Calais migrant trouble

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Calais migrant trouble

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leggedstruggle Croydon 02 Aug 15 2.12pm
It is pointless really arguing with the Comrades over this. They will support mass immigration regardless of the consequences. They would have no real controls whatsoever. They will ignore the manifold problems caused. There is no limit to the irresponsibility of these philodoxes. mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler
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leggedstruggle

Croydon 02 Aug 15 2.12pm

It is pointless really arguing with the Comrades over this. They will support mass immigration regardless of the consequences. They would have no real controls whatsoever. They will ignore the manifold problems caused. There is no limit to the irresponsibility of these philodoxes.

mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler

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Catfish Burgess Hill 02 Aug 15 3.02pm
Quote leggedstruggle at 02 Aug 2015 2.12pm It is pointless really arguing with the Comrades over this. They will support mass immigration regardless of the consequences. They would have no real controls whatsoever. They will ignore the manifold problems caused. There is no limit to the irresponsibility of these philodoxes. Something to do with stamp collecting?!? Yes, I am an agent of Satan but my duties are largely ceremonial
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Catfish

Burgess Hill 02 Aug 15 3.02pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 02 Aug 2015 2.12pm

Something to do with stamp collecting?!?

Yes, I am an agent of Satan but my duties are largely ceremonial

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bromerzz Deryneia Cyprus 02 Aug 15 4.28pm
Latest group of Asylum seekers at Calais said they did not want charity, instead a right to settle in South London and a Season Ticket to the Palace was all they are after.
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bromerzz

Deryneia Cyprus 02 Aug 15 4.28pm

Latest group of Asylum seekers at Calais said they did not want charity, instead a right to settle in South London and a Season Ticket to the Palace was all they are after.

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nairb75 Baltimore 02 Aug 15 5.15pm
Quote bromerzz at 02 Aug 2015 4.28pm Latest group of Asylum seekers at Calais said they did not want charity, instead a right to settle in South London and a Season Ticket to the Palace was all they are after. and maybe a little strange if the local gals would oblige.
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nairb75

Baltimore 02 Aug 15 5.15pm

Quote bromerzz at 02 Aug 2015 4.28pm

Latest group of Asylum seekers at Calais said they did not want charity, instead a right to settle in South London and a Season Ticket to the Palace was all they are after.

and maybe a little strange if the local gals would oblige.

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Hoof Hearted 03 Aug 15 10.29am
Quote legaleagle at 02 Aug 2015 11.14am Quote Hoof Hearted at 02 Aug 2015 9.18am Thanks legal... I'll take that as some sort of agreement? You are right I did leave out important factors - I completely underestimated the amount of building required to cope with our increased population after rampant immigration comes to fruition:- As previously stated we will need hundreds of thousands new homes, schools, GP surgeries and hospitals. What I omitted was new factories, offices, supermarkets, distribution centres, warehouses, car parks, train stations, places of entertainment and presumably bigger and bigger mosques? After all these new arrivals will have to work, eat, be entertained and pray to Allah. I ask you, or anyone else advocating wholesale immigration to the UK........ where is all the space to accommodate these people and the infrastructure needed to allow them to go about living their new daily lives? I've already discounted the suggestion made by Serial Thriller who mistakenly believed we had 97% of UK land to build on - can anyone answer this simple question? Not so much agree with your conclusions Hoof,but acknowledge that resources and planning are relevant factors for any society for the future. Umm Hoof,if I have posted two days ago on this thread that I agree with immigrations controls re non EU nationals,quite how does that make me someone "advocating wholesale immigration to the UK". Also,Hoof,do try not to let your other prejudices undermine your reasonable points in this context.Can make you look like a bigot rather than a person of objective reasonable concerns.I'd hazard the largest "religious group" that has come here in the past few years are catholics...who worship in...not mosques but churches. In terms of population density,it does not seem to be the key factor in terms of economic success.Our's has been estimated at about 680 people per mile. Singapore's (doing very nicely economically thank you) is 19,731. London's population in 1939 was 8.6 million.Today its 8.6 million. Your place of residence,Bristol's was 422,000 years ago and is about 432,000 now. Factually (as opposed to the "I hate immigrants per se" blind prejudice school of analysis) it seems that as of 2012 we had,for example,the largest amount of woodland in the UK since records began in 1924 and that 93% of the UK was not urban (the remaining 7% including roads and rural development) though 80% of us lived in towns and cities.. perhaps not quite as simple as your analysis. So,not as simplistic as ignoring your points,but not as simplistic as only your points might suggest perhaps. And how you view the future and needs and "level of concern might in part depend in some ways what one's starting points are: 1.Is it that immigrants have historically and can benefit our society and population diversity has positives or only negatives? 2.Is it that immigrants are and have been "bad" for us per se and have negatively eroded our "anglo saxon" society,which is a "bad" thing? 3.Has recent EU immigration been an economic negative or in fact on average an economic benefit? 3.The overall benefits of EU membership (including free movement of goods,services and labour) is positive for the UK or,alternatively is negative? The starting points will perhaps very much influence perceptions of how to deal with resources and population numbers and distribution and the extent to which (and why) such are major problems. As will questions as to why our housing and transport and education systems might not be what they would be.Is it because of "immigrants" or is it for other reasons stretching back decades with immigration being a nice "blame all" reason for other causal factors? Not all the relevant questions, but I'd say as relevant as those you've posed. Edited by legaleagle (02 Aug 2015 11.23am) Thanks for replying.... appreciate it. I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable. Your first point about religion.... I guess you mean the Poles? Currently we can do nothing about them and they do not pose a threat to our security. Also their religion "jives" in with ours, so they have no need to build places of worship! I have no doubts that immigration can and has created economic growth. However... that is no comfort to communities that have been swamped with immigrants, eg Lincolnshire where they cannot get their kids in local schools and see a doctor immediately. London has changed dramatically since 1939. Less houses and more offices have been built I would guess? Similar theme in Bristol. Both areas have seen people pushed out to the suburbs, so both London and Bristol are probably twice the size they were pre war geographically. Woodlands are being re-instated.... due to erosion and the effect on watercourses. None of them are from housing developments being demolished, but instead replacing hill farming (sheep grazing predominantly). Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture. To counter your claims I would re-state that in some areas their presence causes problems (schools GP's). Some areas their presence has divided communities. Here in Bristol St Pauls and Easton are virtually at war with each other as Yardies take on pakistani gangs for drugs distribution/turf war. Bradford has different but greater problems along with Rochdale and Rotherham where Asians have got away with raping young girls because the police felt it un-PC to even investigate these crimes let alone make arrests. I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists? I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone. I'm not blaming the immigrants for this loss of our heritage, but it a sign that our country has changed due to pressures of living, squeezing of space and people not having time to enjoy life.You mentioned London in 1939... I expect it was a nicer place to live then than now even with WWII looming. Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you.
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Hoof Hearted 03 Aug 15 10.29am

