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Donald Trump
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| Hoof Hearted 11 Dec 15 12.08pm | |
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Quote DanH at 11 Dec 2015 11.56am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.54am
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 11.49am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.41am
Clearly I disagee & we're never going to reach an agreement there I think, but what Trump says is just mental Hoof. IMO The current situation has nothing to do with religion & everything to do with politics. 'Therin lies your problem' is quite inflammatory btw Hoof. I don't think I have a problem.
I've just responded to being called a "thick cnut" on another thread and my dog growled at me as I disturbed his sleep earlier... but it aint gonna spoil me day innit!
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It did read as a teensy bit arrogant (they are opinions after all, not facts) but appreciate you didn't mean it that way & we don't have a proof reader 
 EverybodyDannsNow  SE19 11 Dec 15 12.12pm |
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Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 11.26am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.17am
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 10.52am
Quote Superfly at 10 Dec 2015 1.11pm
I'm sure most christians don't actually act out the below orders, but we'd best ban them from the UK. Just in case.
But read Ouzo Dan's post above about followers of Islam "religiously" following the Khoran's teachings as opposed to your average Christian that probably hasn't read half the Bible in his/her lifetime. Most likely he/she would know the Lords Prayer, a few parables, Psalm 23 and the 10 commandments. Your average Muslim knows the Khoran because they are tested on it by the Immams from the age of understanding. As I keep reminding everyone... it is a religion 500 years behind modern times and whereas other religions have moved on, more towards peace and harmony (ignoring ridiculous inflammatory stuff in their holy books) - Islam seems intent on a fight to the death to be top dog (god). Edited by Hoof Hearted (11 Dec 2015 10.55am)
Your fundarmental Muslim is of course a different story and I'm led to believe, Muslims have the upper hand in numbers there. But it's still a tiny tiny proportion that it renders it alomost insignificant. The hatred that's being spread against Muslims scares me far more than any Muslim threat.
Even Trump isn't saying hate the muslims... he is advocating a temporary halt to immigration of Muslims whilst their purpose is more clear to us. Those causing the problems are not tiny and not insignificant - they are a threat that should not be underestimated! They are prepared to die themselves for their mistaken beliefs.
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| Superfly The sun always shines in Catford 11 Dec 15 12.22pm |
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Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 12.08pm
Quote DanH at 11 Dec 2015 11.56am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.54am
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 11.49am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.41am
Clearly I disagee & we're never going to reach an agreement there I think, but what Trump says is just mental Hoof. IMO The current situation has nothing to do with religion & everything to do with politics. 'Therin lies your problem' is quite inflammatory btw Hoof. I don't think I have a problem.
I've just responded to being called a "thick cnut" on another thread and my dog growled at me as I disturbed his sleep earlier... but it aint gonna spoil me day innit!
Lend me a Tenor 31 May to 3 June 2017 John McIntosh Arts Centre with Superfly in the chorus |
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| Hoof Hearted 11 Dec 15 12.24pm | |
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Quote EverybodyDannsNow at 11 Dec 2015 12.12pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 11.26am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.17am
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 10.52am
Quote Superfly at 10 Dec 2015 1.11pm
I'm sure most christians don't actually act out the below orders, but we'd best ban them from the UK. Just in case.
But read Ouzo Dan's post above about followers of Islam "religiously" following the Khoran's teachings as opposed to your average Christian that probably hasn't read half the Bible in his/her lifetime. Most likely he/she would know the Lords Prayer, a few parables, Psalm 23 and the 10 commandments. Your average Muslim knows the Khoran because they are tested on it by the Immams from the age of understanding. As I keep reminding everyone... it is a religion 500 years behind modern times and whereas other religions have moved on, more towards peace and harmony (ignoring ridiculous inflammatory stuff in their holy books) - Islam seems intent on a fight to the death to be top dog (god). Edited by Hoof Hearted (11 Dec 2015 10.55am)
Your fundarmental Muslim is of course a different story and I'm led to believe, Muslims have the upper hand in numbers there. But it's still a tiny tiny proportion that it renders it alomost insignificant. The hatred that's being spread against Muslims scares me far more than any Muslim threat.
Even Trump isn't saying hate the muslims... he is advocating a temporary halt to immigration of Muslims whilst their purpose is more clear to us. Those causing the problems are not tiny and not insignificant - they are a threat that should not be underestimated! They are prepared to die themselves for their mistaken beliefs.
