Bias against Trump

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Bias against Trump

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Stirlingsays 03 Dec 17 5.33am
Originally posted by wordup It's a pedantic 'equality' point which makes an unnecessary attempt of stating that since you are a progressive lefty and dare to call Trump 'stupid' it's basically akin to using the n word against a black person because both aspects are 'mainly set'. Trump's stupidity is willful ignorance. And by the way, people have a responsibility to treat people of all colours and creeds with decency and dignity no matter whether they are 'progressive' or not. Trump fails to do that and he does act in ways that are 'stupid'. He's the president of the United States. It's a position that involves making very serious decisions that impact the lives of millions of people, so it shouldn't be taboo to have concerns of whether he's mentally capable of performing that job. Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 3.08am) Well, it's a criticism on hypocrisy or ignorance within the philosophy of progressivism as I see it. Essentially value judgements on someone's intelligence are as misplaced as value judgements on many genetically set aspects of an individual. I'm criticising as an opponent of progressivism...and holding it to its own standards. Kermit probably thinks I was just getting at him and so hides in possible mock ignorance but in actuality I'm more making the wider point. As to your point on how we should treat others. I agree up to a point. Civility is a social construct that allows society to operate much more smoothly than its alternatives.....diplomacy is a better social skill than rudeness for an obvious example. However, it is very important for a free society that the differences between individuals are allowed full expression. Mockery, sarcasm, humour, rudeness and insult are all apart of that contexual freedom. So Kermit...in my estimation can call anyone what he likes and thusly I can call him ignorant or a hypocrite for doing so. Interestingly you make a lot of value judgements about the presidentual position. Now, I'd agree with most of those. However, it's plain to see that Trump is capable of carrying out most of his actual duties as POTUS and that this criticism is much more a reaction to the way he does it rather than his capacity. People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Dec 17 5.33am

Originally posted by wordup

It's a pedantic 'equality' point which makes an unnecessary attempt of stating that since you are a progressive lefty and dare to call Trump 'stupid' it's basically akin to using the n word against a black person because both aspects are 'mainly set'.

Trump's stupidity is willful ignorance. And by the way, people have a responsibility to treat people of all colours and creeds with decency and dignity no matter whether they are 'progressive' or not. Trump fails to do that and he does act in ways that are 'stupid'. He's the president of the United States. It's a position that involves making very serious decisions that impact the lives of millions of people, so it shouldn't be taboo to have concerns of whether he's mentally capable of performing that job.

Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 3.08am)

Well, it's a criticism on hypocrisy or ignorance within the philosophy of progressivism as I see it. Essentially value judgements on someone's intelligence are as misplaced as value judgements on many genetically set aspects of an individual.

I'm criticising as an opponent of progressivism...and holding it to its own standards. Kermit probably thinks I was just getting at him and so hides in possible mock ignorance but in actuality I'm more making the wider point.

As to your point on how we should treat others. I agree up to a point. Civility is a social construct that allows society to operate much more smoothly than its alternatives.....diplomacy is a better social skill than rudeness for an obvious example.

However, it is very important for a free society that the differences between individuals are allowed full expression. Mockery, sarcasm, humour, rudeness and insult are all apart of that contexual freedom. So Kermit...in my estimation can call anyone what he likes and thusly I can call him ignorant or a hypocrite for doing so.

Interestingly you make a lot of value judgements about the presidentual position. Now, I'd agree with most of those. However, it's plain to see that Trump is capable of carrying out most of his actual duties as POTUS and that this criticism is much more a reaction to the way he does it rather than his capacity.

People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 03 Dec 17 6.29am
Back to topic, Media bias against Trump. Fake News from ABC News! Brian Ross, the chief investigative correspondent for ABC News, has been suspended after incorrectly reporting that Michael Flynn, the former national security adviser, would testify that Trump had directed him to make contact with Russian officials while Trump was still a candidate. [Link]
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 03 Dec 17 6.29am

Back to topic, Media bias against Trump. Fake News from ABC News!

Brian Ross, the chief investigative correspondent for ABC News, has been suspended after incorrectly reporting that Michael Flynn, the former national security adviser, would testify that Trump had directed him to make contact with Russian officials while Trump was still a candidate.

[Link]

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Rubin 03 Dec 17 7.32am
A good video to watch on the retweet subject: [Link] I'd be interested in a rebuttal from Kermit or wordup etc.
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Rubin

03 Dec 17 7.32am

A good video to watch on the retweet subject:

[Link]

I'd be interested in a rebuttal from Kermit or wordup etc.

