Tax on pensioners proposed

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Tax on pensioners proposed

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Lyons550 Shirley 08 May 18 3.14pm
Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow I'm fortunate enough to be fairly well employed in London, not to mention I grew up here and it's still where all of my friends and family live - I would consider moving in the future, if it lined up with career/family plans, but in the short to medium term, it's not really an option. No different for me....but I'm willing to do it so my kids are able to get on with their lives without having to rely on the state. As a nation it's what great swathes of our ancestors have done for years...it's just that the latest generation has become lazy and defiant expecting everyone else to sort it out for them rather than getting of their arses to MAKE IT WORK The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World
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Lyons550

Shirley 08 May 18 3.14pm

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

I'm fortunate enough to be fairly well employed in London, not to mention I grew up here and it's still where all of my friends and family live - I would consider moving in the future, if it lined up with career/family plans, but in the short to medium term, it's not really an option.

No different for me....but I'm willing to do it so my kids are able to get on with their lives without having to rely on the state.

As a nation it's what great swathes of our ancestors have done for years...it's just that the latest generation has become lazy and defiant expecting everyone else to sort it out for them rather than getting of their arses to MAKE IT WORK

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

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Rudi Hedman Caterham 08 May 18 3.14pm
Originally posted by Lyons550 Then move out to other parts of the country...it's quite simple. Doing so would also affect the housing market in the south, 1,000's are already moving out. It’s funny when you simplify it. Don’t go out much while living at parents’ to save for a deposit and then when you do move, move somewhere where you don’t know anybody. God there’s a lack of supply of housing and I’m not as fussed as lots on where it should be compared to how I was before. COYP
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Rudi Hedman

Caterham 08 May 18 3.14pm

Originally posted by Lyons550

Then move out to other parts of the country...it's quite simple. Doing so would also affect the housing market in the south, 1,000's are already moving out.

It’s funny when you simplify it.

Don’t go out much while living at parents’ to save for a deposit and then when you do move, move somewhere where you don’t know anybody.

God there’s a lack of supply of housing and I’m not as fussed as lots on where it should be compared to how I was before.

COYP

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Stirlingsays 08 May 18 3.16pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger Exactly. We in Europe listened to our governments, cut family sizes and have the women going out to work. What have we got in return? Millions of immigrants arriving on our doorstep, huge mortgages, declining health care and no state money for retirement. Increasing population puts pressure on everything. It will only get much worse. Time to ditch this model and recognise that we need to shrink the population of Britain by reducing immigration to a trickle, address the problems with excessive mortgages payments so that some of that money can go back to supporting the ageing population. Far too much money ends up in the pockets of the super rich while the rest of us live in the steadily decaying shell that Europe is becoming. It's no good taxing people who are a bit better off when most of the money is with 1% of the population. They can contribute far more and barely notice. That is as 'socialist' as I'm gonna get. You certainly raise proper problems that our politicians just don't want to deal with. They just continually kick a can down the road....until all you have is a road full of cans. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

08 May 18 3.16pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Exactly.

We in Europe listened to our governments, cut family sizes and have the women going out to work.

What have we got in return?

Millions of immigrants arriving on our doorstep, huge mortgages, declining health care and no state money for retirement. Increasing population puts pressure on everything. It will only get much worse.

Time to ditch this model and recognise that we need to shrink the population of Britain by reducing immigration to a trickle, address the problems with excessive mortgages payments so that some of that money can go back to supporting the ageing population.
Far too much money ends up in the pockets of the super rich while the rest of us live in the steadily decaying shell that Europe is becoming.
It's no good taxing people who are a bit better off when most of the money is with 1% of the population. They can contribute far more and barely notice.

That is as 'socialist' as I'm gonna get.

You certainly raise proper problems that our politicians just don't want to deal with.

