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Lily Allen
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 Stirlingsays  13 Oct 16 9.50am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
And while we are on the subject, let's get rid of the phrase virtue signalling which is just a s***e way to belittle people who go out of their way to help others. Errr...no it isn't. It's perfect for situations like Kylie Minogue and husband publicly refusing to get married unless a country changes its laws.....That was almost vomit inspiring virtue signalling. It can be over-used I'll grant you this....and while I really really dislike Lily Allen and her tw-t of a father (talented actor accepted) I wouldn't accuse her of virtue signalling in this case....She's just been completely over emotional and wrong to apologise for a country....She has a right to her opinion but no right to speak for me. We can't even house our own people and lefties want to make the situation worse by opening our doors to mostly economic migrants from repressive social cultures. Genuinely abandoned children I would do something about....But there are several safe countries between here and the middle east and people illegally coming to the UK isn't an acceptable course of action. Once you open the door you just encourage more....Let those who vote in governments that want increased immigration take them. Go to Sweden or Denmark, go to Germany....Let them have the benefits of higher rape and sexual assault averages....(Sweden and Denmark now have the highest rates in Europe) Edited by Stirlingsays (13 Oct 2016 9.52am)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| chris123 hove actually 13 Oct 16 9.51am |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Teresa May's government has no real political mandate to justify triggering article 50. The country needs a general election, with manifesto's presented by each party to really legitimately establish what the British People want from an exit, and who they want to lead that exit. Otherwise, the Tories are in a situation that's arguably less democratic that Gordon Brown's reign, trying to establish what is arguably the UKs single most important political change in 50 or 60 years - with a leader unelected by the people, and no manifesto put before the people on that subject. Unlike Brown there wasn't even the notion that May would be the next leader of the Conservative party, or that Cameron would step down to make way for her (in fact I'd wager most Conservatives didn't even consider her as the likely next leader of the Party, let alone the UK). Antithesis of democratic rule. The Tories had promised a referendum - the country decided, and now the Government have started the Brexit process. I can't help think that anyone who views this is undemocratic has still to get over the fact that they were in a minority.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 13 Oct 16 10.09am |
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Originally posted by chris123
The Tories had promised a referendum - the country decided, and now the Government have started the Brexit process. I can't help think that anyone who views this is undemocratic has still to get over the fact that they were in a minority. Except I voted for an exit, not for remain. The referendum was a simple stay or leave. I voted leave, but I'm going to bet that not everyone voting leave also voted for the conservative party either. Which is the issue. Stay or leave is a simple decision, the real political consideration is what form does the UK take in a post-EU environment - Something no political party has put forward a manifesto to the people on. This is probably the most important decision the UK has taken, and it will be one on which the only say the people have had is on whether to leave or stay, and not what they want, expect or desire from the process of leaving. I might be old fashioned, but democracy is about the party political promises and policys being effectively ratified by the people at an election. Its also pretty clear that Brexit's leaders have a) been marginalised b) had no real plan for an exit strategy anyhow c) did not include Teresa May. F**k me, Tory's were up in arms over the Gay Marriage vote not being in their manifesto.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| chris123 hove actually 13 Oct 16 10.21am |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Except I voted for an exit, not for remain. The referendum was a simple stay or leave. I voted leave, but I'm going to bet that not everyone voting leave also voted for the conservative party either. Which is the issue. Stay or leave is a simple decision, the real political consideration is what form does the UK take in a post-EU environment - Something no political party has put forward a manifesto to the people on. This is probably the most important decision the UK has taken, and it will be one on which the only say the people have had is on whether to leave or stay, and not what they want, expect or desire from the process of leaving. I might be old fashioned, but democracy is about the party political promises and policys being effectively ratified by the people at an election. Its also pretty clear that Brexit's leaders have a) been marginalised b) had no real plan for an exit strategy anyhow c) did not include Teresa May. F**k me, Tory's were up in arms over the Gay Marriage vote not being in their manifesto. No disagree - democracy is allowing an elected Government govern - supplemented with once in a blue moon referenda, particularly when it's a manifesto promise.