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Kermit8 Hevon 03 Dec 17 9.09am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Well, it's a criticism on hypocrisy or ignorance within the philosophy of progressivism as I see it. Essentially value judgements on someone's intelligence are as misplaced as value judgements on many genetically set aspects of an individual. I'm criticising as an opponent of progressivism...and holding it to its own standards. Kermit probably thinks I was just getting at him and so hides in possible mock ignorance but in actuality I'm more making the wider point. As to your point on how we should treat others. I agree up to a point. Civility is a social construct that allows society to operate much more smoothly than its alternatives.....diplomacy is a better social skill than rudeness for an obvious example. However, it is very important for a free society that the differences between individuals are allowed full expression. Mockery, sarcasm, humour, rudeness and insult are all apart of that contexual freedom. So Kermit...in my estimation can call anyone what he likes and thusly I can call him ignorant or a hypocrite for doing so. Interestingly you make a lot of value judgements about the presidentual position. Now, I'd agree with most of those. However, it's plain to see that Trump is capable of carrying out most of his actual duties as POTUS and that this criticism is much more a reaction to the way he does it rather than his capacity. People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another. That's clearer. Ta. However, one fundamental aspect you ignored before going off on one v 'progressives' is that if a judgement is framed, in a context where it can clearly be comparable which I what I did by mentioning political leaders only, then how can it be ignorant/hypocritical? It's no different to one team getting 200 points on University Challenge and the other team getting 40 - both Cambridge Colleges - and saying the latter, in this context, are not as clever as the former. It's palpably true. Trump is a thicko compared to the cerebral standards of the usual Western world leader. That is also clearly true. However, he might be very intelligent within other areas. One more thing - if anyone is not as ultra- right wing as you it doesn't mean by default they are your 'progressive enemy' . Well that is unless you would like a fascistic totalitarian undemocratic regime running the country. Real Hypocrisy to me, not your made up sort, is Islamic reformists talking the talk but refusing to condemn UK relations with, and indeed pandering to, Saudi Arabia. The biggest exporters of ultra-conservative fundamentalism from which the extremist killer sects branch out. You know being able to say something more than 'Saudi is a problem' in a Trumpesque manner. Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 03 Dec 17 9.09am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another.

That's clearer. Ta. However, one fundamental aspect you ignored before going off on one v 'progressives' is that if a judgement is framed, in a context where it can clearly be comparable which I what I did by mentioning political leaders only, then how can it be ignorant/hypocritical?

It's no different to one team getting 200 points on University Challenge and the other team getting 40 - both Cambridge Colleges - and saying the latter, in this context, are not as clever as the former. It's palpably true.

Trump is a thicko compared to the cerebral standards of the usual Western world leader. That is also clearly true. However, he might be very intelligent within other areas.

One more thing - if anyone is not as ultra- right wing as you it doesn't mean by default they are your 'progressive enemy' . Well that is unless you would like a fascistic totalitarian undemocratic regime running the country.

Real Hypocrisy to me, not your made up sort, is Islamic reformists talking the talk but refusing to condemn UK relations with, and indeed pandering to, Saudi Arabia. The biggest exporters of ultra-conservative fundamentalism from which the extremist killer sects branch out. You know being able to say something more than 'Saudi is a problem' in a Trumpesque manner.

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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wordup 03 Dec 17 9.21am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Well, it's a criticism on hypocrisy or ignorance within the philosophy of progressivism as I see it. Essentially value judgements on someone's intelligence are as misplaced as value judgements on many genetically set aspects of an individual. I'm criticising as an opponent of progressivism...and holding it to its own standards. Kermit probably thinks I was just getting at him and so hides in possible mock ignorance but in actuality I'm more making the wider point. As to your point on how we should treat others. I agree up to a point. Civility is a social construct that allows society to operate much more smoothly than its alternatives.....diplomacy is a better social skill than rudeness for an obvious example. However, it is very important for a free society that the differences between individuals are allowed full expression. Mockery, sarcasm, humour, rudeness and insult are all apart of that contexual freedom. So Kermit...in my estimation can call anyone what he likes and thusly I can call him ignorant or a hypocrite for doing so. Interestingly you make a lot of value judgements about the presidentual position. Now, I'd agree with most of those. However, it's plain to see that Trump is capable of carrying out most of his actual duties as POTUS and that this criticism is much more a reaction to the way he does it rather than his capacity. People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another. And in contrast, you yourself repeatedly mock peoples 'stupidity', and are enamored with or give a free pass to individuals and groups who go out of their way to attack categories of people you convince yourself are treated as special by your opponents. You have turned yourself into a mirror image of what you hate. But that's your choice. As for the president being capable of carrying out his duties, I'm honestly not sure about that one either way. He's certainly very hard work for those around him let's put it that way. Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 9.30am)
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wordup

03 Dec 17 9.21am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Interestingly you make a lot of value judgements about the presidentual position. Now, I'd agree with most of those. However, it's plain to see that Trump is capable of carrying out most of his actual duties as POTUS and that this criticism is much more a reaction to the way he does it rather than his capacity.

People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another.