They just continually kick a can down the road....until all you have is a road full of cans.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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becky over the moon 08 May 18 3.16pm
Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow £160k wouldn't even buy you a studio in London, and £16k is less than half of what you need in up front costs, so no it wouldn't - this is such a half arsed article aimed solely at people who refuse to accept that it wasn't just a bit of 'hard work and grit' when they got on the ladder. London, believe it or not, isn't the centre of the universe...... although a lot of those who live there may think otherwise. I find yours such a half arsed opinion from someone who refuses to believe just how much hard work and grit people did put in to getting on the property ladder, even in the 60's and 70's. 1970's I was doing a full time and 2 part time jobs to get the deposit on my maisonette. A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers
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becky

over the moon 08 May 18 3.16pm

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

£160k wouldn't even buy you a studio in London, and £16k is less than half of what you need in up front costs, so no it wouldn't - this is such a half arsed article aimed solely at people who refuse to accept that it wasn't just a bit of 'hard work and grit' when they got on the ladder.

London, believe it or not, isn't the centre of the universe...... although a lot of those who live there may think otherwise.

I find yours such a half arsed opinion from someone who refuses to believe just how much hard work and grit people did put in to getting on the property ladder, even in the 60's and 70's.

1970's I was doing a full time and 2 part time jobs to get the deposit on my maisonette.

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

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Lyons550 Shirley 08 May 18 3.20pm
Originally posted by Rudi Hedman It’s funny when you simplify it. Don’t go out much while living at parents’ to save for a deposit and then when you do move, move somewhere where you don’t know anybody. God there’s a lack of supply of housing and I’m not as fussed as lots on where it should be compared to how I was before. When you simplify things the solutions are far clearer. How many kids only interact with their mates over the internet via PS4 or Social media...? My missus said to me that I was the only one that had a large circle of friends (I play footie on Sat and Sundays) and my family is close by...but do you know what...I can skype them; get off my arse and drive down the few hours it'd take to see them face to face...I live no more than 5 miles from them all and rarely see them as it is. I walked round a brand new 5 bed house in an area that has superfast broadband (top of the kids list); plenty of beautiful villages and countryside...all for £400k....yes...£400k...you cant get a 2 bed flat for that in parts of London. No brainer The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World
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Lyons550

Shirley 08 May 18 3.20pm

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

It’s funny when you simplify it.

Don’t go out much while living at parents’ to save for a deposit and then when you do move, move somewhere where you don’t know anybody.

God there’s a lack of supply of housing and I’m not as fussed as lots on where it should be compared to how I was before.

When you simplify things the solutions are far clearer. How many kids only interact with their mates over the internet via PS4 or Social media...?

My missus said to me that I was the only one that had a large circle of friends (I play footie on Sat and Sundays) and my family is close by...but do you know what...I can skype them; get off my arse and drive down the few hours it'd take to see them face to face...I live no more than 5 miles from them all and rarely see them as it is.

I walked round a brand new 5 bed house in an area that has superfast broadband (top of the kids list); plenty of beautiful villages and countryside...all for £400k....yes...£400k...you cant get a 2 bed flat for that in parts of London.

No brainer

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

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Hrolf The Ganger 08 May 18 3.22pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays You certainly raise proper problems that our politicians just don't want to deal with. They just continually kick a can down the road....until all you have is a road full of cans. Sadly, it's like asking the Pope to promote secularism.
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Hrolf The Ganger

08 May 18 3.22pm

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Originally posted by Stirlingsays

You certainly raise proper problems that our politicians just don't want to deal with.

They just continually kick a can down the road....until all you have is a road full of cans.

Sadly, it's like asking the Pope to promote secularism.

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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 08 May 18 3.26pm
Originally posted by Lyons550 No different for me....but I'm willing to do it so my kids are able to get on with their lives without having to rely on the state. As a nation it's what great swathes of our ancestors have done for years...it's just that the latest generation has become lazy and defiant expecting everyone else to sort it out for them rather than getting of their arses to MAKE IT WORK Good for you; it's still not even close to being a reasonable solution to a societal issue. Your second paragraph is just nostalgic crap - it has no factual basis. Why are people so reluctant to acknowledge it's a problem? The only proposed solutions I've had so far are to live with my parents until I'm 30+ and married (my mum had to downsize from the 3bedroom house I grew up in because she could no longer afford it, so not sure how that works) or to walk away from the city I grew up in, my career, family and friends, and relocate to another city.
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EverybodyDannsNow

SE19 08 May 18 3.26pm

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Originally posted by Lyons550

No different for me....but I'm willing to do it so my kids are able to get on with their lives without having to rely on the state.

