CONservative government incompetence.

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CONservative government incompetence.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.04pm
Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly I am not dismissing your figures, just doubting how they could be derived accurately by any scientific means. Other than a guesstimate. The need for immigration was to sustain the workforce, so their contributions could pay for the absolute f-ck-wittedness of the Pension schemes, pre-1990's, Where pensions actually not sustained by contributions from those that benefitted, but were heavily reliant on an ever-increasing workforce to bail them out. It was a system doomed to failure, for which this generation (and those that follow) will be paying the price. That of course assumes that immigrants come here to work and contribute. Not free-load off an over-burdened state system or get involved with crime. Like stirlingsays, no Government ever wants to sort out a long-term plan, They do the minimum possible and stumble onto the next crisis. Edited by Forest Hillbilly (11 Apr 2023 5.21pm) I don't think it had anything to do with pensions. It was all to do with need. The need to recognise that we would have an increasingly long-lived population, who would need to retire later but also be both replaced and cared for. With a declining birthrate that left only one option, immigration. There was another need, which is often overlooked. That being that alongside our own declining birthrate was an ever-increasing one elsewhere, resulting in predictions of a global over-population problem. So solving one, whilst going a small way to helping with the other made sense. This brought other benefits from the sharing and understanding of cultures, vital to our shrinking world. What we have failed to do is take everyone with us. We haven't explained well enough, and we certainly have been lax in ensuring assimilation. Something I believe every new arrival ought to be tutored in and given no options over. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.04pm

Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly

I am not dismissing your figures, just doubting how they could be derived accurately by any scientific means. Other than a guesstimate.

The need for immigration was to sustain the workforce, so their contributions could pay for the absolute f-ck-wittedness of the Pension schemes, pre-1990's, Where pensions actually not sustained by contributions from those that benefitted, but were heavily reliant on an ever-increasing workforce to bail them out. It was a system doomed to failure, for which this generation (and those that follow) will be paying the price.
That of course assumes that immigrants come here to work and contribute.
Not free-load off an over-burdened state system or get involved with crime.

Like stirlingsays, no Government ever wants to sort out a long-term plan, They do the minimum possible and stumble onto the next crisis.

Edited by Forest Hillbilly (11 Apr 2023 5.21pm)

I don't think it had anything to do with pensions. It was all to do with need. The need to recognise that we would have an increasingly long-lived population, who would need to retire later but also be both replaced and cared for. With a declining birthrate that left only one option, immigration.

There was another need, which is often overlooked. That being that alongside our own declining birthrate was an ever-increasing one elsewhere, resulting in predictions of a global over-population problem. So solving one, whilst going a small way to helping with the other made sense. This brought other benefits from the sharing and understanding of cultures, vital to our shrinking world.

What we have failed to do is take everyone with us. We haven't explained well enough, and we certainly have been lax in ensuring assimilation. Something I believe every new arrival ought to be tutored in and given no options over.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.09pm
Originally posted by the silurian Where did people introduce skin colour? Illegal immigration includes black, Chinese, Vietnamese, Albanians ......so many colours//maybe you can reference the actual post that introduced colour into the argument, because I cant see it? Edited by the silurian (11 Apr 2023 5.23pm) Today at 1.18 pm describing people as "white British". For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.09pm

Originally posted by the silurian

Where did people introduce skin colour? Illegal immigration includes black, Chinese, Vietnamese, Albanians ......so many colours//maybe you can reference the actual post that introduced colour into the argument, because I cant see it?

Edited by the silurian (11 Apr 2023 5.23pm)

Today at 1.18 pm describing people as "white British".

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.16pm
Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly The UK is set to be one of the worst performing major economies in the world this year, according to the International Monetary Fund (IMF). It says the UK economy's performance in 2023 will be the worst among the 20 biggest economies, known as the G20, which includes sanctions-hit Russia. (BBC website 11.4.23) Covid,...errr Ukraine,....errr. I think this is all owned by the Government well done people. Edited by Forest Hillbilly (11 Apr 2023 5.30pm) When will people wake up and smell the coffee? Every western nation has been impacted by Covid and Ukraine. Only one though has shot itself in the foot as well, by declaring Brexit. This additional strain is the only logical reason why we are bottom of the heap. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.16pm

Originally posted by Forest Hillbilly

The UK is set to be one of the worst performing major economies in the world this year, according to the International Monetary Fund (IMF).

