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Ben Davies (rumour)

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mattteo Flag 09 Jan 17 11.24am Send a Private Message to mattteo Add mattteo as a friend

Originally posted by Goal Machine

How many full backs can you name who have had 10-12 goals/assists in a season? Unless you're the penalty taker (Baines/Unsworth/Irwin) it's not easy.


Given playing time of around 4.000 minutes in all competitions, all of the ones I mentioned in that list would provide 8-12 goals and assists (together).
Based on history, experience, qualities, age.

 

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spartakev2 Flag Anerley 09 Jan 17 1.46pm Send a Private Message to spartakev2 Add spartakev2 as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo


Given playing time of around 4.000 minutes in all competitions, all of the ones I mentioned in that list would provide 8-12 goals and assists (together).
Based on history, experience, qualities, age.

You seem to be the only one who doesn't like him. Played well whenever I've seen him. For me, a Welsh international, who is only kept out of the spurs team by danny rose and only 23....yes please.amazes me that some fans see players like this are not good enough for little old palace...

 

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Y Ddraig Goch Flag In The Crowd 09 Jan 17 2.18pm Send a Private Message to Y Ddraig Goch Add Y Ddraig Goch as a friend

Originally posted by spartakev2

You seem to be the only one who doesn't like him. Played well whenever I've seen him. For me, a Welsh international, who is only kept out of the spurs team by danny rose and only 23....yes please.amazes me that some fans see players like this are not good enough for little old palace...

matteo would do well to remember the adage

Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital

 


the dignified don't even enter in the game

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CrazyBadger Flag Ware 09 Jan 17 2.51pm Send a Private Message to CrazyBadger Add CrazyBadger as a friend

Originally posted by Hudsoneagle

That's not the bloody point though is it!

We are scoring goals! That isn't the problem.

We need to make the defence less leaky. I don't even think a LB is the problem personally I think it is centre mid but this thread is about Ben Davies and with regards to him I'd say yes sign him he's better than Papa and he's better than Ward so he'd be our best full back. Simple.

We haven't been scoring many goals recently though, have we?
Also, Maybe we've been Scoring goals because we've been setup without a recognised DM, Leaving our defence exposed. recently SA has been playing with 2 DM's, and our defence has improved somewhat. also our goals have 'dried up' a little too.

so perhaps with a different system/Manager, we need a new way to transition defence into attack.

get him on board.

 


"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"

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Hudsoneagle Flag 09 Jan 17 3.29pm Send a Private Message to Hudsoneagle Add Hudsoneagle as a friend

Originally posted by CrazyBadger

We haven't been scoring many goals recently though, have we?
Also, Maybe we've been Scoring goals because we've been setup without a recognised DM, Leaving our defence exposed. recently SA has been playing with 2 DM's, and our defence has improved somewhat. also our goals have 'dried up' a little too.

so perhaps with a different system/Manager, we need a new way to transition defence into attack.

get him on board.

Actually what I have been saying is that I keenly support the idea of signing Ben Davies and Matteo has said he doesn't think he is good enough offensively...I actually would prefer to have Ben Davies at the club than an unknown because I just feel the defense needs to click asap.

I understand the point Matteo is making but the plain truth is that if a better player was available that we could afford and was available for transfer right now then wouldn't we be in for him??? Even taking Matteo's vast superior knowledge of players I would still think the club know having spoke to agents who is and who isn't available and at what price.

 

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Nobbybm Flag Dartford 09 Jan 17 3.31pm Send a Private Message to Nobbybm Add Nobbybm as a friend

SA's track record seems to show he'll play 2 DM's or even 1 + another defender in front of the back 4 until such time as they look like a capable unit. Then 1 of the DM's will go.

I can see this being the case with us if he can get a couple of signings in & Jimmy Mac back in the side.

 


Will this be five? It's gonna be five! It IS five!

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mattteo Flag 09 Jan 17 4.06pm Send a Private Message to mattteo Add mattteo as a friend

Originally posted by Y Ddraig Goch

matteo would do well to remember the adage

Statistics are like bikinis. What they reveal is suggestive, but what they conceal is vital


I hear you, but it's not just about statistics. They only reveal that Ben Davies can't cross and the others I mentioned can.

Defensively....it's about watching matches. I have watched many of them. It's difficult to say who is better at tackling, who recovers more. I don't have these statistics. You could go to whoscored and read some there, but even they aren't that trustworthy. I just can't agree that Konstantin Rausch and Fabio Coentrao can't tackle as well as Davies. I've seen Davies play and I just wasn't impressed. He stood well in defence but didn't strike me as an awesome tackler.
While I know Coentao, I know Rausch, I know Gibbs and they fight and fight for 90 minutes continuously.

Years ago, when Pocchetino was enamored with Ben Davies and bought him from Swansea, I said that Danny Rose is the best English left back and actually third in the world, only behind Marcelo and maybe Alba/Alaba.

People laughed and called me Rudolph, told me I have a red nose They said that Rose is not good enough, that Ben Davies will be a starter, that Pochettino knows what he's doing and he's right in dropping Rose, that Rose leaves too much space behind him.
But I could see the fire he plays with, the ambition he has when he runs after an opponent and when he tackles. Although Rose makes 1 or 2 mistakes sometimes too, he's really solid now both in defence and in the offence. He won this for himself, forced Pocchetino to field him.

