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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
I hadn't read about this, which from your description sounds concerning. So I did some digging. They were Ukrainian-produced drone attacks (not NATO weapons) on facilities that it is said also monitor aircraft movements in the active war zone so damaging them would have a military purpose. The drones' ability to penetrate demonstrates how ineffective they seem, which could have propaganda value. Does that fit with what you know? Edited by Wisbech Eagle (30 May 2024 1.33pm) The systems are fixed have a 90° field of view & if anything like we have they will reach incredibly far, They don't cover Ukraine so any advantage for Ukraine is minimal at best. Ukraine now getting the green light to use NATO missiles into Russian territory implies more of this can happen, want to stress I never said NATO weapons were used for these attacks. Theoretical example We're lucky Russia hasn't done that yet but if this continues my prediction of a nuke being dropped in Ukraine will come true & after that what happens next is anyone's guess.
The mountains are calling & I must go. |
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Originally posted by Ouzo Dan
The systems are fixed have a 90° field of view & if anything like we have they will reach incredibly far, They don't cover Ukraine so any advantage for Ukraine is minimal at best. Ukraine now getting the green light to use NATO missiles into Russian territory implies more of this can happen, want to stress I never said NATO weapons were used for these attacks. Theoretical example We're lucky Russia hasn't done that yet but if this continues my prediction of a nuke being dropped in Ukraine will come true & after that what happens next is anyone's guess. All those points were made to him earlier in the thread. He just responds as he always does and defends the establishment's view. He doesn't care about the double standards. The whole Cuba situation in the sixties is only brought up if you're a Putin apologist apparently and NATO is only a defensive alliance even though it expanded and thousand miles to the east and has now brought us to the edge of mutual destruction....something that should have been buried in 91. As stated it would thirty years ago by our own critics of expansion within NATO itself. But hey defence contractors get to sell NATO arms to incoming countries and lefties can get funding to tell whites how evil and oppressive they are. We live in the era of stupid. Edited by Stirlingsays (30 May 2024 5.33pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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What you are seeing how is the truth emerging on just how desperate straits Ukraine is now in. Can I make the point that I've had to put up with rubbish from naysayers in this thread for years. Yet pretty much everything I was saying has come to pass. After years of lies to us about Russia losing, Russia running out of ammo, Russian troops losing morale, Russia falling apart, Putin dying and all the rest of it.....Now we get the opposite and calls for everything to be put on the line for Ukraine. Can we pause for a moment and take in the fact that no one....not one person will pay for lying about all this....All those talking heads on your telly talking b0llocks are more rewarded than punished. Whereas the truth is now that it's so desperate that western politicians are green lighting attacks using NATO equipment into Russia itself.....something Russia has said will only escalate. I don't have to say just how serious that could get. Macron and others saying 'instructors' will be sent into Ukraine.....when anyone with brains knows that NATO has sent troops termed as mercenaries for years into this conflict and covered up their deaths. This is why it's happening. Ukraine only has roughly six months left as a military force and thus it requires more and more western involvement to stay afloat. Russia on the other hand....with Chinese and others involvement (which has been happening covertly) has at least two to three years left before it gets difficult to continue. This was never complicated....population size and military capacity.....We are literally ruled by morons. Edited by Stirlingsays (30 May 2024 4.09pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
All those points were made to him earlier in the thread. He just responds as he always does and defends the establishment's view. He doesn't care about the double standards. The whole Cuba situation in the sixties is only brought up if you're a Putin apologist apparently and NATO is only a defensive alliance even though it expanded and thousand miles to the east and has now brought us to the edge of mutual destruction....something that should have been buried in 91. As stated it would thirty years ago by our own critics of expansion within NATO itself. But hey defence contractors get to sell NATO arms to incoming countries and lefties can get funding to tell whites how evil and oppressive they are. We live in the era of stupid.
Honestly I gave up replying to him a while back, I only felt the need to repeat myself because this is serious, f***ing with any Nuclear superpower's ICBM defence is dangerous for all of us. I'm of the opinion the Ukrainian government want a backwater village to be flattened with a low yield nuke as it will accelerate NATO's entry into this war.
The mountains are calling & I must go. |
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Originally posted by Ouzo Dan
The systems are fixed have a 90° field of view & if anything like we have they will reach incredibly far, They don't cover Ukraine so any advantage for Ukraine is minimal at best. Ukraine now getting the green light to use NATO missiles into Russian territory implies more of this can happen, want to stress I never said NATO weapons were used for these attacks. Theoretical example We're lucky Russia hasn't done that yet but if this continues my prediction of a nuke being dropped in Ukraine will come true & after that what happens next is anyone's guess. Thanks. What puzzles me is why they would do this unless there was a military reason behind it? You wouldn’t to provoke a nuclear strike in response or waste resources on a target which brings no benefit. Why the USA has given the green light for the use of its hardware inside Russia is puzzling. I hope it is very restricted and limited to specifics as the last thing we want is escalation. Makes no sense on the face of things.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Originally posted by Ouzo Dan
Honestly I gave up replying to him a while back, I only felt the need to repeat myself because this is serious, f***ing with any Nuclear superpower's ICBM defence is dangerous for all of us. I'm of the opinion the Ukrainian government want a backwater village to be flattened with a low yield nuke as it will accelerate NATO's entry into this war. Do you seriously think NATO will allow itself to be manipulated like that? I don’t see it happening in any circumstances other than a direct attack on a NATO country.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Thanks. What puzzles me is why they would do this unless there was a military reason behind it? You wouldn’t to provoke a nuclear strike in response or waste resources on a target which brings no benefit. Why the USA has given the green light for the use of its hardware inside Russia is puzzling. I hope it is very restricted and limited to specifics as the last thing we want is escalation. Makes no sense on the face of things. Comparably to Missiles drones cost peanuts & require little intervention from humans, it really is as easy as pre programming a route, pushing a button and off it goes to its destination. There is a monetary loss to Russia for these kind of strikes however these sites are far removed from the front line & its unlikely it will pull any resources from the war zone. They attack these sites because they can, someone within the Ukrainian military has decided the FAFO sliding scale is favourable & its an extremely dangerous game to play. This war has been escalating from the beginning.