Good for you; it's still not even close to being a reasonable solution to a societal issue.

Your second paragraph is just nostalgic crap - it has no factual basis.

Why are people so reluctant to acknowledge it's a problem? The only proposed solutions I've had so far are to live with my parents until I'm 30+ and married (my mum had to downsize from the 3bedroom house I grew up in because she could no longer afford it, so not sure how that works) or to walk away from the city I grew up in, my career, family and friends, and relocate to another city.

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EverybodyDannsNow SE19 08 May 18 3.33pm
Originally posted by becky London, believe it or not, isn't the centre of the universe...... although a lot of those who live there may think otherwise. I find yours such a half arsed opinion from someone who refuses to believe just how much hard work and grit people did put in to getting on the property ladder, even in the 60's and 70's. 1970's I was doing a full time and 2 part time jobs to get the deposit on my maisonette. Where have I said it is? I think my explanation as to why I want to stay in London is a very reasonable one - feel free to disagree, but please don't put words in my mouth. Again, please point out where I have questioned the amount of hard work put in by people in the 60s and 70s? To state it was easier to get on the ladder previously is not questioning that, it is simply stating a fact. Your last paragraph is the crux of it; you don't want to accept that someone might have it worst than you did, so you refute that it's a problem and hide behind sentiment. Edited by EverybodyDannsNow (08 May 2018 3.34pm)
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EverybodyDannsNow

SE19 08 May 18 3.33pm

Originally posted by becky

London, believe it or not, isn't the centre of the universe...... although a lot of those who live there may think otherwise.

I find yours such a half arsed opinion from someone who refuses to believe just how much hard work and grit people did put in to getting on the property ladder, even in the 60's and 70's.

1970's I was doing a full time and 2 part time jobs to get the deposit on my maisonette.

Where have I said it is? I think my explanation as to why I want to stay in London is a very reasonable one - feel free to disagree, but please don't put words in my mouth.

Again, please point out where I have questioned the amount of hard work put in by people in the 60s and 70s? To state it was easier to get on the ladder previously is not questioning that, it is simply stating a fact.

Your last paragraph is the crux of it; you don't want to accept that someone might have it worst than you did, so you refute that it's a problem and hide behind sentiment.

Edited by EverybodyDannsNow (08 May 2018 3.34pm)

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cryrst The garden of England 08 May 18 3.42pm
This sort of turning into a property and how much post That's ok but short term counting is creating the issue. There are now 35,40 and 50 year mortgages. What you cannot put in the equation for purchasing a property is how much you eventually end up paying. It's all dead money unless you intend regularly moving. That even being the case shouldn't be a problem. Bottom line what is most important Having a home or seeing how cheap you can get it. You can still make the term shorter by overpaying a small amount each month. This way of getting on the ladder also means you may need a smaller deposit.
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cryrst

The garden of England 08 May 18 3.42pm

This sort of turning into a property and how much post
That's ok but short term counting is creating the issue.
There are now 35,40 and 50 year mortgages.
What you cannot put in the equation for purchasing a property is how much you eventually end up paying.
It's all dead money unless you intend regularly moving.
That even being the case shouldn't be a problem.
Bottom line what is most important
Having a home or seeing how cheap you can get it.
You can still make the term shorter by overpaying a small amount each month.
This way of getting on the ladder also means you may need a smaller deposit.

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Lyons550 Shirley 08 May 18 4.24pm
Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow Good for you; it's still not even close to being a reasonable solution to a societal issue. Your second paragraph is just nostalgic crap - it has no factual basis. Why are people so reluctant to acknowledge it's a problem? The only proposed solutions I've had so far are to live with my parents until I'm 30+ and married (my mum had to downsize from the 3bedroom house I grew up in because she could no longer afford it, so not sure how that works) or to walk away from the city I grew up in, my career, family and friends, and relocate to another city. Its not nostalgic crap...it's happen now...some are just too insular to realise it though. outer London prices are now rising as a result, and speaking with those up North a couple of weeks back they're seeing a greater number of 'internal migration' as they refer to it, fleeing the south. I agree its not a one size fits all solution though; instead its one of many potential solutions. It's within all our power to up sticks...but our inability to simply get on with things rather than stay and wait for others to sort it. Procrastination stifles much of todays society....because they've been taught to be victims..and to rely on others to sort their issues out...as its easier that way. The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World
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Lyons550

Shirley 08 May 18 4.24pm

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

Good for you; it's still not even close to being a reasonable solution to a societal issue.

