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Calais migrant trouble
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nickgusset  Shizzlehurst 03 Aug 15 10.47pm |
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Quote -TUX- at 03 Aug 2015 10.21pm
Quote serial thriller at 03 Aug 2015 9.49pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 02 Aug 2015 9.18am
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 2.04pm
Quote leggedstruggle at 01 Aug 2015 1.15pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? No and no. Now answer my questions.
You are right I did leave out important factors - I completely underestimated the amount of building required to cope with our increased population after rampant immigration comes to fruition:- As previously stated we will need hundreds of thousands new homes, schools, GP surgeries and hospitals. What I omitted was new factories, offices, supermarkets, distribution centres, warehouses, car parks, train stations, places of entertainment and presumably bigger and bigger mosques? After all these new arrivals will have to work, eat, be entertained and pray to Allah. I ask you, or anyone else advocating wholesale immigration to the UK........ where is all the space to accommodate these people and the infrastructure needed to allow them to go about living their new daily lives? I've already discounted the suggestion made by Serial Thriller who mistakenly believed we had 97% of UK land to build on - can anyone answer this simple question?
What I have pointed out, and what I see you've conveniently ignored, is the fact that we have an estimated 200 000 sites for property on brown belt land available in this country - easily enough not just to house our own homeless but those in Calais. I also read something interesting today which shows how hypocritical we are when it comes to housing. Apparently Herefordshire has built around 40 broiler units (chicken houses) accommodating thousands of chickens each, in the last 12 months. That's one county, in one year, building homes for what must be hundreds of thousands of chickens, and yet we're having this ludicrous idea bandied around that we can't house a few thousand migrants.
[Link] When I say this, I am not advocating giving these properties to all of those at Calais, it would create mayhem! We need to address the homeless issue. At the moment in some boroughs it is illegal to sleep in the street. That's not really solving the problem is it?
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 fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 03 Aug 15 10.53pm |
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Quote legaleagle at 03 Aug 2015 10.32pm
Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 10.25pm
Alas, poor Abdul....I knew him well!! Edited by fed up eagle (03 Aug 2015 10.27pm) ...................................................
Edited by legaleagle (03 Aug 2015 10.33pm)
Edited by fed up eagle (03 Aug 2015 10.54pm) Edited by fed up eagle (03 Aug 2015 10.55pm)
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| fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 03 Aug 15 11.00pm |
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Quote nickgusset at 03 Aug 2015 10.47pm
Quote -TUX- at 03 Aug 2015 10.21pm
Quote serial thriller at 03 Aug 2015 9.49pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 02 Aug 2015 9.18am
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 2.04pm
Quote leggedstruggle at 01 Aug 2015 1.15pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? No and no. Now answer my questions.
You are right I did leave out important factors - I completely underestimated the amount of building required to cope with our increased population after rampant immigration comes to fruition:- As previously stated we will need hundreds of thousands new homes, schools, GP surgeries and hospitals. What I omitted was new factories, offices, supermarkets, distribution centres, warehouses, car parks, train stations, places of entertainment and presumably bigger and bigger mosques? After all these new arrivals will have to work, eat, be entertained and pray to Allah. I ask you, or anyone else advocating wholesale immigration to the UK........ where is all the space to accommodate these people and the infrastructure needed to allow them to go about living their new daily lives? I've already discounted the suggestion made by Serial Thriller who mistakenly believed we had 97% of UK land to build on - can anyone answer this simple question?
What I have pointed out, and what I see you've conveniently ignored, is the fact that we have an estimated 200 000 sites for property on brown belt land available in this country - easily enough not just to house our own homeless but those in Calais. I also read something interesting today which shows how hypocritical we are when it comes to housing. Apparently Herefordshire has built around 40 broiler units (chicken houses) accommodating thousands of chickens each, in the last 12 months. That's one county, in one year, building homes for what must be hundreds of thousands of chickens, and yet we're having this ludicrous idea bandied around that we can't house a few thousand migrants.
[Link] When I say this, I am not advocating giving these properties to all of those at Calais, it would create mayhem! We need to address the homeless issue. At the moment in some boroughs it is illegal to sleep in the street. That's not really solving the problem is it?