It says the UK economy's performance in 2023 will be the worst among the 20 biggest economies, known as the G20, which includes sanctions-hit Russia. (BBC website 11.4.23)

Covid,...errr Ukraine,....errr. I think this is all owned by the Government well done people.

Edited by Forest Hillbilly (11 Apr 2023 5.30pm)

When will people wake up and smell the coffee?

Every western nation has been impacted by Covid and Ukraine.

Only one though has shot itself in the foot as well, by declaring Brexit.

This additional strain is the only logical reason why we are bottom of the heap.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 11 Apr 23 10.19pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Today at 1.18 pm describing people as "white British". Because that's the definition used in the census.
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Teddy Eagle

11 Apr 23 10.19pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Today at 1.18 pm describing people as "white British".

Because that's the definition used in the census.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.19pm
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle Who introduced skin colour into it? You did. At 1.18 pm today. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.19pm

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

Who introduced skin colour into it?

You did. At 1.18 pm today.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 11 Apr 23 10.20pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle You did. At 1.18 pm today. See above.
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Teddy Eagle

11 Apr 23 10.20pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

You did. At 1.18 pm today.

See above.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.26pm
Originally posted by georgenorman Yet an immutable Remainer doctrine is that all the nasty people that voted Leave did not want uncontrollable immigration from the EU - the vast majority of EU immigrants of course being white. Only a few who were involved in the Leave campaign were truly nasty. Most of those who voted to leave did so, in my opinion, because they were misled and bought the oldest of political tricks of jam tomorrow. The sad fact is that immigration from the EU has dried up and been replaced by people from further afield. Great result. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.26pm

Originally posted by georgenorman

Yet an immutable Remainer doctrine is that all the nasty people that voted Leave did not want uncontrollable immigration from the EU - the vast majority of EU immigrants of course being white.

Only a few who were involved in the Leave campaign were truly nasty. Most of those who voted to leave did so, in my opinion, because they were misled and bought the oldest of political tricks of jam tomorrow.

The sad fact is that immigration from the EU has dried up and been replaced by people from further afield. Great result.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Spiderman Horsham 11 Apr 23 10.31pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle It didn't apply. Taking the knee was a sign of solidarity with those who faced discrimination. It wasn't itself discriminatory. But initially it was in support of BLM. I didn’t see/hear people taking the knee in support of any other group
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Spiderman

Horsham 11 Apr 23 10.31pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

It didn't apply.

Taking the knee was a sign of solidarity with those who faced discrimination. It wasn't itself discriminatory.

But initially it was in support of BLM. I didn’t see/hear people taking the knee in support of any other group

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Spiderman Horsham 11 Apr 23 10.33pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Only a few who were involved in the Leave campaign were truly nasty. Most of those who voted to leave did so, in my opinion, because they were misled and bought the oldest of political tricks of jam tomorrow. The sad fact is that immigration from the EU has dried up and been replaced by people from further afield. Great result. Believe me EU immigration has not dried up, where did you get your facts from? EU nationals can still access the e-gates so no details kept of their intentions here, this is a fact
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Spiderman

Horsham 11 Apr 23 10.33pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

The sad fact is that immigration from the EU has dried up and been replaced by people from further afield. Great result.

Believe me EU immigration has not dried up, where did you get your facts from? EU nationals can still access the e-gates so no details kept of their intentions here, this is a fact