Ben Davies may be still young, perhaps he'll develop in years, But he's the risk, not if you bring a player like Rausch, Coentrao, Augustinsson or Platenhardt from another league.
These guys are a certainty, even if they'll not be amazing from the 1st match.
A guy like Ben Davies is not a certainty, even though he plays in the Premier League.

 

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Hudsoneagle Flag 09 Jan 17 4.28pm Send a Private Message to Hudsoneagle Add Hudsoneagle as a friend

Isn't Coentrao a Real Madrid player who has had injury problems?

Is he actually available and would he really leave Real Madrid and his best buddy Ronaldo to come to Palace and help us in a relegation battle?

 

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Hudsoneagle Flag 09 Jan 17 4.36pm Send a Private Message to Hudsoneagle Add Hudsoneagle as a friend

And then there is Rausch who on paper looks like he should be a good left back...but then even he has been available on a free transfer twice and he has never been signed by a top German club.

 

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Hudsoneagle Flag 09 Jan 17 4.43pm Send a Private Message to Hudsoneagle Add Hudsoneagle as a friend

I would love Palace to sign Gibbs and if it was a direct choice between Gibbs and Davies I think I would pick Gibbs but do we have a chance? Is he fit? He didn't make the bench against Preston so I think he is currently injured.

Who would you prefer out of the players we are being linked with?

Rousillon is it?
Ben Davies
Schlupp?
Van Aanholt?
Chambers? Who may play right back and Ward stays out left you never know.

 

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mattteo Flag 09 Jan 17 4.59pm Send a Private Message to mattteo Add mattteo as a friend

Originally posted by Hudsoneagle

I would love Palace to sign Gibbs and if it was a direct choice between Gibbs and Davies I think I would pick Gibbs but do we have a chance? Is he fit? He didn't make the bench against Preston so I think he is currently injured.

Who would you prefer out of the players we are being linked with?

Rousillon is it?
Ben Davies
Schlupp?
Van Aanholt?
Chambers? Who may play right back and Ward stays out left you never know.


van Aanholt is waaaay out of Palace's league.
You think Crystal can't get Gibbs but can get van Aanholt?
Arsenal wants to bring in someone else and let Gibbs go, but Sunderland would NEVER give up on van Aanholt without 20 million.

 

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ThatPetrolRelation Flag Ottawa 09 Jan 17 5.00pm Send a Private Message to ThatPetrolRelation Add ThatPetrolRelation as a friend

Originally posted by mattteo


I hear you, but it's not just about statistics. They only reveal that Ben Davies can't cross and the others I mentioned can.

Defensively....it's about watching matches. I have watched many of them. It's difficult to say who is better at tackling, who recovers more. I don't have these statistics. You could go to whoscored and read some there, but even they aren't that trustworthy. I just can't agree that Konstantin Rausch and Fabio Coentrao can't tackle as well as Davies. I've seen Davies play and I just wasn't impressed. He stood well in defence but didn't strike me as an awesome tackler.
While I know Coentao, I know Rausch, I know Gibbs and they fight and fight for 90 minutes continuously.

Years ago, when Pocchetino was enamored with Ben Davies and bought him from Swansea, I said that Danny Rose is the best English left back and actually third in the world, only behind Marcelo and maybe Alba/Alaba.

People laughed and called me Rudolph, told me I have a red nose They said that Rose is not good enough, that Ben Davies will be a starter, that Pochettino knows what he's doing and he's right in dropping Rose, that Rose leaves too much space behind him.
But I could see the fire he plays with, the ambition he has when he runs after an opponent and when he tackles. Although Rose makes 1 or 2 mistakes sometimes too, he's really solid now both in defence and in the offence. He won this for himself, forced Pocchetino to field him.

Ben Davies may be still young, perhaps he'll develop in years, But he's the risk, not if you bring a player like Rausch, Coentrao, Augustinsson or Platenhardt from another league.
These guys are a certainty, even if they'll not be amazing from the 1st match.
A guy like Ben Davies is not a certainty, even though he plays in the Premier League.

Bringing in players from other leagues is never a certainty. A lot of players just don't adapt to the Prem, who do very well elsewhere (I will spare you my list of flops). Some take a season to adapt, and we don't have the luxury of that kind of learning curve.
So bringing in an out-of-favour Prem LB is a smart strategy. However, since every team wants squad depth, most don't want to sell them. Especially in January when replacing them is extra tough.

I don't care if Davies can't score much, or there is a long fantasy-list of players who might be better.
For me, there are only two questions regarding our targets: can we sign them (including do they want to play for a 17th place team), and are they better than what we have?

Davies is a better LB than Kelly and Fryers. So I say buy him if he'll sign! As to your other concern long term. Same question, can we buy a better LB? If yes, then Davies sits on the bench. If we can buy 2, then we sell Davies in the summer--what's the issue?

The problem with the January transfer window is that everybody wants to buy, but no one wants to sell (except garbage). I mean with so many players out we can't even afford to sell Mutch until we have a replacement.

Beggars can't be choosers, and we are relegation-fight beggars.

 

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