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| serial thriller The Promised Land 03 Aug 15 11.04pm |
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Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 10.07pm
Quote johnfirewall at 03 Aug 2015 9.52pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? Hang on, you're the one that wants them. Maybe I missed the part of this thread where you mention accommodating a few in your spare room. That's the problem with those who are happy for everyone else to contribute, blindly accepting that people only ever come here with honest intentions, escaping hellish conditions. Anyone can see that letting everyone in on that basis is madness and just means everyone will follow suit. That's the situation we're in now.
Knob.
If punk ever happened I'd be preaching the law, instead of listenin to Lydon lecture BBC4 |
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 03 Aug 15 11.11pm |
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Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 11.00pm
Quote nickgusset at 03 Aug 2015 10.47pm
Quote -TUX- at 03 Aug 2015 10.21pm
Quote serial thriller at 03 Aug 2015 9.49pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 02 Aug 2015 9.18am
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 2.04pm
Quote leggedstruggle at 01 Aug 2015 1.15pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? No and no. Now answer my questions.
You are right I did leave out important factors - I completely underestimated the amount of building required to cope with our increased population after rampant immigration comes to fruition:- As previously stated we will need hundreds of thousands new homes, schools, GP surgeries and hospitals. What I omitted was new factories, offices, supermarkets, distribution centres, warehouses, car parks, train stations, places of entertainment and presumably bigger and bigger mosques? After all these new arrivals will have to work, eat, be entertained and pray to Allah. I ask you, or anyone else advocating wholesale immigration to the UK........ where is all the space to accommodate these people and the infrastructure needed to allow them to go about living their new daily lives? I've already discounted the suggestion made by Serial Thriller who mistakenly believed we had 97% of UK land to build on - can anyone answer this simple question?
What I have pointed out, and what I see you've conveniently ignored, is the fact that we have an estimated 200 000 sites for property on brown belt land available in this country - easily enough not just to house our own homeless but those in Calais. I also read something interesting today which shows how hypocritical we are when it comes to housing. Apparently Herefordshire has built around 40 broiler units (chicken houses) accommodating thousands of chickens each, in the last 12 months. That's one county, in one year, building homes for what must be hundreds of thousands of chickens, and yet we're having this ludicrous idea bandied around that we can't house a few thousand migrants.
[Link] When I say this, I am not advocating giving these properties to all of those at Calais, it would create mayhem! We need to address the homeless issue. At the moment in some boroughs it is illegal to sleep in the street. That's not really solving the problem is it?
But yes sort out british homelessness first. It's f***ing ludicrous that this lot in power think you can just make something illegal and it'll go away... I was going to suggest that some of the houses should be given to a Peruvian Quinoa co-operative Tax the f*** out of the f***ers with empty buildings. No social responsibility - any of them.
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| fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 03 Aug 15 11.37pm |
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Quote serial thriller at 03 Aug 2015 11.04pm
Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 10.07pm
Quote johnfirewall at 03 Aug 2015 9.52pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? Hang on, you're the one that wants them. Maybe I missed the part of this thread where you mention accommodating a few in your spare room. That's the problem with those who are happy for everyone else to contribute, blindly accepting that people only ever come here with honest intentions, escaping hellish conditions. Anyone can see that letting everyone in on that basis is madness and just means everyone will follow suit. That's the situation we're in now.
Knob.
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| dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 04 Aug 15 8.34am |
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Whilst I personally feel FUE has made a rod for his own back, and to some extent over shot his argument somewhat. You cant argue with the undeniable fact that Immigrants regardless of their validity, are being housed when British citizens are sleeping rough and have no where to go. I believe there are approx 6-9000 homeless people in the UK that have served with the armed forces. I don’t wish to separate and divide into sub categories of homeless people because if your homeless, your homeless end of. However surely the fact you served your country, should put you ahead of someone who has just rocked up with their hand out literally demanding to be housed, fed and watered. Charity should begin at home, and after a quick search, neither the left or right governments of recent years has given any money to help homeless veterans, it's all done through charitable organisations, yet they are quite happy to throw tax payers money at illegal immigrants ? I just want to make it clear I am only bringing up the plight of homeless ex service men and women rather than homelessness as a whole, as IMO surely having served their country, they are a more deserving case than someone who is claiming to be a refugee, and yet has completely ignored several SAFE states before becoming a vandal and criminally trying to enter the UK so he/she can get a nice new house flat etc etc. I am sure there are genuine cases amongst the throng of benefit tourists, however I don’t really care, not while we have homeless CHILDREN living on our streets who have to turn to all manner of seedy s***, just to get by and not starve to death. Giving any aid to the immigrants trying to illegally enter the country when we have a very serious homeless problem within our own borders is to be blunt fcking stupid. It’s almost as if being white and British in Britain makes you bottom of the list for any housing that may or may not be available. So whilst FUE has lost the plot a wee bit, the problem at the heart of his (somewhat overstated) argument is a very real one.
