is it not just that they are in the right place at the right time and have gained a bit of momentum due to the current frustrations of the populace?

Are they doing anything different from any of the other parties? Are they any less trustworthy (given that all the main three parties have been guilty of some pretty horrendous acts in very recent history, be that unfulfilled manifeso promises, dodgy expenses etc)


Duped in the way that they have come across as 'the man on the street' when in fact, through their barely mentioned ideals, they will be f***ing 'the man in the street.'


Ah, they may act like politicians, you mean?

You are right, but UKIP are not a single issue party.

Anyone who votes for a party that is keen to forge links with fascist parties on the continent is for me, a fascist by proxy.

 

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Cucking Funt Flag Clapham on the Back 22 May 14 12.31pm Send a Private Message to Cucking Funt Add Cucking Funt as a friend

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 12.27pm

Quote npn at 22 May 2014 12.24pm

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 12.21pm

Quote npn at 22 May 2014 12.16pm

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 11.54am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 11.42am

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 8.38am

If the most significant concerns are 1. not supporting product safety standards and 2. not turning up enough to the European parliament, then why does every one keep banging on about them being racist?

Quote
Did I say they were the most significant?

No. You said they were "very significant".

What do you think then are the most significant concerns?


You said they were the most significant implying that was what I said.

My most significant concern? That people are being duped by a party that is to the right of the tories and have more neoliberal agenda than the 3 main parties.


In what way 'duped' Nick?
Is it not just that they are in the right place at the right time and have gained a bit of momentum due to the current frustrations of the populace?

Are they doing anything different from any of the other parties? Are they any less trustworthy (given that all the main three parties have been guilty of some pretty horrendous acts in very recent history, be that unfulfilled manifeso promises, dodgy expenses etc)


Duped in the way that they have come across as 'the man on the street' when in fact, through their barely mentioned ideals, they will be f***ing 'the man in the street.'


Ah, they may act like politicians, you mean?

You are right, but UKIP are not a single issue party.

Anyone who votes for a party that is keen to forge links with fascist parties on the continent is for me, a fascist by proxy.


You say that like it's a bad thing.

 


Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 22 May 14 12.32pm

.

10409494_10152415482966100_3329941866555998449_n.jpg Attachment: 10409494_10152415482966100_3329941866555998449_n.jpg (39.19Kb)

 

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davenotamonkey Flag 22 May 14 1.12pm Send a Private Message to davenotamonkey Add davenotamonkey as a friend

Just in case you missed it, the REAL migration figures (excluding of course the black-market workers) have been published today.

Remember the indignation, outrage and general smugness that Farage had it all wrong? That lovely figure of "4000 leaving!! Lolz ukip, apologise!!" Well, that figure was based on the survey response of 5 people (not even joking: look for comments by David Reckless), but very handy for the establishment election campaign.

Now look at the real figures: national insurance number registrations in the past year. Even the guardian can barely spin it.

Half a million WORKERS incoming. Outgoing are of course not all workers, but include retirees, temporary seasonal workers etc.

Romanian registrations up to 47,000 per year, Bulgarian up to 18,000, Polish up to 108,000. Spain, with it's EU success story, now a huge source of immigration.

No other party (capable at this stage of securing an MEP) pledges to place limits on the quality and quantity of this flood. The 3 mainstream parties want your vote, but can and will do nothing about this.

This country needs to stop sticking it's fingers in it's ears, stamping the ground and screaming racist at every opportunity.

 

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nickgusset Flag Shizzlehurst 22 May 14 1.14pm

Quote davenotamonkey at 22 May 2014 1.12pm

Just in case you missed it, the REAL migration figures (excluding of course the black-market workers) have been published today.

Remember the indignation, outrage and general smugness that Farage had it all wrong? That lovely figure of "4000 leaving!! Lolz ukip, apologise!!" Well, that figure was based on the survey response of 5 people (not even joking: look for comments by David Reckless), but very handy for the establishment election campaign.

Now look at the real figures: national insurance number registrations in the past year. Even the guardian can barely spin it.

Half a million WORKERS incoming. Outgoing are of course not all workers, but include retirees, temporary seasonal workers etc.

Romanian registrations up to 47,000 per year, Bulgarian up to 18,000, Polish up to 108,000. Spain, with it's EU success story, now a huge source of immigration.

No other party (capable at this stage of securing an MEP) pledges to place limits on the quality and quantity of this flood. The 3 mainstream parties want your vote, but can and will do nothing about this.

This country needs to stop sticking it's fingers in it's ears, stamping the ground and screaming racist at every opportunity.


Then vote green. They're not xenophobic. Or neoliberals.

 

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pefwin Flag Where you have to have an English ... 22 May 14 1.29pm

Quote nickgusset at 22 May 2014 1.14pm

Quote davenotamonkey at 22 May 2014 1.12pm

Just in case you missed it, the REAL migration figures (excluding of course the black-market workers) have been published today.

Remember the indignation, outrage and general smugness that Farage had it all wrong? That lovely figure of "4000 leaving!! Lolz ukip, apologise!!" Well, that figure was based on the survey response of 5 people (not even joking: look for comments by David Reckless), but very handy for the establishment election campaign.

Now look at the real figures: national insurance number registrations in the past year. Even the guardian can barely spin it.

Half a million WORKERS incoming. Outgoing are of course not all workers, but include retirees, temporary seasonal workers etc.

Romanian registrations up to 47,000 per year, Bulgarian up to 18,000, Polish up to 108,000. Spain, with it's EU success story, now a huge source of immigration.

No other party (capable at this stage of securing an MEP) pledges to place limits on the quality and quantity of this flood. The 3 mainstream parties want your vote, but can and will do nothing about this.