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.35pm
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger I don't think that mass immigration of people of any colour is a solution to anything. You are simply parroting a flawed formula. With every wave of migrants comes net increased population size and a need for more infrastructure to support it. They have more children in the first generation which would be good for taxation and filling menial jobs if they all paid tax, which many don't, and want to fill necessary job vacancies, which many don't. The downside is that start having less children in the subsequent generations and get old too. The upshot is that you have to keep having new waves of immigrants to maintain the birth rate which will mean that the culture and genetic and historical heritage of this country will evaporate to be replaced by pseudo history with none of our descendants here to benefit from thousands of years of toil and advancement by their ancestors. The only real solution is to encourage people here already to have more children, instead of disincentivising them at every turn. Then in one generation we will have more young people and no more supposed need for immigrants. Why am I telling you this? You couldn't care less about overpopulation or the future of indigenous British people. If you want to talk about race. Just look around at almost unrecognisable, divided, over sensitive, violent, crime ridden cauldron of racial tension Britain has now become because of mass immigration. Do you remember the good old days when we didn't have to worry about all this crap? Perhaps in Cornwall it's still 1950. I think you are simply wrong. Given our situation there was no choice other than to allow managed immigration. Our failures haven't been in permitting it. They have been in how we have managed it. But we are where we are, and we now need to manage what we have. Complaining about what is will do nothing to help us get to where we need to be. Here in Cornwall we can see a huge increase in the immigrant population. They were here before, but we didn't see them, because they looked like us. They came from Eastern Europe. Now most come from Africa and Asia. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.35pm

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

I don't think that mass immigration of people of any colour is a solution to anything.
You are simply parroting a flawed formula.
With every wave of migrants comes net increased population size and a need for more infrastructure to support it. They have more children in the first generation which would be good for taxation and filling menial jobs if they all paid tax, which many don't, and want to fill necessary job vacancies, which many don't. The downside is that start having less children in the subsequent generations and get old too.
The upshot is that you have to keep having new waves of immigrants to maintain the birth rate which will mean that the culture and genetic and historical heritage of this country will evaporate to be replaced by pseudo history with none of our descendants here to benefit from thousands of years of toil and advancement by their ancestors.

The only real solution is to encourage people here already to have more children, instead of disincentivising them at every turn. Then in one generation we will have more young people and no more supposed need for immigrants.

Why am I telling you this? You couldn't care less about overpopulation or the future of indigenous British people.

If you want to talk about race. Just look around at almost unrecognisable, divided, over sensitive, violent, crime ridden cauldron of racial tension Britain has now become because of mass immigration.

Do you remember the good old days when we didn't have to worry about all this crap? Perhaps in Cornwall it's still 1950.

I think you are simply wrong. Given our situation there was no choice other than to allow managed immigration.

Our failures haven't been in permitting it. They have been in how we have managed it.

But we are where we are, and we now need to manage what we have. Complaining about what is will do nothing to help us get to where we need to be.

Here in Cornwall we can see a huge increase in the immigrant population. They were here before, but we didn't see them, because they looked like us. They came from Eastern Europe. Now most come from Africa and Asia.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Spiderman Horsham 11 Apr 23 10.37pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle Are you sure about that? I think you will find most immigrants on the 5-year route to indefinite leave to remain go on to become British citizens as this gives them more rights and a valuable passport. So after that they have an equal status to you or me. This is probably true but they are not English which is what Teddy stated, in fact many, whilst holding a UK passport have dual nationality and still class the selves as Indian/pakistani etc Edited by Spiderman (11 Apr 2023 10.37pm)
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Spiderman

Horsham 11 Apr 23 10.37pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

Are you sure about that?

I think you will find most immigrants on the 5-year route to indefinite leave to remain go on to become British citizens as this gives them more rights and a valuable passport.

So after that they have an equal status to you or me.

This is probably true but they are not English which is what Teddy stated, in fact many, whilst holding a UK passport have dual nationality and still class the selves as Indian/pakistani etc

Edited by Spiderman (11 Apr 2023 10.37pm)

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.41pm
Originally posted by Spiderman Believe me EU immigration has not dried up, where did you get your facts from? EU nationals can still access the e-gates so no details kept of their intentions here, this is a fact I would have to do some research to substantiate my impressions, which are based on my own knowledge of the situation in our local hospitals. I am aware of some Eastern Europeans who have stayed under the special scheme we set up, but no new arrivals at all, whilst huge numbers from Africa and Asia are being recruited. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 11 Apr 23 10.41pm

Originally posted by Spiderman

Believe me EU immigration has not dried up, where did you get your facts from? EU nationals can still access the e-gates so no details kept of their intentions here, this is a fact

I would have to do some research to substantiate my impressions, which are based on my own knowledge of the situation in our local hospitals.

I am aware of some Eastern Europeans who have stayed under the special scheme we set up, but no new arrivals at all, whilst huge numbers from Africa and Asia are being recruited.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Alert a moderator to this post

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