London Bridge

This page is no longer updated, and is the old forum. For new topics visit the New HOL forum.

London Bridge

Previous Topic | Next Topic

Page 50 of 61 < 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 >

Hrolf The Ganger 06 Jun 17 2.47pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 Yes, you can. Its typically the product of neurotransmitter imbalance in the central nervous system and brain. Schizophrenia occurs as a result of excessive dopamine, depression due to low levels of 5-HT / Serotonin. Bi-Polar. There isn't however anything insane about IS. It makes sense, in the same way Al-Qaeda makes sense - there is money, status and power in Islamist Jyhad and politics, and there always will be whilst the majority of countries that Muslims live in outside of Europe are typically brutal dictatorships in which only paramilitary oppositional politics survive. Indeed a lot of those Dictatorships / Monarchys and other tyrant types support their own factions of Islamist groups outside themselves as a means of political influence - and that's very true of countries like UAE, Saudi and Qatar - where the idea of funding Jyhadists abroad is very much about keeping the wolves from their own door. Because if your Jordan or Saud, the last thing you really want is those Islamist movements not having an enemy, because with absolute certainity, they'd be turning their attention to the middle east. Very good. That is why, but the results are not predictable or rational to anyone else. I think you give far too much credit to these murdering loons if you think they have a clearly defined strategy. They are acting out of desperation on behalf of an 'organisation' that is on the brink of defeat. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (06 Jun 2017 2.47pm)
Alert a moderator to this post

Hrolf The Ganger

06 Jun 17 2.47pm

Send a Private Message to Hrolf The Ganger

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Yes, you can. Its typically the product of neurotransmitter imbalance in the central nervous system and brain. Schizophrenia occurs as a result of excessive dopamine, depression due to low levels of 5-HT / Serotonin. Bi-Polar.

There isn't however anything insane about IS. It makes sense, in the same way Al-Qaeda makes sense - there is money, status and power in Islamist Jyhad and politics, and there always will be whilst the majority of countries that Muslims live in outside of Europe are typically brutal dictatorships in which only paramilitary oppositional politics survive.

Indeed a lot of those Dictatorships / Monarchys and other tyrant types support their own factions of Islamist groups outside themselves as a means of political influence - and that's very true of countries like UAE, Saudi and Qatar - where the idea of funding Jyhadists abroad is very much about keeping the wolves from their own door.

Because if your Jordan or Saud, the last thing you really want is those Islamist movements not having an enemy, because with absolute certainity, they'd be turning their attention to the middle east.

Very good. That is why, but the results are not predictable or rational to anyone else.

I think you give far too much credit to these murdering loons if you think they have a clearly defined strategy. They are acting out of desperation on behalf of an 'organisation' that is on the brink of defeat.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (06 Jun 2017 2.47pm)

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 06 Jun 17 2.56pm
Still the whole Saudi issue is a distraction. The problem we have here is more from pakistan and its forms than anywhere else. Islam, both Shia and Sunni suffer from socially conservative teachings that make integration into western perspectives very difficult and hence attraction to even more extreme interpretations by angry young men a possible response. If we only had Sufi Islams here then we wouldn't have a problem. We have a very long path to travel before things improve. Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Jun 2017 2.58pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays

06 Jun 17 2.56pm

Still the whole Saudi issue is a distraction.

The problem we have here is more from pakistan and its forms than anywhere else.

Islam, both Shia and Sunni suffer from socially conservative teachings that make integration into western perspectives very difficult and hence attraction to even more extreme interpretations by angry young men a possible response.

If we only had Sufi Islams here then we wouldn't have a problem.

We have a very long path to travel before things improve.

Edited by Stirlingsays (06 Jun 2017 2.58pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert a moderator to this post

nickgusset Shizzlehurst 06 Jun 17 3.57pm
[Tweet Link] Worth reading the whole twitter thread here. An interesting take on how the media promoted extremism.
Alert a moderator to this post

nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 06 Jun 17 3.57pm

[Tweet Link]

Worth reading the whole twitter thread here. An interesting take on how the media promoted extremism.

