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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Jan 17 10.25am | |
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Originally posted by Alexi_the_Eagle
Democracy is dead. It's only namedropped when it suits the sneering liberal elite and that smug cow known as Gina Miller, who looks down her nose at his ordinary folk. The Government was about to break the law. She has done them a favour. You should be pleased.
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Alexi_the_Eagle Newton-le-Willows 24 Jan 17 10.29am | |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
The Government was about to break the law. She has done them a favour. You should be pleased. By spitting on my vote and countless others? Yeah, I'll thank her once she stops harping on about democracy only when it suits her own agenda. I voted Leave (doesn't make me a racist), so I guess my vote doesn't count for anything now. Edited by Alexi_the_Eagle (24 Jan 2017 10.30am)
"Look at that. Accident blackspot? These aren't accidents! They're throwing themselves into the road gladly! Throwing themselves into the road to escape all this hideousness!" |
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OknotOK Cockfosters, London 24 Jan 17 10.54am | |
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Originally posted by Alexi_the_Eagle
By spitting on my vote and countless others? Yeah, I'll thank her once she stops harping on about democracy only when it suits her own agenda. I voted Leave (doesn't make me a racist), so I guess my vote doesn't count for anything now. Edited by Alexi_the_Eagle (24 Jan 2017 10.30am) That's not her fault, that's the fault of the government that drew up the legislation. And did so sufficiently ambiguously to allow this situation to arise. The decision today shows that if they had started the process without consulting parliament then they would have been breaking the law. There's no chance of article 50 not being triggered. Corbyn has instructed Labour MPs to vote in favour and there's only half a dozen Tory MPs at most who would vote against (and actually I suspect even less). So it will pass. And your vote will be heard. Just in the proper democratic way, as per the laws of this country.
"It's almost like a moral decision. Except not really cos noone is going to find out," Jez, Peep Show |
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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Jan 17 11.05am | |
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Originally posted by Alexi_the_Eagle
By spitting on my vote and countless others? Yeah, I'll thank her once she stops harping on about democracy only when it suits her own agenda. I voted Leave (doesn't make me a racist), so I guess my vote doesn't count for anything now. Edited by Alexi_the_Eagle (24 Jan 2017 10.30am) You voted Leave for Parliamentary sovereignty, control of, and that is exactly what you have been given today. An early Brexit present. You will get your wish re:the EU but at least now there will be scrutiny of any stupid and destructive proposals and powers to amend. This will bring the opposing sides a bit closer together and that can only be less harmful for the country as we enter turbulent times.
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Hoof Hearted 24 Jan 17 11.10am | |
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Originally posted by OknotOK
That's not her fault, that's the fault of the government that drew up the legislation. And did so sufficiently ambiguously to allow this situation to arise. The decision today shows that if they had started the process without consulting parliament then they would have been breaking the law. There's no chance of article 50 not being triggered. Corbyn has instructed Labour MPs to vote in favour and there's only half a dozen Tory MPs at most who would vote against (and actually I suspect even less). So it will pass. And your vote will be heard. Just in the proper democratic way, as per the laws of this country. Exactly... and the House of Lords is "on message" to. No decent politician will dare to deny the will of the people as the majority voted for last June. Idiots like Ken Clarke and Tim Farron are the exception.... even Corbyn understands the importance of giving the people what they want on this issue!
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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Jan 17 11.16am | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Exactly... and the House of Lords is "on message" to. No decent politician will dare to deny the will of the people as the majority voted for last June. Idiots like Ken Clarke and Tim Farron are the exception.... even Corbyn understands the importance of giving the people what they want on this issue! That's good to hear Hoof. So if there is a second referendum and Remain wins by say 51.9% to 48.1% I won't expect to hear any mullarkey
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OknotOK Cockfosters, London 24 Jan 17 11.20am | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Exactly... and the House of Lords is "on message" to. No decent politician will dare to deny the will of the people as the majority voted for last June. Idiots like Ken Clarke and Tim Farron are the exception.... even Corbyn understands the importance of giving the people what they want on this issue! So I don't get why this is such a big fcuking deal. Why are people so up in arms? Why are people on here saying "democracy is dead" and that "[people are] spitting on my vote"? It's just nuts. I didn't vote for Leave after a lot of internal debate. And I was surprised by the vote. But the idea that it shouldn't be respected (or even that it won't) is laughable. And responses like Alexi's point towards a serious paranoia that has been stoked by the likes of UKIP.
"It's almost like a moral decision. Except not really cos noone is going to find out," Jez, Peep Show |
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Hoof Hearted 24 Jan 17 11.32am | |
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Originally posted by OknotOK
So I don't get why this is such a big fcuking deal. Why are people so up in arms? Why are people on here saying "democracy is dead" and that "[people are] spitting on my vote"? It's just nuts. I didn't vote for Leave after a lot of internal debate. And I was surprised by the vote. But the idea that it shouldn't be respected (or even that it won't) is laughable. And responses like Alexi's point towards a serious paranoia that has been stoked by the likes of UKIP. Because people are lazy and/or uneducated? They only listen to snippets of news and jump to wrong conclusions. It's a pleasure for me to debate with people you - we are from the opposite ends of the political spectrum I suspect, but have common ground quite often.
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Sedlescombe Sedlescombe 24 Jan 17 11.51am | |
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British judges interpret British law and in a parliamentary democracy decide that Parliament is sovereign. Controversial? This is nothing to do with voting leave or remain and everything to do with honouring our democratic processes and opposing the arbitrary power of the executive. Of course the conservatives could have put in a clause into the referendum bill that would have made all this unnecessary. I wonder why the likes of May, IDS, Boris and Gove weren't arguing to make the result binding. Miller deserves a dame hood at the very least for services against democracy.
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hedgehog50 Croydon 24 Jan 17 11.56am | |
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When are we going to invade Poland, that's what I want to know.
We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell] |
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OknotOK Cockfosters, London 24 Jan 17 12.09pm | |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
Because people are lazy and/or uneducated? They only listen to snippets of news and jump to wrong conclusions. It's a pleasure for me to debate with people you - we are from the opposite ends of the political spectrum I suspect, but have common ground quite often. To be fair to them it isn't helped by "Enemies of the States" news headlines like the Mail and the Sun sent out - which were irresponsible. But anyone with a bit of common sense and reading more than two lines should be able to realise that the worst this would do is delay the trigger. People just need to calm down. I still believe it was the wrong decision, but the world isn't going to end because we've taken it. Nor is the entire democratic process being undermined because the actual UK parliament have to debate the most important political decision being taken for years. In fact maybe you're right, maybe people just are stupid and/or easily led sometimes. I give up! Edited by OknotOK (24 Jan 2017 12.09pm)
"It's almost like a moral decision. Except not really cos noone is going to find out," Jez, Peep Show |
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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 24 Jan 17 3.17pm | |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
That's good to hear Hoof. So if there is a second referendum and Remain wins by say 51.9% to 48.1% I won't expect to hear any mullarkey Someone will pipe up best out of 3 if that happened. Fact is, mp's are elected to vote for what they think is in their constituent's best interests not necessarily what the may have voted in the referendum. Already seen veiled death threats aimed at remain MPs on twitter. Jo Cox must be turning in her grave.
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