The mountains are calling & I must go. |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
Do you seriously think NATO will allow itself to be manipulated like that? I don’t see it happening in any circumstances other than a direct attack on a NATO country. Ukraine has already 'accidentally' fired missiles into Poland & blamed it on the Russians in a pretty desperate attempt to trigger article 5. We will see if NATO will get anymore involved my fear is we are definitely heading towards it as short of actual verifiable boots on the ground NATO is up to their necks in this war already. My only explanation for these ICBM sites being targeted is Ukraine is lashing out, they likely see escalating things like this as their best chance of dragging NATO ever deeper into this conflict. There is absolutely no way Russia will turn a blind eye to their Nuclear deterrence being diminished for much longer. Edited by Ouzo Dan (31 May 2024 9.26am)
The mountains are calling & I must go. |
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Originally posted by Ouzo Dan
Ukraine has already 'accidentally' fired missiles into Poland & blamed it on the Russians in a pretty desperate attempt to trigger article 5. We will see if NATO will get anymore involved my fear is we are definitely heading towards it as short of actual verifiable boots on the ground NATO is up to their necks in this war already. My only explanation for these ICBM sites being targeted is Ukraine is lashing out, they likely see escalating things like this as their best chance of dragging NATO ever deeper into this conflict. There is absolutely no way Russia will turn a blind eye to their Nuclear deterrence being diminished for much longer. Edited by Ouzo Dan (31 May 2024 9.26am) That we, and therefore NATO on our behalf, has an interest in ensuring Ukraine survives relatively intact is undoubtedly true but I cannot imagine them being unaware of stooge attempts or any other Ukranian tactics. Our intelligence is pretty good. I think there is a clear red line which both sides understand and neither want, or will, cross. That’s not to suggest I am not worried. Mistakes can be made and I could be wrong. Pressurising Ukraine not to do provocative things must surely be happening now? What is happening diplomatically behind the scenes we don’t know but hopefully something is underway.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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Originally posted by Ouzo Dan
Honestly I gave up replying to him a while back, I only felt the need to repeat myself because this is serious, f***ing with any Nuclear superpower's ICBM defence is dangerous for all of us. I'm of the opinion the Ukrainian government want a backwater village to be flattened with a low yield nuke as it will accelerate NATO's entry into this war. I fear you are right. Pushing the nuclear war threat is insane but it shows the desperation and strain felt by Ukraine. How much this is in partnership with the neo cons in the state department we can't say....but we are pretty sure that those two were responsible for the Nord pipelines so....who knows. Involving Nato and widening the war was always the only realistic way Ukraine could ever.....even have a chance in this war once Russia went onto a war economy. War economies come at a high cost however and while Ukraine is now a destroyed country with little future (extremely bad decision making) if it can keep cohesive minus the Donbas and keep Odessa it has some future. However the cost to us is unacceptable and it's only those pathologically hostile to Russia justifying this whole mess and who will justify doing that along with this hopefully only cold war. But no one should be surprised when the cost of running and paying for the Ukrainian state is pushed onto the European tax payer....along with the increased costs for everything else this war meant. Russia are operating at a war economy as well and personally I feel that's proven possible only for two or three years before they themselves start to damage themselves long term (so about another 12-18 months more).....to an extent that they will just look to defend what they have. Russia won't believe that leaving Ukraine in a state where it could be used later to retake the east is acceptable to them.....So I think this summer and winter will see the biggest push from them. We will see if Ukraine survives it......I think we could see a change in Ukrainian leadership at some point. Edited by Stirlingsays (31 May 2024 12.24pm)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Trump says that if elected he will insist upon peace negotiations....which probably means within the border that exists at that time. He says that if the Ukraine refuse to negotiate a settlement he will end funding and if Russia refuse he will carry on funding them but at a higher military level. This might have the effect that both sides throw everything into the battlefield before November upon the basis that a settlement then becomes inevitable. Edited by Stirlingsays (26 Jun 2024 1.28am)
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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Must be next to impossible for Ukraine to operate some of the various equipment. With all different calibres and spares - it would be a hard task. I can't imagine it easy to try and run Le Clercs, Abrams, Challengers, Leopards and whatever else, for example.
Red and Blue Army! |
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