And in contrast, you yourself repeatedly mock peoples 'stupidity', and are enamored with or give a free pass to individuals and groups who go out of their way to attack categories of people you convince yourself are treated as special by your opponents. You have turned yourself into a mirror image of what you hate. But that's your choice.

As for the president being capable of carrying out his duties, I'm honestly not sure about that one either way. He's certainly very hard work for those around him let's put it that way.

Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 9.30am)

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wordup 03 Dec 17 9.34am
Mueller Removed Top Agent in Russia Inquiry Over Possible Anti-Trump Texts - [Link] A serious investigation led by a principled man.
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wordup

03 Dec 17 9.34am

Mueller Removed Top Agent in Russia Inquiry Over Possible Anti-Trump Texts - [Link]

A serious investigation led by a principled man.

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jamiemartin721 Reading 03 Dec 17 9.35am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Well, it's a criticism on hypocrisy or ignorance within the philosophy of progressivism as I see it. Essentially value judgements on someone's intelligence are as misplaced as value judgements on many genetically set aspects of an individual. I'm criticising as an opponent of progressivism...and holding it to its own standards. Kermit probably thinks I was just getting at him and so hides in possible mock ignorance but in actuality I'm more making the wider point. As to your point on how we should treat others. I agree up to a point. Civility is a social construct that allows society to operate much more smoothly than its alternatives.....diplomacy is a better social skill than rudeness for an obvious example. However, it is very important for a free society that the differences between individuals are allowed full expression. Mockery, sarcasm, humour, rudeness and insult are all apart of that contexual freedom. So Kermit...in my estimation can call anyone what he likes and thusly I can call him ignorant or a hypocrite for doing so. Interestingly you make a lot of value judgements about the presidentual position. Now, I'd agree with most of those. However, it's plain to see that Trump is capable of carrying out most of his actual duties as POTUS and that this criticism is much more a reaction to the way he does it rather than his capacity. People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another. I don't think there is anything wrong with being stupid per se, although I don't believe its fixed either - your capacity to learn exceeds the limitations of physiology. I do think however there is something wrong when very stupid people are being elected to be leaders of nations. Intelligence isn't fixed by genetics, its not really an inherent thing, but something defined by how you develop your cognitive and educational ability. Genetics probably play a role, but probably more to define the limits - Much like in sport. Not everyone can be a world class athlete, but almost everyone is capable of becoming athletic (you might not become a professional footballer, but you can become someone who is good at football, by training and playing). "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 03 Dec 17 9.35am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

People get what they vote for, that's a very important principle and not everyone cares enough for 'what is proper behaviour' to vote for one undesirable over another.

I don't think there is anything wrong with being stupid per se, although I don't believe its fixed either - your capacity to learn exceeds the limitations of physiology. I do think however there is something wrong when very stupid people are being elected to be leaders of nations.

Intelligence isn't fixed by genetics, its not really an inherent thing, but something defined by how you develop your cognitive and educational ability. Genetics probably play a role, but probably more to define the limits - Much like in sport. Not everyone can be a world class athlete, but almost everyone is capable of becoming athletic (you might not become a professional footballer, but you can become someone who is good at football, by training and playing).

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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Stirlingsays 03 Dec 17 11.48am
Originally posted by wordup And in contrast, you yourself repeatedly mock peoples 'stupidity', and are enamored with or give a free pass to individuals and groups who go out of their way to attack categories of people you convince yourself are treated as special by your opponents. You have turned yourself into a mirror image of what you hate. But that's your choice. As for the president being capable of carrying out his duties, I'm honestly not sure about that one either way. He's certainly very hard work for those around him let's put it that way. Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 9.30am) Some of that criticism might have some relevance if I presented myself as a progressive or a person from the left. There are underlying truths in their philosophies but I don't believe in their 'standards' and 'protections' as healthy for society and so I mock their inconsistencies and logical weaknessness. Intelligence is important in society as any successful one requires the use of meritocracy to place the most competent people in the best positions. Clearly there's been an amusing shift with Trump in terms of the very best but he's an exception rather the norm....and he isn't that thick....so sorry but not being intellectual and well spoken doesn't make you thick. Unlike Jamie seems to believe I and rather a lot of the scientific data tends to believe that a lot of.....what we refer to intelligence is 'fixed' biologically at a ceiling we cna't move beyond.....that doesn't mean that we start at that ceiling....we have to work towards it....like I said, you have a potential best sprint time..will you ever reach it? Probably not..same with your intelligence in all its different areas. While I do mock people I don't actually blame anyone for their level of intelligence.....It certainly has no bearing on how pleasant or ethical a fellow they are. Some of the most intelligent people are the cause of the worst problems. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Dec 17 11.48am

Originally posted by wordup

As for the president being capable of carrying out his duties, I'm honestly not sure about that one either way. He's certainly very hard work for those around him let's put it that way.

Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 9.30am)

Some of that criticism might have some relevance if I presented myself as a progressive or a person from the left. There are underlying truths in their philosophies but I don't believe in their 'standards' and 'protections' as healthy for society and so I mock their inconsistencies and logical weaknessness.

Intelligence is important in society as any successful one requires the use of meritocracy to place the most competent people in the best positions. Clearly there's been an amusing shift with Trump in terms of the very best but he's an exception rather the norm....and he isn't that thick....so sorry but not being intellectual and well spoken doesn't make you thick.

Unlike Jamie seems to believe I and rather a lot of the scientific data tends to believe that a lot of.....what we refer to intelligence is 'fixed' biologically at a ceiling we cna't move beyond.....that doesn't mean that we start at that ceiling....we have to work towards it....like I said, you have a potential best sprint time..will you ever reach it? Probably not..same with your intelligence in all its different areas.

While I do mock people I don't actually blame anyone for their level of intelligence.....It certainly has no bearing on how pleasant or ethical a fellow they are. Some of the most intelligent people are the cause of the worst problems.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 03 Dec 17 12.07pm
I'm away for a couple of days on business and so won't be able to reply to Jamie's interesting post on intelligence potential not being set. Catch you guys later. Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Dec 2017 12.07pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

03 Dec 17 12.07pm

I'm away for a couple of days on business and so won't be able to reply to Jamie's interesting post on intelligence potential not being set. Catch you guys later.

Edited by Stirlingsays (03 Dec 2017 12.07pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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wordup 03 Dec 17 12.16pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Some of that criticism might have some relevance if I presented myself as a progressive or a person from the left. There are underlying truths in their philosophies but I don't believe in their 'standards' and 'protections' as healthy for society and so I mock their inconsistencies and logical weaknessness. Intelligence is important in society as any successful one requires the use of meritocracy to place the most competent people in the best positions. Clearly there's been an amusing shift with Trump in terms of the very best but he's an exception rather the norm....and he isn't that thick....so sorry but not being intellectual and well spoken doesn't make you thick. Unlike Jamie seems to believe I and rather a lot of the scientific data tends to believe that a lot of.....what we refer to intelligence is 'fixed' biologically at a ceiling we cna't move beyond.....that doesn't mean that we start at that ceiling....we have to work towards it....like I said, you have a potential best sprint time..will you ever reach it? Probably not..same with your intelligence in all its different areas. While I do mock people I don't actually blame anyone for their level of intelligence.....It certainly has no bearing on how pleasant or ethical a fellow they are. Some of the most intelligent people are the cause of the worst problems. I'm saying that as a reaction to your hatred of what you see as 'progressives', you flip in completely the opposite direction and are, shall we say, routinely unmoved when individuals and groups target minorities. Significantly less empathetic towards certain groups, which of course is how you view progressives so who is better or worse? That's what this panic over American Antifa and BLM but lack of concern over white nationalists and 'oh who are they then, i really wouldn't know' about Britain First here at home is all about. Dog whistle faux 'say it like it is' populist election strategies like Trump's are every bit as real and nauseating as virtue signaling. They are two sides of the same coin and a back of a fag packet way to get easy allegiance from elements of the electorate susceptible to that type of messaging. Trump has bought a decent chunk of his support for pennies in the pound with his s***ty behaviour. Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 12.49pm)
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wordup

03 Dec 17 12.16pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Some of that criticism might have some relevance if I presented myself as a progressive or a person from the left. There are underlying truths in their philosophies but I don't believe in their 'standards' and 'protections' as healthy for society and so I mock their inconsistencies and logical weaknessness.

I'm saying that as a reaction to your hatred of what you see as 'progressives', you flip in completely the opposite direction and are, shall we say, routinely unmoved when individuals and groups target minorities. Significantly less empathetic towards certain groups, which of course is how you view progressives so who is better or worse? That's what this panic over American Antifa and BLM but lack of concern over white nationalists and 'oh who are they then, i really wouldn't know' about Britain First here at home is all about.

Dog whistle faux 'say it like it is' populist election strategies like Trump's are every bit as real and nauseating as virtue signaling. They are two sides of the same coin and a back of a fag packet way to get easy allegiance from elements of the electorate susceptible to that type of messaging. Trump has bought a decent chunk of his support for pennies in the pound with his s***ty behaviour.

Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 12.49pm)

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wordup 03 Dec 17 12.32pm
I'm not really a betting man but it will be interesting to keep an eye on the odds. Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 1.23pm) Attachment: peachy.JPG (28.98Kb)
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wordup

03 Dec 17 12.32pm

I'm not really a betting man but it will be interesting to keep an eye on the odds.

Edited by wordup (03 Dec 2017 1.23pm)

Attachment: peachy.JPG (28.98Kb)