This country needs to stop sticking it's fingers in it's ears, stamping the ground and screaming racist at every opportunity.


Then vote green. They're not xenophobic. Or neoliberals.

...but they aren't racist.

 


"Everything is air-droppable at least once."

"When the going gets tough, the tough call for close air support."

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Johnny Eagles Flag berlin 22 May 14 1.38pm Send a Private Message to Johnny Eagles Add Johnny Eagles as a friend

Quote taylors lovechild at 22 May 2014 12.27pm

I'm not a nationalist/patriot and believe that which country you happen to drop out of your mother's v***** in should not limit your right to a job, a living wage and to feel safe and secure. I believe the EU is the best route to providing this for Europe as a whole.

Why stop at Europe as a whole? If borders are so meaningless, why do they keep turning back those Africans who wash up on Lampedusa? Why shut out all the Russians, Turks and Egyptians who might fancy a slice of the safety and security and access to a living wage which you apparently think is a "right"? Why do only Europeans deserve such rights?

 


...we must expand...get more pupils...so that the knowledge will spread...

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serial thriller Flag The Promised Land 22 May 14 1.50pm Send a Private Message to serial thriller Add serial thriller as a friend

Quote davenotamonkey at 22 May 2014 1.12pm

Just in case you missed it, the REAL migration figures (excluding of course the black-market workers) have been published today.

Remember the indignation, outrage and general smugness that Farage had it all wrong? That lovely figure of "4000 leaving!! Lolz ukip, apologise!!" Well, that figure was based on the survey response of 5 people (not even joking: look for comments by David Reckless), but very handy for the establishment election campaign.

Now look at the real figures: national insurance number registrations in the past year. Even the guardian can barely spin it.

Half a million WORKERS incoming. Outgoing are of course not all workers, but include retirees, temporary seasonal workers etc.

Romanian registrations up to 47,000 per year, Bulgarian up to 18,000, Polish up to 108,000. Spain, with it's EU success story, now a huge source of immigration.

No other party (capable at this stage of securing an MEP) pledges to place limits on the quality and quantity of this flood. The 3 mainstream parties want your vote, but can and will do nothing about this.

This country needs to stop sticking it's fingers in it's ears, stamping the ground and screaming racist at every opportunity.

Really? Because according to this, net migration hasn't changed... [Link]

Honestly, your whole post reads like someone who would be paranoid of their own echo. 'Immigrants!!!!' 'The lies of the political elite!!!' I'm not even saying there isn't some truth in what you say, but pulling figures out of your arse (even the Torygraph claims it's 212000 incoming from the EU) and then doing the equivalent of s***ting yourself with fright makes it difficult to have the 'sensible debate' Farridge bangs on about.

People are currently at pains to point out that UKIP are no different to the political establishment but I actually disagree. They have more whiney fearmongerers than all the other parties combined and for that they deserve tremendous credit.

 


If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4

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taylors lovechild Flag 22 May 14 2.09pm Send a Private Message to taylors lovechild Add taylors lovechild as a friend

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 1.38pm

Quote taylors lovechild at 22 May 2014 12.27pm

I'm not a nationalist/patriot and believe that which country you happen to drop out of your mother's v***** in should not limit your right to a job, a living wage and to feel safe and secure. I believe the EU is the best route to providing this for Europe as a whole.

Why stop at Europe as a whole? If borders are so meaningless, why do they keep turning back those Africans who wash up on Lampedusa? Why shut out all the Russians, Turks and Egyptians who might fancy a slice of the safety and security and access to a living wage which you apparently think is a "right"? Why do only Europeans deserve such rights?

The thing is, for me, I do believe that everyone should have that right. Call me sentimental, but I actually care about other human beings. I'm also amazed at the strength of character that some of these migrant workers have shown in leaving their home country to earn a wage that many of us would not even consider taking a bus ride to.

 

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the_mcanuff_stuff Flag Caterham 22 May 14 2.28pm Send a Private Message to the_mcanuff_stuff Add the_mcanuff_stuff as a friend

Quote taylors lovechild at 22 May 2014 2.09pm

Quote Johnny Eagles at 22 May 2014 1.38pm

Quote taylors lovechild at 22 May 2014 12.27pm

I'm not a nationalist/patriot and believe that which country you happen to drop out of your mother's v***** in should not limit your right to a job, a living wage and to feel safe and secure. I believe the EU is the best route to providing this for Europe as a whole.

Why stop at Europe as a whole? If borders are so meaningless, why do they keep turning back those Africans who wash up on Lampedusa? Why shut out all the Russians, Turks and Egyptians who might fancy a slice of the safety and security and access to a living wage which you apparently think is a "right"? Why do only Europeans deserve such rights?

The thing is, for me, I do believe that everyone should have that right. Call me sentimental, but I actually care about other human beings. I'm also amazed at the strength of character that some of these migrant workers have shown in leaving their home country to earn a wage that many of us would not even consider taking a bus ride to.

I think it's very commendable. But it does mean that there's less to go around for everyone (so to speak) and is likely to very rapidly and significantly reduce the standard of living for those in the developed world. And that is just too unpalatable for the vast majority.

I'm all for the development of other countries. But it's only when they are more or less at the same level economically that you can think about relaxing borders. Otherwise you really would see a massive "flood" of immigration into the developed nation, with the problems of a) not having enough work for the new arrivals b) decimating the workforce in their home nations. It would be a disaster for poor and rich nations alike.

The only way you can hope to level the playing field is for the rich nations to help the poor to catch up. And not just in the good old strings-attached foreign "aid".

 

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