Alert a moderator to this post

hedgehog50 Croydon 06 Jun 17 4.17pm
Originally posted by nickgusset [Tweet Link] Worth reading the whole twitter thread here. An interesting take on how the media promoted extremism. It does make you wonder what would prompt action against these people. he appears on TV with an ISIS flag and spouts the usual fascist stuff and he is left on the streets. What's he got to do to be arrested, behead the TV reporter? If the program had been about one of the extreme white right wing outfits, and they spouted threats, their feet wouldn't have touched the ground, they would have been arrested and the usual suspects on here would be going on about the rise of the Fourth Reich. We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]
Alert a moderator to this post

hedgehog50

Croydon 06 Jun 17 4.17pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

[Tweet Link]

Worth reading the whole twitter thread here. An interesting take on how the media promoted extremism.

It does make you wonder what would prompt action against these people. he appears on TV with an ISIS flag and spouts the usual fascist stuff and he is left on the streets. What's he got to do to be arrested, behead the TV reporter? If the program had been about one of the extreme white right wing outfits, and they spouted threats, their feet wouldn't have touched the ground, they would have been arrested and the usual suspects on here would be going on about the rise of the Fourth Reich.

We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

Alert a moderator to this post

nickgusset Shizzlehurst 06 Jun 17 4.19pm
Originally posted by hedgehog50 It does make you wonder what would prompt action against these people. he appears on TV with an ISIS flag and spouts the usual fascist stuff and he is left on the streets. What's he got to do to be arrested, behead the TV reporter? If the program had been about one of the extreme white right wing outfits, and they spouted threats, their feet wouldn't have touched the ground, they would have been arrested and the usual suspects on here would be going on about the rise of the Fourth Reich. You obviously didn't read the twitter thread.
Alert a moderator to this post

nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 06 Jun 17 4.19pm

Originally posted by hedgehog50

You obviously didn't read the twitter thread.

Alert a moderator to this post

hedgehog50 Croydon 06 Jun 17 4.22pm
Originally posted by nickgusset You obviously didn't read the twitter thread. You don't seriously expect me to read any of your links surely. We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]
Alert a moderator to this post

hedgehog50

Croydon 06 Jun 17 4.22pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

You obviously didn't read the twitter thread.

You don't seriously expect me to read any of your links surely.

We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell]

Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721 Reading 06 Jun 17 4.32pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger Very good. That is why, but the results are not predictable or rational to anyone else. I think you give far too much credit to these murdering loons if you think they have a clearly defined strategy. They are acting out of desperation on behalf of an 'organisation' that is on the brink of defeat. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (06 Jun 2017 2.47pm) There is your motivation. Rationally, they're effectively being used as means of 'striking back at the perceived enemy'. Its not really unpredictable or irrational, they see themselves as the vanguard of IS in the UK, its weapons / 'soldiers' striking at a 'corrupt' western 'imperialist' and striking a blow for 'Islam' (admittedly their own interpretation). They don't see the 'IS' as on the brink of defeat, and I don't think we should either. Something else will replace IS, just as IS replaced Al-Qaeda - That void will be filled by equally dumb, young, idealist young Muslim, typically men, full of romanticised idealism and martyrdom, fighting 'the good fight' full of the power of ignorance, arrogance of having the only truth. Its just the message they're hearing and embracing is so much more violent and nihilistic than in previous generations. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721

Reading 06 Jun 17 4.32pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

Very good. That is why, but the results are not predictable or rational to anyone else.

I think you give far too much credit to these murdering loons if you think they have a clearly defined strategy. They are acting out of desperation on behalf of an 'organisation' that is on the brink of defeat.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (06 Jun 2017 2.47pm)

There is your motivation. Rationally, they're effectively being used as means of 'striking back at the perceived enemy'. Its not really unpredictable or irrational, they see themselves as the vanguard of IS in the UK, its weapons / 'soldiers' striking at a 'corrupt' western 'imperialist' and striking a blow for 'Islam' (admittedly their own interpretation).

