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Clapham Acid attack
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 silvertop  Portishead 02 Feb 24 11.54am |
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As a post script and by way of who you are arguing with, I may come across as a lefty progressive, but my views are less partisan. I do appreciate the erosion of our culture and communities for the sake of some unachievable, multi cultural idyl. It is one that, seemingly, can only be secured by always favouring those of colour against the indigenous, vast majority. Thus, even posting this classifies me as nationalist, reactionary and racist such is the new witch hunt culture in which we live. However, where we part is that I am also a free marketeer and favour the free movement of labour. If we can't knock out the kids, then we have to import a young labour force from elsewhere to work the factories, offices and farms to produce the tax money to pay for the irreversibly increasing population who are too old and/or sick to work. I would have preferred them to be European, but you voted against that.
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The groover  Danbury 02 Feb 24 11.55am |
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What I don't understand is how this scumbag was allowed asylum?
The person(s) who signed off on this should hang their heads in shame. I'm sure the usual suspects will be defending him.
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PalazioVecchio  south pole 02 Feb 24 12.00pm |
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is it safe for a defenceless woman to walk around a Park in Outer London ? compared to the 1980's ? certainly not.
Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford |
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| PalazioVecchio south pole 02 Feb 24 12.05pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
However, where we part is that I am also a free marketeer and favour the free movement of labour. If we can't knock out the kids, then we have to import a young labour force from elsewhere to work the factories, offices and farms to produce the tax money to pay for the irreversibly increasing population who are too old and/or sick to work. I would have preferred them to be European, but you voted against that. we are importing Longterm unemployed criminals. And other longterm unemployed high-fertility types.....who clone themselves into the next generation of the same. Not your Shoreditch hi-tech world class workforce.....but something else. a burden on the taxpayer and a bane on crime & social cohesion. It's not multi-culti when the whole street speaks one foreign language and YOU are not welcome there. and can they date your women ? can you marry/date their young ladies..... What do the statistics say ? Edited by PalazioVecchio (02 Feb 2024 12.08pm) Edited by PalazioVecchio (02 Feb 2024 12.10pm)
Kayla did Anfield & Old Trafford |
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HKOwen  Hong Kong 02 Feb 24 12.17pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
As a post script and by way of who you are arguing with, I may come across as a lefty progressive, but my views are less partisan. I do appreciate the erosion of our culture and communities for the sake of some unachievable, multi cultural idyl. It is one that, seemingly, can only be secured by always favouring those of colour against the indigenous, vast majority. Thus, even posting this classifies me as nationalist, reactionary and racist such is the new witch hunt culture in which we live. However, where we part is that I am also a free marketeer and favour the free movement of labour. If we can't knock out the kids, then we have to import a young labour force from elsewhere to work the factories, offices and farms to produce the tax money to pay for the irreversibly increasing population who are too old and/or sick to work. I would have preferred them to be European, but you voted against that. I am quite ok with a vetted labour importation scheme as and when required to fill shortages. Surely you're not proposing that the illegal immigrants be welcomed into the works force. We were not inundated with Europeans wanting to work in hard jobs and those that came were often exploited. We need to pay better wages for our own people to do undesirable jobs, if that doesn't work then have prison labour work gangs
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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 Hrolf The Ganger 02 Feb 24 12.29pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
As a post script and by way of who you are arguing with, I may come across as a lefty progressive, but my views are less partisan. I do appreciate the erosion of our culture and communities for the sake of some unachievable, multi cultural idyl. It is one that, seemingly, can only be secured by always favouring those of colour against the indigenous, vast majority. Thus, even posting this classifies me as nationalist, reactionary and racist such is the new witch hunt culture in which we live. However, where we part is that I am also a free marketeer and favour the free movement of labour. If we can't knock out the kids, then we have to import a young labour force from elsewhere to work the factories, offices and farms to produce the tax money to pay for the irreversibly increasing population who are too old and/or sick to work. I would have preferred them to be European, but you voted against that. I did nothing of the sort. I see no reason why not being a part of the EU should stop Europeans coming here for work. This is a problem created by politicians once again.
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| silvertop Portishead 02 Feb 24 12.41pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
I did nothing of the sort. I see no reason why not being a part of the EU should stop Europeans coming here for work. This is a problem created by politicians once again. If you voted Leave then you did, whether intentionally or otherwise. Remain with strict non-EU immigration enforcement is my way. If there are e.g. ECHR barriers to effective policy - then change it from within. An open door in the current political climate.