"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'" |
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 Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 04 Aug 15 8.39am |
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Quote serial thriller at 03 Aug 2015 11.04pm
Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 10.07pm
Quote johnfirewall at 03 Aug 2015 9.52pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? Hang on, you're the one that wants them. Maybe I missed the part of this thread where you mention accommodating a few in your spare room. That's the problem with those who are happy for everyone else to contribute, blindly accepting that people only ever come here with honest intentions, escaping hellish conditions. Anyone can see that letting everyone in on that basis is madness and just means everyone will follow suit. That's the situation we're in now.
Knob.
Sweep out the traitors, execute them and make Britain great again.
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| Hoof Hearted 04 Aug 15 10.03am | |
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Quote legaleagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.30pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 03 Aug 2015 10.29am
Thanks for replying.... appreciate it. I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable. Your first point about religion.... I guess you mean the Poles? Currently we can do nothing about them and they do not pose a threat to our security. Also their religion "jives" in with ours, so they have no need to build places of worship! I have no doubts that immigration can and has created economic growth. However... that is no comfort to communities that have been swamped with immigrants, eg Lincolnshire where they cannot get their kids in local schools and see a doctor immediately. London has changed dramatically since 1939. Less houses and more offices have been built I would guess? Similar theme in Bristol. Both areas have seen people pushed out to the suburbs, so both London and Bristol are probably twice the size they were pre war geographically. Woodlands are being re-instated.... due to erosion and the effect on watercourses. None of them are from housing developments being demolished, but instead replacing hill farming (sheep grazing predominantly). Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture. To counter your claims I would re-state that in some areas their presence causes problems (schools GP's). I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists? I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone. I'm not blaming the immigrants for this loss of our heritage, but it a sign that our country has changed due to pressures of living, squeezing of space and people not having time to enjoy life.You mentioned London in 1939... I expect it was a nicer place to live then than now even with WWII looming. Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you.
On the question of you mourning village cricket teams etc,if you are not already familiar with it,let me direct you to a great album by the Kinks called the "Village Green Preservation Society" and its depiction (partly by exaggerated fantasy)of a world already then disappearing (and not I would suggest because of immigration) in 1968 when the album came out Edited by legaleagle (03 Aug 2015 8.32pm)
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| Hoof Hearted 04 Aug 15 10.12am | |
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Quote serial thriller at 03 Aug 2015 9.49pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 02 Aug 2015 9.18am
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 2.04pm
Quote leggedstruggle at 01 Aug 2015 1.15pm
Quote legaleagle at 01 Aug 2015 1.08pm
More pertinently perhaps in your case,is there anything at all about immigration that you consider is not a downside and is there anything at all about economic migrants or refugees that could make them acceptable people to live in a house you occupied? If so,what? No and no. Now answer my questions.
You are right I did leave out important factors - I completely underestimated the amount of building required to cope with our increased population after rampant immigration comes to fruition:- As previously stated we will need hundreds of thousands new homes, schools, GP surgeries and hospitals. What I omitted was new factories, offices, supermarkets, distribution centres, warehouses, car parks, train stations, places of entertainment and presumably bigger and bigger mosques? After all these new arrivals will have to work, eat, be entertained and pray to Allah. I ask you, or anyone else advocating wholesale immigration to the UK........ where is all the space to accommodate these people and the infrastructure needed to allow them to go about living their new daily lives? I've already discounted the suggestion made by Serial Thriller who mistakenly believed we had 97% of UK land to build on - can anyone answer this simple question?