Your second paragraph is just nostalgic crap - it has no factual basis.

Its not nostalgic crap...it's happen now...some are just too insular to realise it though. outer London prices are now rising as a result, and speaking with those up North a couple of weeks back they're seeing a greater number of 'internal migration' as they refer to it, fleeing the south.

I agree its not a one size fits all solution though; instead its one of many potential solutions.

It's within all our power to up sticks...but our inability to simply get on with things rather than stay and wait for others to sort it.

Procrastination stifles much of todays society....because they've been taught to be victims..and to rely on others to sort their issues out...as its easier that way.

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

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Lyons550 Shirley 08 May 18 4.30pm
Originally posted by cryrst This sort of turning into a property and how much post That's ok but short term counting is creating the issue. There are now 35,40 and 50 year mortgages. What you cannot put in the equation for purchasing a property is how much you eventually end up paying. It's all dead money unless you intend regularly moving. That even being the case shouldn't be a problem. Bottom line what is most important Having a home or seeing how cheap you can get it. You can still make the term shorter by overpaying a small amount each month. This way of getting on the ladder also means you may need a smaller deposit. I think the reason property has taken prominence in the thread is that it's one of the things that the Think Tank suggested the £10k would be released for...but the point we're all in agreement with is that with property prices being so high, just how far will that go? My point is that we've all affected the property market by staying in one place; move and there are opportunities everywhere. Previously everything was here in London...all the 'value chains' of business...but with communication allowing us to talk to the otherside of the world and receive news instantaneously...what used to be justifiable reason to keep most here is now an excuse, because we dont like change. The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World
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Lyons550

Shirley 08 May 18 4.30pm

Originally posted by cryrst

I think the reason property has taken prominence in the thread is that it's one of the things that the Think Tank suggested the £10k would be released for...but the point we're all in agreement with is that with property prices being so high, just how far will that go?

My point is that we've all affected the property market by staying in one place; move and there are opportunities everywhere. Previously everything was here in London...all the 'value chains' of business...but with communication allowing us to talk to the otherside of the world and receive news instantaneously...what used to be justifiable reason to keep most here is now an excuse, because we dont like change.

The Voice of Reason In An Otherwise Mediocre World

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.TUX. 08 May 18 5.14pm
Originally posted by pefwin Intergenerational equality is not a new idea. The problem is that we have had 40 years of short-term policies, skewed towards those liable to vote. It has meant that the old have got relatively wealthier whilst the young got poorer. People who retired say 10-20 years ago will be the most wealthy pensioners ever. A short-term fix will not work, or a society windfall tax, we need to look at society as a whole, how we pay for education, the housing market, IHT, and many more aspects. The problem is that we've had over 40yrs of a fiat-currency (forced upon us) and the subsequent inflation, around 1300% since the 70's, that it brings. The more that is printed the more the existing currency is devalued ie it has less worth. This is the real issue that, as far as i'm aware, is never ever mentioned let alone addressed. Buy Litecoin.
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.TUX.

08 May 18 5.14pm

Originally posted by pefwin

Intergenerational equality is not a new idea.

The problem is that we have had 40 years of short-term policies, skewed towards those liable to vote.

It has meant that the old have got relatively wealthier whilst the young got poorer. People who retired say 10-20 years ago will be the most wealthy pensioners ever.

A short-term fix will not work, or a society windfall tax, we need to look at society as a whole, how we pay for education, the housing market, IHT, and many more aspects.

The problem is that we've had over 40yrs of a fiat-currency (forced upon us) and the subsequent inflation, around 1300% since the 70's, that it brings.
The more that is printed the more the existing currency is devalued ie it has less worth.

This is the real issue that, as far as i'm aware, is never ever mentioned let alone addressed.

Buy Litecoin.

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