CONservative government incompetence.

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CONservative government incompetence.

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georgenorman 14 Mar 24 9.13am
Deleted - was on wrong thread! Edited by georgenorman (14 Mar 2024 10.01am)
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georgenorman

14 Mar 24 9.13am

Deleted - was on wrong thread!

Edited by georgenorman (14 Mar 2024 10.01am)

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Stirlingsays 14 Mar 24 1.37pm
Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow I think challenging the use of 'public figure' and 'the public' is very nit-picky. Again, this is nothing to do with an opinion 'the state doesn't like' - I'd imagine most of government quite liked the commentary in private - and as far as I've seen, there is absolutely no talk of criminal proceedings or anything close to that. So you're crowbarring it in. What consequences are you talking about here? Specific to Heston I mean. And to ask again, how else could this possibly play out? In free-speech land, Heston's comments get published by the media... what difference in reaction would you be comfortable with? I've already said that the consequences for Heston are likely to be minor. My point speaks to what has already been in force for years now. How should it play out? As it did before Blair's laws, a period of time where we still had a reputation for freedom of speech....indeed the envy of the world and a reputation which has inspired across the world. Even today, we see more decline in civil liberties from the government in enlarging definitions of extremism to be ideology they don't like via the leftist 'hate' word. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Mar 24 1.37pm

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

I think challenging the use of 'public figure' and 'the public' is very nit-picky.

Again, this is nothing to do with an opinion 'the state doesn't like' - I'd imagine most of government quite liked the commentary in private - and as far as I've seen, there is absolutely no talk of criminal proceedings or anything close to that. So you're crowbarring it in.

What consequences are you talking about here? Specific to Heston I mean.

And to ask again, how else could this possibly play out? In free-speech land, Heston's comments get published by the media... what difference in reaction would you be comfortable with?

I've already said that the consequences for Heston are likely to be minor. My point speaks to what has already been in force for years now.

How should it play out? As it did before Blair's laws, a period of time where we still had a reputation for freedom of speech....indeed the envy of the world and a reputation which has inspired across the world.

Even today, we see more decline in civil liberties from the government in enlarging definitions of extremism to be ideology they don't like via the leftist 'hate' word.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Hrolf The Ganger 14 Mar 24 1.44pm
Originally posted by Badger11 She maybe a nut job but the debate was about her, you would think the Speaker would have thought her contribution was relevant. I know lots of MPs try and fail to get noticed by the Speaker (time is limited) but the topics known in advance. If the Speaker is doing his job properly he will guess in advance who will want to raise a question. In this case you did not need to be Sherlock Holmes. Senior Labour figure, Prime Minister and err oh yes Diane Abbott who the topic is about. Failing to notice an MP is one of the petty revenge powers of the Speaker, has Diane upset him in the past? Diane Abbott is an embarrassment to Labour. They want to quietly get rid of her. She became a very handy device to have a pop at the Tories on this occasion, but the simple fact is that she has encouraged so much ill will towards her, not by being Black but by being splurging out a load of race baiting nonsense over many years. She will conveniently disappear from the political scene quite soon, and Keir Starmer will be behind it.
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Hrolf The Ganger

14 Mar 24 1.44pm

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Originally posted by Badger11

She maybe a nut job but the debate was about her, you would think the Speaker would have thought her contribution was relevant.

I know lots of MPs try and fail to get noticed by the Speaker (time is limited) but the topics known in advance. If the Speaker is doing his job properly he will guess in advance who will want to raise a question.

In this case you did not need to be Sherlock Holmes. Senior Labour figure, Prime Minister and err oh yes Diane Abbott who the topic is about.

Failing to notice an MP is one of the petty revenge powers of the Speaker, has Diane upset him in the past?

Diane Abbott is an embarrassment to Labour. They want to quietly get rid of her.
She became a very handy device to have a pop at the Tories on this occasion, but the simple fact is that she has encouraged so much ill will towards her, not by being Black but by being splurging out a load of race baiting nonsense over many years.

She will conveniently disappear from the political scene quite soon, and Keir Starmer will be behind it.