What I have pointed out, and what I see you've conveniently ignored, is the fact that we have an estimated 200 000 sites for property on brown belt land available in this country - easily enough not just to house our own homeless but those in Calais. I also read something interesting today which shows how hypocritical we are when it comes to housing. Apparently Herefordshire has built around 40 broiler units (chicken houses) accommodating thousands of chickens each, in the last 12 months. That's one county, in one year, building homes for what must be hundreds of thousands of chickens, and yet we're having this ludicrous idea bandied around that we can't house a few thousand migrants.
By definition if you are saying only 3% is built upon you are implying 97% is available.... that is not twisting your words! Those 200,000 (estimated so probably nowhere near that amount) will be needed to house ex brit soldiers living on the streets and other families already living here in unsuitable accommodation - such as in Slough where they are living in sheds. WHEN we have no homeless people here we can consider letting others in possibly. Chickens produce eggs and roast dinners....... can the Calais migrants do this?
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| Hoof Hearted 04 Aug 15 10.20am | |
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Quote dannyh at 04 Aug 2015 8.34am
Whilst I personally feel FUE has made a rod for his own back, and to some extent over shot his argument somewhat. You cant argue with the undeniable fact that Immigrants regardless of their validity, are being housed when British citizens are sleeping rough and have no where to go. I believe there are approx 6-9000 homeless people in the UK that have served with the armed forces. I don’t wish to separate and divide into sub categories of homeless people because if your homeless, your homeless end of. However surely the fact you served your country, should put you ahead of someone who has just rocked up with their hand out literally demanding to be housed, fed and watered. Charity should begin at home, and after a quick search, neither the left or right governments of recent years has given any money to help homeless veterans, it's all done through charitable organisations, yet they are quite happy to throw tax payers money at illegal immigrants ? I just want to make it clear I am only bringing up the plight of homeless ex service men and women rather than homelessness as a whole, as IMO surely having served their country, they are a more deserving case than someone who is claiming to be a refugee, and yet has completely ignored several SAFE states before becoming a vandal and criminally trying to enter the UK so he/she can get a nice new house flat etc etc. I am sure there are genuine cases amongst the throng of benefit tourists, however I don’t really care, not while we have homeless CHILDREN living on our streets who have to turn to all manner of seedy s***, just to get by and not starve to death. Giving any aid to the immigrants trying to illegally enter the country when we have a very serious homeless problem within our own borders is to be blunt fcking stupid. It’s almost as if being white and British in Britain makes you bottom of the list for any housing that may or may not be available. So whilst FUE has lost the plot a wee bit, the problem at the heart of his (somewhat overstated) argument is a very real one.
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| johnfirewall 04 Aug 15 11.01am |
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Quote legaleagle at 03 Aug 2015 10.12pm
Blimey,might be an idea if you actually read the thread before posting.What's up,upset FUE hasn't recruited you yet for the killing fields? In terms of each of your carefully thought through paragraphs. 1.Where precisely have I advocated offering admission to all at Calais?Answer:I haven't. 2. I've put up a refugee in the past.Have you? I've made very clear (and why) I don't, unlike the poster you quote, refuse to even contemplate the idea of living with an economic migrant (you'd also appreciate from my earlier posts its more than likely at some point I had shared a house with an economic migrant (which is the case;my grandmother!!!!).Read the whole thread. 3.See 1 and 2 above,Read the whole thread. 4.See 1. above. Questioning whether the other chap saw anything other than negatives to immigration implied you saw none. No need to keep banging on about it. Did the council pay you to house this person? I wasn't seeking your confirmation of the existence of economic migrants, I'm just pressing others here to find a distinction. The term is too broad anyway in that it encompasses anyone not fleeing danger. My issue is that if you come from somwhere with no opportunities, then anything is an improvement, even Calais. The same applies to anyone leaving a warzone. So yes, maybe I lean more towards the side of accepting none than you do towards accepting everyone, but I direct my points at others here who are suggesting the latter option on the grounds of us having space. Edited by johnfirewall (04 Aug 2015 11.02am)
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