They don't see the 'IS' as on the brink of defeat, and I don't think we should either. Something else will replace IS, just as IS replaced Al-Qaeda - That void will be filled by equally dumb, young, idealist young Muslim, typically men, full of romanticised idealism and martyrdom, fighting 'the good fight' full of the power of ignorance, arrogance of having the only truth.

Its just the message they're hearing and embracing is so much more violent and nihilistic than in previous generations.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 06 Jun 17 4.36pm
Originally posted by nickgusset You obviously didn't read the twitter thread. I read it and it's the usual excuse bullsh1t to blame the media. Choudary does represent thousands of British Muslims. Hell, there are three thousands on active British watch lists....over ten thousand as 'people of interest'. 'Progressives' head deeply buried in the sand as usual, looking for blame others and not listening to actual reality. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays

06 Jun 17 4.36pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

You obviously didn't read the twitter thread.

I read it and it's the usual excuse bullsh1t to blame the media.

Choudary does represent thousands of British Muslims. Hell, there are three thousands on active British watch lists....over ten thousand as 'people of interest'.

'Progressives' head deeply buried in the sand as usual, looking for blame others and not listening to actual reality.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721 Reading 06 Jun 17 4.39pm
Originally posted by hedgehog50 It does make you wonder what would prompt action against these people. he appears on TV with an ISIS flag and spouts the usual fascist stuff and he is left on the streets. What's he got to do to be arrested, behead the TV reporter? If the program had been about one of the extreme white right wing outfits, and they spouted threats, their feet wouldn't have touched the ground, they would have been arrested and the usual suspects on here would be going on about the rise of the Fourth Reich. It does make you wonder. But I guess its the right to free speech and assembly, and protest etc yeah I know liberal st, but when you start to say 'Ok only some topics are allowed it probably gets a bit 'dodgy'. What is acceptable? Personally, I think we could justify rounding up anyone who supports IS, the question is probably whether or not in the long run that would help, or create more sympathy for these cts. Personally, I'd argue that it goes too far sometime, and that it does appear the police and security services looked into him, and thought he was just another 'big mouth ct' and who knows, at the time, that might just be all he was back then. But if we start arresting every dumb ct who spouts a load of old fascist style clap trap and nonsense, we'll soon run out of space. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
Alert a moderator to this post

jamiemartin721

Reading 06 Jun 17 4.39pm

Originally posted by hedgehog50

It does make you wonder. But I guess its the right to free speech and assembly, and protest etc yeah I know liberal s**t, but when you start to say 'Ok only some topics are allowed it probably gets a bit 'dodgy'. What is acceptable? Personally, I think we could justify rounding up anyone who supports IS, the question is probably whether or not in the long run that would help, or create more sympathy for these c**ts.

Personally, I'd argue that it goes too far sometime, and that it does appear the police and security services looked into him, and thought he was just another 'big mouth c**t' and who knows, at the time, that might just be all he was back then.

But if we start arresting every dumb c**t who spouts a load of old fascist style clap trap and nonsense, we'll soon run out of space.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

Alert a moderator to this post

Part Time James 06 Jun 17 4.43pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 It does make you wonder. But I guess its the right to free speech and assembly, and protest etc yeah I know liberal st, but when you start to say 'Ok only some topics are allowed it probably gets a bit 'dodgy'. What is acceptable? Personally, I think we could justify rounding up anyone who supports IS, the question is probably whether or not in the long run that would help, or create more sympathy for these cts. Personally, I'd argue that it goes too far sometime, and that it does appear the police and security services looked into him, and thought he was just another 'big mouth ct' and who knows, at the time, that might just be all he was back then. But if we start arresting every dumb ct who spouts a load of old fascist style clap trap and nonsense, we'll soon run out of space. Not if we deport them. This forum could be quiet though.
Alert a moderator to this post

Part Time James

06 Jun 17 4.43pm

Send a Private Message to Part Time James

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

But if we start arresting every dumb c**t who spouts a load of old fascist style clap trap and nonsense, we'll soon run out of space.