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Stirlingsays 14 Mar 24 2.22pm
I'm hearing that discussions are afoot within the power base of the conservatives to remove Sunak. Obviously polling at 18 percent and losing very safe seats tends to move the needle. Bit pointless now, at this stage...left it far too late if you ask me, but we will see what transpires if anything. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Mar 24 2.22pm

I'm hearing that discussions are afoot within the power base of the conservatives to remove Sunak. Obviously polling at 18 percent and losing very safe seats tends to move the needle.

Bit pointless now, at this stage...left it far too late if you ask me, but we will see what transpires if anything.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 14 Mar 24 2.25pm
Almost amusingly for some the Parliamentary watchdog 'Independent' Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA) has just decided to give MPs a 5.5% pay rise starting next month. That takes their annual pay from £86,584 to £91,346. While the country gets poorer for most these virtue signalling posh incompetents get wealthier. I bet some of the diversity hires on the Labour back benches cannot believe their luck and will be licking their lips. A good proportion of them don't have the brains to run a sweet shop. Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Mar 2024 2.31pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Mar 24 2.25pm

Almost amusingly for some the Parliamentary watchdog 'Independent' Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA) has just decided to give MPs a 5.5% pay rise starting next month. That takes their annual pay from £86,584 to £91,346.

While the country gets poorer for most these virtue signalling posh incompetents get wealthier.

I bet some of the diversity hires on the Labour back benches cannot believe their luck and will be licking their lips. A good proportion of them don't have the brains to run a sweet shop.

Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Mar 2024 2.31pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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steeleye20 Croydon 14 Mar 24 2.40pm
There must be a right to appeal, a process for an organisation named as extremist to put their case. There is no remedy here except judicial review. That can take years even if allowed and be unaffordable. There is a deep anti-muslim slant in the conservative party, The tories really do need to look at themselves in the mirror, they are extreme themselves stoking up division. The government should be on the list in my view, at the top.
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steeleye20

Croydon 14 Mar 24 2.40pm

There must be a right to appeal, a process for an organisation named as extremist to put their case.

There is no remedy here except judicial review.

That can take years even if allowed and be unaffordable.

There is a deep anti-muslim slant in the conservative party,

The tories really do need to look at themselves in the mirror, they are extreme themselves stoking up division.

The government should be on the list in my view, at the top.

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JRW2 Dulwich 14 Mar 24 2.42pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays Almost amusingly for some the Parliamentary watchdog 'Independent' Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA) has just decided to give MPs a 5.5% pay rise starting next month. That takes their annual pay from £86,584 to £91,346. While the country gets poorer for most these virtue signalling posh incompetents get wealthier. I bet some of the diversity hires on the Labour back benches cannot believe their luck and will be licking their lips. A good proportion of them don't have the brains to run a sweet shop. Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Mar 2024 2.31pm) In the last quarter of 2023 average earnings in the public sector rose by 5.8% and in the private sector by 6.2%. At tha last count (March 2023) UK MPs' salaries were less than in Italy, Austria, Germany, Netherlands and Denmark, and slightly higher than in Ireland, Belgium and France. (By the way, I'm not an MP!)
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JRW2

Dulwich 14 Mar 24 2.42pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

Almost amusingly for some the Parliamentary watchdog 'Independent' Parliamentary Standards Authority (IPSA) has just decided to give MPs a 5.5% pay rise starting next month. That takes their annual pay from £86,584 to £91,346.

While the country gets poorer for most these virtue signalling posh incompetents get wealthier.

I bet some of the diversity hires on the Labour back benches cannot believe their luck and will be licking their lips. A good proportion of them don't have the brains to run a sweet shop.

Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Mar 2024 2.31pm)

In the last quarter of 2023 average earnings in the public sector rose by 5.8% and in the private sector by 6.2%.

At tha last count (March 2023) UK MPs' salaries were less than in Italy, Austria, Germany, Netherlands and Denmark, and slightly higher than in Ireland, Belgium and France. (By the way, I'm not an MP!)