It might not be stated or universal but most faiths tend to want to convert everyone to their special faith as it is the best in their opinion. I've lost count of the number of times the JW's have tried. I accept that not all Muslims want to kill non believers, but whilst a significant number do wish just that, I can sympathise with Trump's caution regarding their immigration.
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| Hoof Hearted 11 Dec 15 12.26pm | |
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Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 12.22pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 12.08pm
Quote DanH at 11 Dec 2015 11.56am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.54am
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 11.49am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.41am
Clearly I disagee & we're never going to reach an agreement there I think, but what Trump says is just mental Hoof. IMO The current situation has nothing to do with religion & everything to do with politics. 'Therin lies your problem' is quite inflammatory btw Hoof. I don't think I have a problem.
I've just responded to being called a "thick cnut" on another thread and my dog growled at me as I disturbed his sleep earlier... but it aint gonna spoil me day innit!
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black eagle.  south croydon. 11 Dec 15 12.32pm |
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I hope trump is never allowed in to the UK
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| Hoof Hearted 11 Dec 15 12.37pm | |
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Quote black eagle. at 11 Dec 2015 12.32pm
I hope trump is never allowed in to the UK
Money talks! I don't like Trump much either, but he has the same freedom of speech as the rest of us do.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 11 Dec 15 1.13pm |
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Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 12.24pm
Quote EverybodyDannsNow at 11 Dec 2015 12.12pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 11.26am
Quote Superfly at 11 Dec 2015 11.17am
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 10.52am
Quote Superfly at 10 Dec 2015 1.11pm
I'm sure most christians don't actually act out the below orders, but we'd best ban them from the UK. Just in case.
But read Ouzo Dan's post above about followers of Islam "religiously" following the Khoran's teachings as opposed to your average Christian that probably hasn't read half the Bible in his/her lifetime. Most likely he/she would know the Lords Prayer, a few parables, Psalm 23 and the 10 commandments. Your average Muslim knows the Khoran because they are tested on it by the Immams from the age of understanding. As I keep reminding everyone... it is a religion 500 years behind modern times and whereas other religions have moved on, more towards peace and harmony (ignoring ridiculous inflammatory stuff in their holy books) - Islam seems intent on a fight to the death to be top dog (god). Edited by Hoof Hearted (11 Dec 2015 10.55am)
Your fundarmental Muslim is of course a different story and I'm led to believe, Muslims have the upper hand in numbers there. But it's still a tiny tiny proportion that it renders it alomost insignificant. The hatred that's being spread against Muslims scares me far more than any Muslim threat.
Even Trump isn't saying hate the muslims... he is advocating a temporary halt to immigration of Muslims whilst their purpose is more clear to us. Those causing the problems are not tiny and not insignificant - they are a threat that should not be underestimated! They are prepared to die themselves for their mistaken beliefs.
It might not be stated or universal but most faiths tend to want to convert everyone to their special faith as it is the best in their opinion. I've lost count of the number of times the JW's have tried. I accept that not all Muslims want to kill non believers, but whilst a significant number do wish just that, I can sympathise with Trump's caution regarding their immigration. Its only really Christianity and Islam that have a focus on conversion. Its certainly very big in Christianity. I don't think that number is actually significant at all, well not because they're unbelievers. I suspect that motives maybe as varied as they are for everyone else and are often less about being 'religious fanatics' and more mundane / pragmatic. The Sunni Insurgency in Iraq paid quite well, and there was a lot of out of work Sunni ex-Military around after the army was disbanded. That said I don't doubt that groups like IS would be attractive to sociopaths and the like, along with the disturbed as well. Few people actually join a cause because they want to kill people (or even kill heretics) - its surprisingly difficult to twist people into becoming 'serial killers'. I would imagine that most of those people leaving the UK to join IS, aren't thinking 'I'm going to murder a s**t load of apostates'.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| NickRobinson 11 Dec 15 1.39pm |
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Quote jamiemartin721 at 11 Dec 2015 9.31am
Quote NickRobinson at 10 Dec 2015 7.14pm
Quote jamiemartin721 at 10 Dec 2015 4.19pm
Quote Ouzo Dan at 10 Dec 2015 1.08pm