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| silvertop Portishead 02 Feb 24 1.03pm |
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Originally posted by HKOwen
I am quite ok with a vetted labour importation scheme as and when required to fill shortages. Surely you're not proposing that the illegal immigrants be welcomed into the works force. We were not inundated with Europeans wanting to work in hard jobs and those that came were often exploited. We need to pay better wages for our own people to do undesirable jobs, if that doesn't work then have prison labour work gangs Actually we did have a nice flow of cheap EU labour doing tough undesirable work. Some did work under modern slavery conditions, but they were exploited by criminals. Most worked under conditions that they considered tolerable but which our snowflakes would not get out of bed for. Those you call "our own" people are either already employed or are not rated by the average employer. And businesses like farms who operate at the very margins of existence cannot pay better wages. There is no chance of e.g. government subsidy to cover the gap if there are insufficient funds to support our defence, criminal justice system, or health care. As to allowing illegal immigrants into the work force, that seems an easy argument for you but a tough one for me. Stopping new migrants, yes. But for those already here, the cost of tracking, processing and deporting is beyond prohibitive. Obama considered a full amnesty in the US given the scale of the issue. I can expect the backlash on here for that, but the idea is not altogether daft. Firstly, they are already here. You would not be further diluting our culture. Secondly, all the resources wasted on chasing them would be devoted to border enforcement with no expense spared. The message will go out: only legal immigrants through proper channels will get in. All others will be caught and put on a plane to Rwanda etc. Thirdly, it is an amnesty. They are granted no passport, right to remain, or other legal status. If they want to leave they need to apply to the embassy of their origin for a passport and travel on that with the understanding that it is a one-way ticket. If they commit any offence, it is immediate deportation with non custodial sentences and post sentence deportation otherwise. They are not asylum seekers so have no right to housing, health care, or other public service and will be made aware of that from day one. Again, once the word gets out, Calais will be a much quieter place.
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Teddy Eagle  02 Feb 24 1.06pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
If you voted Leave then you did, whether intentionally or otherwise. Remain with strict non-EU immigration enforcement is my way. If there are e.g. ECHR barriers to effective policy - then change it from within. An open door in the current political climate. Can we change ECHR rules? Aren't they legally binding?
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| Behind Enemy Lines Sussex 02 Feb 24 1.09pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Here is my problem. When we allow a number of asylum seekers from certain places, you will always get a small but significant number of criminal types. We seem incapable of vetting people sufficiently, so the only other way to prevent the deluge of crime committed by migrants is to stop migration from certain countries. We are told that these people aren't safe where they come from, despite them often travelling through multiple countries to get here. I may have said this before, so apologies if I have, but if those fleeing persecution do not consider France or Europe a safe place, then the UK Government should declare France unsafe to travel to. As such you would not be able to get travel insurance and the block on travel would mean France would lose tens of millions of Euros from the UK travellers. That would focus their minds enough to sort out the problem on their side of the channel. Extreme? Yes. But so is the problem we have.
hats off to palace, they were always gonna be louder, and hate to say it but they were impressive ALL bouncing and singing. |
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| HKOwen Hong Kong 02 Feb 24 1.32pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Actually we did have a nice flow of cheap EU labour doing tough undesirable work. Some did work under modern slavery conditions, but they were exploited by criminals. Most worked under conditions that they considered tolerable but which our snowflakes would not get out of bed for. Those you call "our own" people are either already employed or are not rated by the average employer. And businesses like farms who operate at the very margins of existence cannot pay better wages. There is no chance of e.g. government subsidy to cover the gap if there are insufficient funds to support our defence, criminal justice system, or health care. As to allowing illegal immigrants into the work force, that seems an easy argument for you but a tough one for me. Stopping new migrants, yes. But for those already here, the cost of tracking, processing and deporting is beyond prohibitive. Obama considered a full amnesty in the US given the scale of the issue. I can expect the backlash on here for that, but the idea is not altogether daft. Firstly, they are already here. You would not be further diluting our culture. Secondly, all the resources wasted on chasing them would be devoted to border enforcement with no expense spared. The message will go out: only legal immigrants through proper channels will get in. All others will be caught and put on a plane to Rwanda etc. Thirdly, it is an amnesty. They are granted no passport, right to remain, or other legal status. If they want to leave they need to apply to the embassy of their origin for a passport and travel on that with the understanding that it is a one-way ticket. If they commit any offence, it is immediate deportation with non custodial sentences and post sentence deportation otherwise. They are not asylum seekers so have no right to housing, health care, or other public service and will be made aware of that from day one. Again, once the word gets out, Calais will be a much quieter place. Our own people are UK citizens, nothing sinister there. We have created a situation where we can only deport people where their country of origin is established, should be to where they last were prior to arriving in UK. It is a complete mess, first thing to do is stop more coming, we are already completely stretched on public services Edited by HKOwen (02 Feb 2024 1.35pm)
Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance. |
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| Hrolf The Ganger 02 Feb 24 1.51pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
If you voted Leave then you did, whether intentionally or otherwise. Remain with strict non-EU immigration enforcement is my way. If there are e.g. ECHR barriers to effective policy - then change it from within. An open door in the current political climate. I think you are kidding yourself. These problems didn't start with Brexit. Whey do you think people voted for it?
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