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JRW2 Dulwich 14 Mar 24 2.51pm
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I'm hearing that discussions are afoot within the power base of the conservatives to remove Sunak. Obviously polling at 18 percent and losing very safe seats tends to move the needle. Bit pointless now, at this stage...left it far too late if you ask me, but we will see what transpires if anything. Yes, a bit late. But if it happened, who would you support? I will always regret that David Davis lost out to Cameron all those years ago: brought up on a council estate, friendly manner, just slightly right of centre. About the same age as Trump, so I'd still have him. But otherwise for me it would have to be Jeremy Hunt or the lovely Penny.
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JRW2

Dulwich 14 Mar 24 2.51pm

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I'm hearing that discussions are afoot within the power base of the conservatives to remove Sunak. Obviously polling at 18 percent and losing very safe seats tends to move the needle.

Bit pointless now, at this stage...left it far too late if you ask me, but we will see what transpires if anything.

Yes, a bit late. But if it happened, who would you support? I will always regret that David Davis lost out to Cameron all those years ago: brought up on a council estate, friendly manner, just slightly right of centre. About the same age as Trump, so I'd still have him.

But otherwise for me it would have to be Jeremy Hunt or the lovely Penny.

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steeleye20 Croydon 14 Mar 24 3.03pm
Gove is maintaining that Hester's comments that DA made him want 'to hate all black women' and that she 'should be shot', are not extreme.
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steeleye20

Croydon 14 Mar 24 3.03pm

Gove is maintaining that Hester's comments that DA made him want 'to hate all black women' and that she 'should be shot', are not extreme.

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georgenorman 14 Mar 24 3.11pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 Gove is maintaining that Hester's comments that DA made him want 'to hate all black women' and that she 'should be shot', are not extreme. One thing's for sure, whatever he said, he would not be as extreme as you.
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georgenorman

14 Mar 24 3.11pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Gove is maintaining that Hester's comments that DA made him want 'to hate all black women' and that she 'should be shot', are not extreme.

One thing's for sure, whatever he said, he would not be as extreme as you.

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Hrolf The Ganger 14 Mar 24 3.24pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 Gove is maintaining that Hester's comments that DA made him want 'to hate all black women' and that she 'should be shot', are not extreme. Do give it a rest. It was almost certainly a figure of speech. The far left and Islamist groups are the biggest threats to our democracy. They are behind virtually all extremist activity. So called neo Nazi groups are virtually non existent in terms of criminality. The simple fact is that politicians are now sweating about a problem for which they are entirely responsible. Mass immigration and the corruption of our education system is all down to them. Gove is still banging on about being stronger with multi culturalism when the very need for tougher measures proves the opposite. These new measures are to protect MPs safety and keep the rest of us from rebelling against the real root causes.
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Hrolf The Ganger

14 Mar 24 3.24pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

Gove is maintaining that Hester's comments that DA made him want 'to hate all black women' and that she 'should be shot', are not extreme.

Do give it a rest. It was almost certainly a figure of speech.

The far left and Islamist groups are the biggest threats to our democracy. They are behind virtually all extremist activity.

So called neo Nazi groups are virtually non existent in terms of criminality.

The simple fact is that politicians are now sweating about a problem for which they are entirely responsible.

Mass immigration and the corruption of our education system is all down to them.
Gove is still banging on about being stronger with multi culturalism when the very need for tougher measures proves the opposite.
These new measures are to protect MPs safety and keep the rest of us from rebelling against the real root causes.

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Stirlingsays 14 Mar 24 4.03pm
Originally posted by JRW2 In the last quarter of 2023 average earnings in the public sector rose by 5.8% and in the private sector by 6.2%. At tha last count (March 2023) UK MPs' salaries were less than in Italy, Austria, Germany, Netherlands and Denmark, and slightly higher than in Ireland, Belgium and France. (By the way, I'm not an MP!) Cool, but the last quarter doesn't really cut it. Aside from MP salaries being way above most people inflation has outstripped both for a long time and people are poorer since....probably 2008. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Mar 24 4.03pm

Originally posted by JRW2

In the last quarter of 2023 average earnings in the public sector rose by 5.8% and in the private sector by 6.2%.

Cool, but the last quarter doesn't really cut it.

Aside from MP salaries being way above most people inflation has outstripped both for a long time and people are poorer since....probably 2008.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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