There are plenty of passages in the Quran that condone violence against believers and non believer's alike. All this talk of Islam being a religion of peace is of course bollocks & for people to insist otherwise are trying to cover some pretty sizeable cracks, it also doesnt help anyone. What is wrong with calling a spade a spade? Islam is a violent & aggressive religion, the text is there in the book. There isnt some kind of Quran 2 for ISIS, Boko Haram etc they read the same Quran as everyone else, they read the damn thing day & night over & over again & I would absolutely guarantee they know the text alot better than anyone claiming you aint no muslim bruv. Hundreds of thousands if not millions of muslims (many being highly educated doctors, engineers, mechanics etc) support the creation of the caliphate, that makes them just as complicit as those who commit the murders. I do actually have some sympathy for Trump, there was no outrage when Iranians were banned in the US & its not really any different to Eastern euro countries saying they will only take Christian refugees. I don't necessarily think the idea of a caliphate is necessarily wrong, it doesn't automatically follow that a caliphate is the same as supporting IS view of the caliphate. Of course I think its a load of old bollocks, but I'm neither a resident of the middle east nor a Muslim. My concern would be with seeing ISIS as a caliphate or anykind of legitimate regime. I'm a Marxist, pretty much, and on some level believe in the ideals of Marxism, but not at the price and cost incurred by Lennin, Mao or Pol Pot. So you reject one load of old bollocks yet embrace another. The likes of Lenin, Mao and Pol Pot are inevitable products of Marxism. Marxism is also an inevitable product of capitalism, as its a dialectic criticism of the excess of capitalism. But I'd point to the same issue with religion, the problem isn't actually Marxism and Marxist theory, but when people try to co-opt it towards their own goals as a means of controlling people and as a single source of truth. The important thing of anything isn't that its true, but what you can learn about the world from what others have written and observed. Lenin and Mao, for me, betrayed Marxism almost immediately by targeting the population for the own goals, rather than the collective needs of the people. Any cause where you're effectively murdering people you are supposed to represent is a historical dead end. The work of Marx and Engels on the plight of the working classes of their era are very valid observations of inequality and suppression by the means of capital, and a consequence of that is also the Labour and Trade Union movements. Lenin, Mao, Stalin, Pol Pot (like all Marxists) in their delusional, wishful thinking way, believed they were building Utopia. They no doubt truly believed that the mass murders, slave labour camps and general repression were necessary before they could usher in Utopia - when the state would wither away and everyone would be nice to one another etc, etc (you are no doubt more familiar than me with the details of socialist utopias).
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Seth  On a pale blue dot 11 Dec 15 2.07pm |
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Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 12.37pm
Quote black eagle. at 11 Dec 2015 12.32pm
I hope trump is never allowed in to the UK
Money talks! I don't like Trump much either, but he has the same freedom of speech as the rest of us do.
"You can feel the stadium jumping. The stadium is actually physically moving up and down" |
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nairb75  Baltimore 11 Dec 15 2.30pm |
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Quote Seth at 10 Dec 2015 2.07pm
Number of Americans killed by Islamist terrorists since 2001: 3,380 Number of Americans killed by legal guns since 2001: 406,496 Source: [Link] So why is Chump's focus on banning Muslims and not banning legally held guns I wonder, bearing in mind which is the greater threat to American lives? b/c it's real fun to shoot guns. gives you a big b)ner. makes you feel like a man when you're at the bottom rung of society. trump's real motivation has become a mystery. at first, it was seen as a true sideshow. he was having fun with froth-mouthed buffoons who just want the US to go back to some mythical place where white people own and run everything, and everyone, and treat everyone really nice. trump IS a political clown. you can agree with him if you'd like but nothing he says is actually practical, doable, or usually unconstitutiional. so i don't know what he truly wants but i do not believe it to be a sideshow any longer. i think he actually believes what he's saying. trump has always been an a$$ but he's also not lied about his feelings. and he's in his 70's so i don't think he's changing his stripes. could be wrong. we'll find out in about 9 months for sure.
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| Stuk Top half 11 Dec 15 2.37pm |
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Quote Seth at 11 Dec 2015 2.07pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 11 Dec 2015 12.37pm
Quote black eagle. at 11 Dec 2015 12.32pm
I hope trump is never allowed in to the UK
Money talks! I don't like Trump much either, but he has the same freedom of speech as the rest of us do.
RGU in Aberdeen I think it was? You can bet your arse they'll be sticking those wind turbines next to his golf course now, that he's been complaining about for years. Now which idiotic party/politician made him an business ambassador in the first place...
Optimistic as ever |
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