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CONservative government incompetence.
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 Stirlingsays  13 Mar 24 11.49am |
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Originally posted by Nicholas91
Agree, I quite enjoyed this commentary. The story here is such a nothingness it's unreal - 'Man says something incredibly stupid, the left zone in on it for nothing more than to justify their existence and the Tories take swift action so as not to provide the left with any more firepower than has arrived already'. But the system keeps going regardless and it has no impact on any of our lives. He's right about a lot of the problems with party funding. But then again Marx was right about a lot of the problems with Capitalism.....Marx's solution to the ills of capitalism however resulted in far worse systems. In my experience the left/social liberals are fine with seeing issues but useless with better answers. Solutions are complex and you would hope be taken seriously. Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Mar 2024 11.54am)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Nicholas91  The Democratic Republic of Kent 13 Mar 24 11.55am |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
He's right about a lot of the problems with party funding. But then again Marx was right about a lot of the problems with Capitalism.....Marx's solution to the ills of capitalism however resulted in far worse systems. Solutions are thus complex and you would hope taken seriously. It's exactly what I'd argue and hence why I describe the story as a 'nothingness'. All it does is provide a talking point for people with no power. I'd rather abstain... beyond football forums late in the morning
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
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| Behind Enemy Lines Sussex 13 Mar 24 12.04pm |
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Hmmm...how about not giving it to the asylum seeker but giving it straight to the people smuggler as settlement for the debt that the guy incurred in getting here? We could also give out £3000 to each of the guys relations back home so that they too could pay the smuggler to get them here too. Absolute tosh!
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
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| Badger11 Beckenham 13 Mar 24 12.05pm |
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Yes well argued. It's not just the sleazy Tories. Labour under Blair was happy to take money from dodgy businessmen and no doubt when Labour are in power we will get more stories. Then of course there are the Trade Unions and other left wing organisations that are happy to donate money and offer Labour MPs consultant roles. The whole system stinks.
One more point |
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| Stirlingsays 13 Mar 24 12.15pm |
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Originally posted by Nicholas91
It's exactly what I'd argue and hence why I describe the story as a 'nothingness'. All it does is provide a talking point for people with no power. I'd rather abstain... beyond football forums late in the morning You're probably right, just swinging handbags really.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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 Hrolf The Ganger 13 Mar 24 12.32pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
No you still don't get it. I am deliberately avoiding the discussion and all surrounding issues and laser focusing on his defence that his comment had nothing to do with her gender or skin colour. I know some posters on here can be a bit po-faced and intense, but come on! Not even the slightest crack of a smile? BTW, I am still laughing. Silvertop you naughty sausage. What I find most funny is the idea that Diane Abbott deserves sympathy and that someone saying that a person should be shot in that context is suddenly framed like he was a Mafia boss calling for a hit. It's a very old non story.
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| steeleye20 Croydon 13 Mar 24 12.50pm |
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Minister says 'not appropriate' to hand back donation. His brief 'postal affairs'. Kinda figures. Causing real damage, tories do not understand other's feelings in general.
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| EverybodyDannsNow SE19 13 Mar 24 12.50pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Stalin had exactly the same argument. People could say whatever they liked there as well....it was all about the consequences. Socially, I have little issue with people complaining about what he said.. That is itself free speech and thus not the concern. The concern is State and/or corporate (which is regulated by the state or increasingly monopolies) consequences are what is important. By dint of wealth this guy will probably not suffer life changing consequences but someone who wasn't loaded would. So the infringement is the chilling effect on people's opinions. The resultant manufactured consent aspect that this results in within all societies where significant consequences for opinions thrive. No one needs to protect the free speech they agree with. People see white people being slagged off all the time....people sacked for flying 'white lives matter' banners, jailed for two years for putting up stickers. Those are real world consequences for free speech that are a reflection of laws that embolden companies to take action out of fear (badgered by activists and threatened publicity) or compliance due to possible cases taken against them....again which Blair's laws started...'protected classes' being the catalyst.
Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Mar 2024 12.17pm) It's not a left perspective - that is evidenced in this thread alone. It's basic civility. On the free/speech consequences, I just don't understand what your expectation is; a public figure can say something so objectively reprehensible, but should also be immune from criticism? No one has the free speech to criticise what he said? IF he faces criminal consequences or anything like that, maybe the other examples would be relevant. As it is, a bloke with a public profile said something pretty abhorrent. The media report said words, the public react by finding said words abhorrent, and within a week the news cycle moves on. In your free speech land, how does that play out any different?
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| Hrolf The Ganger 13 Mar 24 12.54pm |
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Originally posted by steeleye20
Minister says 'not appropriate' to hand back donation. His brief 'postal affairs'. Kinda figures. Causing real damage, tories do not understand other's feelings in general.
Your obsession with the Tories is bordering on mental illness. Change the record for christ sake.
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| steeleye20 Croydon 13 Mar 24 1.27pm |
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US and UN voice concern at India PM Modi's new citizenship law effectively barring muslims. Do Sunak and Braverman think they should 'sit on the roofs of trains' as their multi=million donor does? Can they explain the 220,000 increase in immigrants from that country under their watch?
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| JRW2 Dulwich 13 Mar 24 1.45pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Was it absurd? He didn't say he hated Black people. Who cares if he does? If a Black person said that, the left would blame White people. It's all a game, and yes, I get it. You don't care. "Hi Fred, did you see in The Guardian that about five years ago someone or other allegedly said in a private conversation that some MP should be shot?" "What about it? Lots of people say that." "No, you don't get it. The person who said it was white and the other person was black." "So?" "Oh, keep up. You've been around for long enough. That means the first person must be a racist. Anyway, it's not just that. The person who said it was a man and the other one was a woman. So that means he must also be a mysogenist. Obvious innit?"
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| silvertop Portishead 13 Mar 24 1.52pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Silvertop you naughty sausage. What I find most funny is the idea that Diane Abbott deserves sympathy and that someone saying that a person should be shot in that context is suddenly framed like he was a Mafia boss calling for a hit. It's a very old non story. Yes, I think Arthur Negus reviewed this story and he is ALSO long dead.
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