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Teddy Eagle 25 Mar 24 7.07pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Nor was a secondary modern. Being labelled a failure at 11 doesn’t do a lot for your confidence. That's where you lost out then. Not a day passed when we weren't assured of future success.
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Stirlingsays 25 Mar 24 7.13pm | |
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You keep hearing this waffle from the left about being 'branded a failure' at 11. Who's exactly going around telling eleven year olds they are failures? Parents? Teachers? It certainly isn't most 11 year olds telling themselves that....most of them couldn't care less. Instead it's just the usual nonsense you hear repeated because that's always the argument used....the fact that he has little to do with reality just fits in with most of their other core concepts.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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georgenorman 25 Mar 24 8.24pm | |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Relevance? On abolition, I am conflicted. Labour hated the new elitism that grammar schools brought and I see that (a tiny bit). Then again, I would have gone to grammar school rather than comp and am still paying the cost. Relevance? Merely that is seems more or less compulsory for left-wing crackpots to have sexual pecadiilos. Grammar schools gave an opportunity to bright ordinary working class kids to develop their potential. I certainly benefited from the system.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 25 Mar 24 9.26pm | |
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No body had to tell you, you were a failure at 11! You either passed or you failed the 11+. If you failed you knew. Everyone knew. It was the accepted perception. Children were divided into two groups. The grammar school successes and the secondary school failures. One group were expected to become lawyers and airline pilots. The other labourers, bin men or clerks. It had nothing whatsoever about being left or right. There were some kids at my school who held views that today would be categorised as very far right. Those who think they know better about this, who think they know better about everything, have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. Those that experienced it do. I was fortunate. I am tenacious and I fight. Not with my hands but with my brain. What I might have achieved if I had had a better day when I sat the 11+, or been prepared better at primary school, and got a pass, rather than a fail, who knows? It wasn’t a good system and anyone who defends it hasn’t experienced the downside. That’s not to suggest that you abandon the style of teaching and expectations available in grammar schools. Only that how that is made available wasn’t fit for purpose.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 25 Mar 24 9.29pm | |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
How can I know that? That’s the point!
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Stirlingsays 25 Mar 24 9.44pm | |
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A complete pile of absolute twaddle.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Teddy Eagle 25 Mar 24 10.06pm | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
No body had to tell you, you were a failure at 11! You either passed or you failed the 11+. If you failed you knew. Everyone knew. It was the accepted perception. Children were divided into two groups. The grammar school successes and the secondary school failures. One group were expected to become lawyers and airline pilots. The other labourers, bin men or clerks. It had nothing whatsoever about being left or right. There were some kids at my school who held views that today would be categorised as very far right. Those who think they know better about this, who think they know better about everything, have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. Those that experienced it do. I was fortunate. I am tenacious and I fight. Not with my hands but with my brain. What I might have achieved if I had had a better day when I sat the 11+, or been prepared better at primary school, and got a pass, rather than a fail, who knows? It wasn’t a good system and anyone who defends it hasn’t experienced the downside. That’s not to suggest that you abandon the style of teaching and expectations available in grammar schools. Only that how that is made available wasn’t fit for purpose. You're defending comprehensives without experiencing them either. My memory of the reality in no way matches your idealised version.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 26 Mar 24 9.57am | |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
You're defending comprehensives without experiencing them either. My memory of the reality in no way matches your idealised version. I am fully aware that many of the comprehensives were simply renamed secondary moderns and an abuse of the principles that lay behind them. Which is why I referred to well structured and managed comprehensives in my first post. If you do this then it has to be done properly and that means taking the best from the way grammar schools function and applying it to a comprehensive structure.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 26 Mar 24 10.20am | |
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I don’t know whether what follows belongs here, or in the “Gaza” or “Religion” threads as it straddles them all in some ways. As it originates in the USA I will include it here. I receive regular emails from Andrew Torba, the CEO of Gab. Gab is the self proclaimed “free speech” platform beloved of the right as they can say whatever they like there as it is unmoderated. Torba is also an outspoken “Christian” of the Bible Belt type. Take a look at today’s offering:- Whilst I have sympathy with some of the remarks about the behaviour of those in the USA who blindly support Israel, the reasoning behind those remarks and their tone I find extremely disturbing. Many times in these pages I have argued for the removal of religious influence in public life, in particular our schools. Others have come back to question why. Although we don’t currently see this kind of intolerant fervour in the UK I believe the attitudes present in this piece by Torba is all the evidence you need to realise the importance of including all religions and making no exceptions.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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georgenorman 26 Mar 24 10.30am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I don’t know whether what follows belongs here, or in the “Gaza” or “Religion” threads as it straddles them all in some ways. As it originates in the USA I will include it here. I receive regular emails from Andrew Torba, the CEO of Gab. Gab is the self proclaimed “free speech” platform beloved of the right as they can say whatever they like there as it is unmoderated. Torba is also an outspoken “Christian” of the Bible Belt type. Take a look at today’s offering:- Whilst I have sympathy with some of the remarks about the behaviour of those in the USA who blindly support Israel, the reasoning behind those remarks and their tone I find extremely disturbing. Many times in these pages I have argued for the removal of religious influence in public life, in particular our schools. Others have come back to question why. Although we don’t currently see this kind of intolerant fervour in the UK I believe the attitudes present in this piece by Torba is all the evidence you need to realise the importance of including all religions and making no exceptions. "He was an embittered atheist, the sort of atheist who does not so much disbelieve in God as personally dislike Him." [Orwell]
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georgenorman 26 Mar 24 10.58am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
No body had to tell you, you were a failure at 11! You either passed or you failed the 11+. If you failed you knew. Everyone knew. It was the accepted perception. Children were divided into two groups. The grammar school successes and the secondary school failures. One group were expected to become lawyers and airline pilots. The other labourers, bin men or clerks. It had nothing whatsoever about being left or right. There were some kids at my school who held views that today would be categorised as very far right. Those who think they know better about this, who think they know better about everything, have absolutely no idea what they are talking about. Those that experienced it do. I was fortunate. I am tenacious and I fight. Not with my hands but with my brain. What I might have achieved if I had had a better day when I sat the 11+, or been prepared better at primary school, and got a pass, rather than a fail, who knows? It wasn’t a good system and anyone who defends it hasn’t experienced the downside. That’s not to suggest that you abandon the style of teaching and expectations available in grammar schools. Only that how that is made available wasn’t fit for purpose. I think it is a great vindication of the 11+ system if it successfully measured your level of intelligence.
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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 26 Mar 24 11.03pm | |
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With all the cases involving Trump that are now in the news we tend to forget the previous scams he perpetrated on people, but managed to avoid being punished for by delay and/or declaring bankruptcy, or otherwise closing the business. Trump University was a case in point. Quietly closed down and settlements agreed with some who he had scammed , early in his first year as POTUS. As he was attracting so much controversy at the time hardly anyone noticed. Perhaps this is the intention this time. Ride it out, delay, appeal and complain until he can either close the cases down, pardon himself or quietly pay people off when everyone is more concerned with bigger stupidity by him. Of course this is all just a witch-hunt. Everything he does is perfect.
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