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JohnyBoy 29 Apr 16 12.48pm | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Johnny.... you are too pessimistic about the future post Brexit.... "You can talk" I hear you say about life if the EU referendum vote is to remain.... but remember life went on much the same as it did before the EU was created. I'm nearly 62 now and have enjoyed holidays in Ireland, France, Italy, Spain, Czech Republic etc and were it not for my Parkinson's and Arthritic knees I have no doubts that travel to those same places would still be possible post Brexit. So what if we have to show a passport and get a visa. So will the terrorists and bogus refugees/economic migrants. THe Yes vote (that I even voted for in 1975) was for a common market involving a handful of roughly equal nations with prosperous economies NOT a fully federal ever expanding EU state, with the UK subsidising poorer nations, and allowing their disgruntled citizens to migrate here taking up limited housing, jobs and our NHS system without contributing a fair price for it. Everything comes with a price... yes Brexit may mean temporary economic turmoil, but remaining in the EU will finally cripple our infrastructure which is groaning now under the weight of over population. You are correct that you would be able to travel to those destinations in event of Brexit but you would not be able to work - reducing life opportunities for us and more importantly the next generation.
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npn Crowborough 29 Apr 16 1.02pm | |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
You are correct that you would be able to travel to those destinations in event of Brexit but you would not be able to work - reducing life opportunities for us and more importantly the next generation. Not really true - sure you'd have to jump through more hoops and wouldn't be automatically allowed, but I know lots of people who spent gap years etc working in Australia, New Zealand, and other places. I have friends now who live and work in Singapore, Hong Kong, Africa (various countries). The only thing which would change is that you'd have to do some paperwork first
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Hoof Hearted 29 Apr 16 1.21pm | |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
You are correct that you would be able to travel to those destinations in event of Brexit but you would not be able to work - reducing life opportunities for us and more importantly the next generation. You've concentrated on the economic angle again Johnny whereas I meant the practical experiences.... If you were able to talk to people from Lincolnshire, they would tell you how immigration has blighted their daily lives due to over population. Fruit and Veg picking in the fields of the fens was a seasonal thing, but now the EU laws mean foreign labour is allowed to live here 24/7, so eastern european folk have permanently settled in places like Boston and Lincoln and taken over those towns. The indigenous population (now very much in the minority and trapped there by falling house prices compared to more lucrative/salubrious areas to live) cannot get to see a GP for weeks, get their kids in a local school and have seen their high streets turned into Polish Deli's, betting shops and massage parlours. Their grown up children cannot leave home because they cannot get a job that pays enough for the rent and living expenses... let alone find a house to buy for themselves. So yes... I am blaming Johnny Foreigner (your words not mine) as these hardships are keenly felt by the residents of Lincolnshire and are definitely as a direct result of immigration. What have you to say to them to persuade them that remaining in the EU is a good idea?
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JohnyBoy 29 Apr 16 1.21pm | |
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Originally posted by npn
Not really true - sure you'd have to jump through more hoops and wouldn't be automatically allowed, but I know lots of people who spent gap years etc working in Australia, New Zealand, and other places. I have friends now who live and work in Singapore, Hong Kong, Africa (various countries). The only thing which would change is that you'd have to do some paperwork first Put it this way, i was not allowed to start a business in Switzerland, could not move jobs, and my permit was time limited.....not exactly business friendly you might say....and most muslims (99+%) are not terrorists and ffs most european migrants are not even muslim. Its just wrong to reduce the in/out referendum to inflammatory talk of terrorism
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npn Crowborough 29 Apr 16 1.31pm | |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
Put it this way, i was not allowed to start a business in Switzerland, could not move jobs, and my permit was time limited.....not exactly business friendly you might say....and most muslims (99+%) are not terrorists and ffs most european migrants are not even muslim. Its just wrong to reduce the in/out referendum to inflammatory talk of terrorism Well, yes it is, but I don't think I did that???
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JohnyBoy 29 Apr 16 1.33pm | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
You've concentrated on the economic angle again Johnny whereas I meant the practical experiences.... If you were able to talk to people from Lincolnshire, they would tell you how immigration has blighted their daily lives due to over population. Fruit and Veg picking in the fields of the fens was a seasonal thing, but now the EU laws mean foreign labour is allowed to live here 24/7, so eastern european folk have permanently settled in places like Boston and Lincoln and taken over those towns. The indigenous population (now very much in the minority and trapped there by falling house prices compared to more lucrative/salubrious areas to live) cannot get to see a GP for weeks, get their kids in a local school and have seen their high streets turned into Polish Deli's, betting shops and massage parlours. Their grown up children cannot leave home because they cannot get a job that pays enough for the rent and living expenses... let alone find a house to buy for themselves. So yes... I am blaming Johnny Foreigner (your words not mine) as these hardships are keenly felt by the residents of Lincolnshire and are definitely as a direct result of immigration. What have you to say to them to persuade them that remaining in the EU is a good idea? They were the type of people who probably complained about the arrival of people from commonwealth countries (caribbean, pakistan etc) 50odd years ago moaning about corner shops etc. Like the old residents of Notting Hill who sold their fine houses because of the arrival of the afro caribbean community because they were small minded bigots. I'd tell em to get off their fat arses, stop blaming everyone for their miserable lives and start contributing as much as those foreigners do for society rather than expect public services to for their use only....do you think they might take some of that onboard?
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JohnyBoy 29 Apr 16 1.36pm | |
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Originally posted by npn
Well, yes it is, but I don't think I did that???
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npn Crowborough 29 Apr 16 1.37pm | |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
Fair play, no problem
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Hoof Hearted 29 Apr 16 1.38pm | |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
They were the type of people who probably complained about the arrival of people from commonwealth countries (caribbean, pakistan etc) 50odd years ago moaning about corner shops etc. Like the old residents of Notting Hill who sold their fine houses because of the arrival of the afro caribbean community because they were small minded bigots. I'd tell em to get off their fat arses, stop blaming everyone for their miserable lives and start contributing as much as those foreigners do for society rather than expect public services to for their use only....do you think they might take some of that onboard? Ahhh... showing your true colours now Johnny. I highlight a genuine bunch of disadvantaged people and you belittle them and their plight by labelling them bigots. You're not Gordon Brown are you?
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JohnyBoy 29 Apr 16 1.42pm | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Ahhh... showing your true colours now Johnny. I highlight a genuine bunch of disadvantaged people and you belittle them and their plight by labelling them bigots. You're not Gordon Brown are you?
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Hoof Hearted 29 Apr 16 1.54pm | |
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Originally posted by JohnyBoy
Killed the debate for me Johnny I'm afraid. Sad that in this day and age people can dismiss someone's plight with such disdain whilst dreaming of sipping wine on a foreign beach without the need for a visa highlights how little some people care for our own countrymen and are more worried about economic factors than genuine hardship. I hope your opinions and mindset are in the minority.
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JohnyBoy 29 Apr 16 2.05pm | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Killed the debate for me Johnny I'm afraid. Sad that in this day and age people can dismiss someone's plight with such disdain whilst dreaming of sipping wine on a foreign beach without the need for a visa highlights how little some people care for our own countrymen and are more worried about economic factors than genuine hardship. I hope your opinions and mindset are in the minority. Oh come on Hoof, dont be so sensitive, i was just highlighting the point that there will always be perpetual victims in society who claim their 'hardship' is none of their fault. If they blame taxation or education/health policy then fair enough, we all do thar but to choose to blame people because of their country of birth then i am afraid they are indeed bigots
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