Not if we deport them. This forum could be quiet though.

Alert a moderator to this post

Hrolf The Ganger 06 Jun 17 4.45pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 There is your motivation. Rationally, they're effectively being used as means of 'striking back at the perceived enemy'. Its not really unpredictable or irrational, they see themselves as the vanguard of IS in the UK, its weapons / 'soldiers' striking at a 'corrupt' western 'imperialist' and striking a blow for 'Islam' (admittedly their own interpretation). They don't see the 'IS' as on the brink of defeat, and I don't think we should either. Something else will replace IS, just as IS replaced Al-Qaeda - That void will be filled by equally dumb, young, idealist young Muslim, typically men, full of romanticised idealism and martyrdom, fighting 'the good fight' full of the power of ignorance, arrogance of having the only truth. Its just the message they're hearing and embracing is so much more violent and nihilistic than in previous generations. Their motivation might be real and not caused by clinical insanity but to any normal person, their motives are not rational. To die and to kill for a cause, you need it to be worth something. Their actions are all but worthless. I disagree that IS will not be defeated. Right now they are a military force that cannot possibly hold out against the forces against it. The idea will survive as ideas do but without teeth the threat will diminish. If your interpretation is correct and IS prevail in some form then I cannot think of a better reason why we don't take much stronger action against sympathisers in Britain. The law will have to be rewritten to accommodate the circumstances. The public will soon be demanding it very loudly if attacks continue. Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (06 Jun 2017 4.45pm)
Alert a moderator to this post

Hrolf The Ganger

06 Jun 17 4.45pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Its just the message they're hearing and embracing is so much more violent and nihilistic than in previous generations.

Their motivation might be real and not caused by clinical insanity but to any normal person, their motives are not rational. To die and to kill for a cause, you need it to be worth something. Their actions are all but worthless.
I disagree that IS will not be defeated. Right now they are a military force that cannot possibly hold out against the forces against it. The idea will survive as ideas do but without teeth the threat will diminish.
If your interpretation is correct and IS prevail in some form then I cannot think of a better reason why we don't take much stronger action against sympathisers in Britain. The law will have to be rewritten to accommodate the circumstances. The public will soon be demanding it very loudly if attacks continue.

Edited by Hrolf The Ganger (06 Jun 2017 4.45pm)

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 06 Jun 17 4.46pm
Deportation not internment. A financial agreement struck with a country like Jordan or Egypt to take our radicals. Internment is more trouble than its worth. British law needs changing first to allow that to happen...Human rights lawyers would be all over it...But It's a question of our tolerance for violence against the citizens of our state. That's just dealing with the worst of our radicals here. We need to let the reformers control what forms of Islam are allowed in British mosques. Social conservatism has to go. Unfortunately I expect that I'll be seeing plenty more of our children and adults being murdered on our streets before a leader takes charge who will actually have the balls to do what is necessary. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays

06 Jun 17 4.46pm

Deportation not internment. A financial agreement struck with a country like Jordan or Egypt to take our radicals.

Internment is more trouble than its worth.

British law needs changing first to allow that to happen...Human rights lawyers would be all over it...But It's a question of our tolerance for violence against the citizens of our state.

That's just dealing with the worst of our radicals here. We need to let the reformers control what forms of Islam are allowed in British mosques. Social conservatism has to go.

Unfortunately I expect that I'll be seeing plenty more of our children and adults being murdered on our streets before a leader takes charge who will actually have the balls to do what is necessary.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Alert a moderator to this post

Page 50 of 61 < 46 47 48 49 50 51 52 53 54 >

Previous Topic | Next Topic

Crystal Palace FC Supporters' Website - The Holmesdale Online

London Bridge

Site Map

New users

Existing users

Sponsors