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| Hoof Hearted 13 Oct 16 10.31am | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Teresa May's government has no real political mandate to justify triggering article 50. The country needs a general election, with manifesto's presented by each party to really legitimately establish what the British People want from an exit, and who they want to lead that exit. Otherwise, the Tories are in a situation that's arguably less democratic that Gordon Brown's reign, trying to establish what is arguably the UKs single most important political change in 50 or 60 years - with a leader unelected by the people, and no manifesto put before the people on that subject. Unlike Brown there wasn't even the notion that May would be the next leader of the Conservative party, or that Cameron would step down to make way for her (in fact I'd wager most Conservatives didn't even consider her as the likely next leader of the Party, let alone the UK). Antithesis of democratic rule. You don't elect PM's... everyone votes individually in their own constituency. The fact that the Conservatives got enough votes to have a majority gives them the mandate to rule...and choose their leader. Brown was just a w*nker in waiting.
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| Stuk Top half 13 Oct 16 1.19pm |
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To quote her own song. f*** you very much.
Optimistic as ever |
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| Part Time James 13 Oct 16 1.49pm |
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Wow, she's definitely an ambassador for the English people.
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| DanH SW2 13 Oct 16 2.12pm |
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Buzzing that people are genuinely more annoyed about a C list pop star going to visit some refugees and showing a bit too much emotion than our currency being worth less than it ever has in our lifetimes. The modern world is a weird place. Edited by DanH (13 Oct 2016 2.13pm)
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 13 Oct 16 2.14pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
You don't elect PM's... everyone votes individually in their own constituency. The fact that the Conservatives got enough votes to have a majority gives them the mandate to rule...and choose their leader. Brown was just a w*nker in waiting. Not what you said about Brown though I'll bet. We need a general election around the Brexit policy, simply because none of the decisions, negotiations, directions or policy's have any political mandate of agreement. The public have only voted on leaving the EU. The real question is what a post-EU UK will look like, and how its pursued. You can't have that without manifestos, and you can't validate a manifesto without a general election (which I suspect at the present moment the Conservative Party will walk). That's pretty much how British political democracy works - Parties lay out a manifesto for change, that we vote on. No manifesto promise - no mandate. Its not like this is something minor - this will affect every single citizen in the UK, including those not born yet, for at least a couple of generations. Leaving the EU isn't the same as 'agreeing with all Conservative policy on leaving the EU' I agree, you vote for your MP, and the leader is chosen by the party. However, no single party in the UK has put a manifesto to the public, for election, on a post-EU Britain.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| chris123 hove actually 13 Oct 16 2.21pm |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Not what you said about Brown though I'll bet. We need a general election around the Brexit policy, simply because none of the decisions, negotiations, directions or policy's have any political mandate of agreement. The public have only voted on leaving the EU. The real question is what a post-EU UK will look like, and how its pursued. You can't have that without manifestos, and you can't validate a manifesto without a general election (which I suspect at the present moment the Conservative Party will walk). That's pretty much how British political democracy works - Parties lay out a manifesto for change, that we vote on. No manifesto promise - no mandate. Its not like this is something minor - this will affect every single citizen in the UK, including those not born yet, for at least a couple of generations. Leaving the EU isn't the same as 'agreeing with all Conservative policy on leaving the EU' I agree, you vote for your MP, and the leader is chosen by the party. However, no single party in the UK has put a manifesto to the public, for election, on a post-EU Britain. Jamie - your premise and your conclusion are in complete reverse.
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| bubble wrap Carparks in South East London 13 Oct 16 3.20pm |
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Originally posted by Hoof Hearted
In fact Lily Allen can join Nicola Sturgeon, Diane Abbott, Hilary Clinton, Merkel and the silly cow who's put a legal challenge into the decision that our lovely PM has made to trigger EU clause 50 next March. What is it with these women? My Mrs, Becks and Teresa May and a few other notable exceptions aside... women should not get involved in serious stuff.
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| Hoof Hearted 13 Oct 16 3.36pm | |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
Not what you said about Brown though I'll bet. The public have only voted on leaving the EU. The real question is what a post-EU UK will look like, and how its pursued. You can't have that without manifestos, and you can't validate a manifesto without a general election (which I suspect at the present moment the Conservative Party will walk). That's pretty much how British political democracy works - Parties lay out a manifesto for change, that we vote on. No manifesto promise - no mandate. Its not like this is something minor - this will affect every single citizen in the UK, including those not born yet, for at least a couple of generations. Leaving the EU isn't the same as 'agreeing with all Conservative policy on leaving the EU' I agree, you vote for your MP, and the leader is chosen by the party. However, no single party in the UK has put a manifesto to the public, for election, on a post-EU Britain. As I said, he was a w*nker in waiting!
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