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 Kermit8  Hevon 24 Apr 17 3.10pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Technically the Nazi party weren't all that far right, and the situation was radically different. Usually the situation is that Far Right parties remain strong until they're elected, and then fail spectacularly. Best not to give them the chance. They can be pwopa nawty.
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jamiemartin721  Reading 24 Apr 17 3.24pm |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
Best not to give them the chance. They can be pwopa nawty. The BNP almost collapsed after its best ever national election, where it won numerous council seats. They completely failed to cope once they actually had to deliver on their popularism. The Nazi's were a bit different, as they effectively seized power, and had a virtual army to support them, many of whom had military experience - as well as a rather specific social and economic situation. Although democratically elected, the National Socialist Party required an effective coup to establish its power (and had spent a decade drumming up support for a revolutionary movement that including its own 'military force' - Which of course Germany itself lacked). Trying the same in France won't end well, firstly France has an effective military and police force, and has sufficient support in terms of NATO that any kind of far right uprising will likely be crushed.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| Kermit8 Hevon 24 Apr 17 3.32pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
The BNP almost collapsed after its best ever national election, where it won numerous council seats. They completely failed to cope once they actually had to deliver on their popularism. The Nazi's were a bit different, as they effectively seized power, and had a virtual army to support them, many of whom had military experience - as well as a rather specific social and economic situation. Although democratically elected, the National Socialist Party required an effective coup to establish its power (and had spent a decade drumming up support for a revolutionary movement that including its own 'military force' - Which of course Germany itself lacked). Trying the same in France won't end well, firstly France has an effective military and police force, and has sufficient support in terms of NATO that any kind of far right uprising will likely be crushed. The Nazis wee pretty much what they said on the tin from day one. The present breed of ultra-right politician like to camouflage themselves and well they do it too, when presenting. Seducing the 'normal' people. Not so much a grab for power but a slow, insidious, oozing into it. And once they are there? Rather not find out. 'Ok, that's the Muslim problem sorted. Who's next?'
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| Part Time James 24 Apr 17 3.45pm |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
The Nazis wee pretty much what they said on the tin from day one. The present breed of ultra-right politician like to camouflage themselves and well they do it too, when presenting. Seducing the 'normal' people. Not so much a grab for power but a slow, insidious, oozing into it. And once they are there? Rather not find out. 'Ok, that's the Muslim problem sorted. Who's next?' Smug Buddhists please
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| CambridgeEagle Sydenham 24 Apr 17 4.03pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Yeah but in the same way that the Queen appoints parliament. Its ceremonial, if the President refused to appoint a democratically elected French government and prime minister, it'd be the president that went... Queen has no say in policy. Macron is the leader of a political party and so if that party or a supportive coalition is in majority in Parliament the President will essentially be extremely influential, appoint the ministers and set the political agenda.
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 Hrolf The Ganger 24 Apr 17 4.07pm |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
The Nazis wee pretty much what they said on the tin from day one. The present breed of ultra-right politician like to camouflage themselves and well they do it too, when presenting. Seducing the 'normal' people. Not so much a grab for power but a slow, insidious, oozing into it. And once they are there? Rather not find out. 'Ok, that's the Muslim problem sorted. Who's next?' Your take on things is typically skewed. Meanwhile it is the anti fascist zealots who are clashing with police on the streets while the 'normal' people vote tactically to try and get what they want. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (24 Apr 2017 4.08pm)
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 24 Apr 17 4.15pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Your take on things is typically skewed. Meanwhile it is the anti fascist zealots who are clashing with police on the streets while the 'normal' people vote tactically to try and get what they want. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (24 Apr 2017 4.08pm) I don't think its necessarily a bad idea of be anti-fascist, in the same way its not a bad idea of be anti-communist. What does concern me is the tendency of anyone who is one or the other, using it as a justification for their own brand of oppressive politics. Fascism and Communism are political dead ends - very literally.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 24 Apr 17 4.26pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
I don't think its necessarily a bad idea of be anti-fascist, in the same way its not a bad idea of be anti-communist. What does concern me is the tendency of anyone who is one or the other, using it as a justification for their own brand of oppressive politics. Fascism and Communism are political dead ends - very literally. Agreed. They are self defeating in their pure form. What we have here is people reaching out for anyone who will fix what they see as the impending disaster that corporate orientated politicians are creating.
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| legaleagle 24 Apr 17 4.33pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Just as people reached out in the 1920's/30's for anyone who would fix what they sawas the impending disaster..only thing is/was,then as now,what they were being pedalled as the cause of impending disaster wasn't the actual cause... We can only hope Europe doesn't make the same mistake twice..
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 24 Apr 17 4.40pm |
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Originally posted by legaleagle
Just as people reached out in the 1920's/30's for anyone who would fix what they sawas the impending disaster..only thing is/was,then as now,what they were being pedalled as the cause of impending disaster wasn't the actual cause... We can only hope Europe doesn't make the same mistake twice.. Well in the 1920s, in Germany, it wasn't an impending disaster - The disaster was very much a present situation. The country was broker than broke, unemployment was the norm and the country had effectively collapsed. The 1929 Stock Market crash put paid to any positive signs of recovery, as well as eradicating any remaining faith in the existing political system to even begin to address the problem.
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| Hrolf The Ganger 24 Apr 17 5.12pm |
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Originally posted by legaleagle
Just as people reached out in the 1920's/30's for anyone who would fix what they sawas the impending disaster..only thing is/was,then as now,what they were being pedalled as the cause of impending disaster wasn't the actual cause... We can only hope Europe doesn't make the same mistake twice.. Would you stop with your Nazi obsession.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 24 Apr 17 5.17pm |
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Originally posted by Part Time James
Smug Buddhists please The sound of one hand clapping the smug off their c**ting faces.
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