Quote legaleagle at 02 Aug 2015 11.14am

Quote Hoof Hearted at 02 Aug 2015 9.18am

Thanks legal... I'll take that as some sort of agreement?

You are right I did leave out important factors - I completely underestimated the amount of building required to cope with our increased population after rampant immigration comes to fruition:-

As previously stated we will need hundreds of thousands new homes, schools, GP surgeries and hospitals.

What I omitted was new factories, offices, supermarkets, distribution centres, warehouses, car parks, train stations, places of entertainment and presumably bigger and bigger mosques?

After all these new arrivals will have to work, eat, be entertained and pray to Allah.

I ask you, or anyone else advocating wholesale immigration to the UK........ where is all the space to accommodate these people and the infrastructure needed to allow them to go about living their new daily lives?

I've already discounted the suggestion made by Serial Thriller who mistakenly believed we had 97% of UK land to build on - can anyone answer this simple question?

Not so much agree with your conclusions Hoof,but acknowledge that resources and planning are relevant factors for any society for the future.

Umm Hoof,if I have posted two days ago on this thread that I agree with immigrations controls re non EU nationals,quite how does that make me someone "advocating wholesale immigration to the UK".

Also,Hoof,do try not to let your other prejudices undermine your reasonable points in this context.Can make you look like a bigot rather than a person of objective reasonable concerns.I'd hazard the largest "religious group" that has come here in the past few years are catholics...who worship in...not mosques but churches.

In terms of population density,it does not seem to be the key factor in terms of economic success.Our's has been estimated at about 680 people per mile. Singapore's (doing very nicely economically thank you) is 19,731.

London's population in 1939 was 8.6 million.Today its 8.6 million.

Your place of residence,Bristol's was 422,000 years ago and is about 432,000 now.

Factually (as opposed to the "I hate immigrants per se" blind prejudice school of analysis) it seems that as of 2012 we had,for example,the largest amount of woodland in the UK since records began in 1924 and that 93% of the UK was not urban (the remaining 7% including roads and rural development) though 80% of us lived in towns and cities.. perhaps not quite as simple as your analysis.

So,not as simplistic as ignoring your points,but not as simplistic as only your points might suggest perhaps.

And how you view the future and needs and "level of concern might in part depend in some ways what one's starting points are:

1.Is it that immigrants have historically and can benefit our society and population diversity has positives or only negatives?

2.Is it that immigrants are and have been "bad" for us per se and have negatively eroded our "anglo saxon" society,which is a "bad" thing?

3.Has recent EU immigration been an economic negative or in fact on average an economic benefit?

3.The overall benefits of EU membership (including free movement of goods,services and labour) is positive for the UK or,alternatively is negative?

The starting points will perhaps very much influence perceptions of how to deal with resources and population numbers and distribution and the extent to which (and why) such are major problems.

As will questions as to why our housing and transport and education systems might not be what they would be.Is it because of "immigrants" or is it for other reasons stretching back decades with immigration being a nice "blame all" reason for other causal factors?

Not all the relevant questions, but I'd say as relevant as those you've posed.

Edited by legaleagle (02 Aug 2015 11.23am)

Thanks for replying.... appreciate it.

I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable.

Your first point about religion.... I guess you mean the Poles? Currently we can do nothing about them and they do not pose a threat to our security. Also their religion "jives" in with ours, so they have no need to build places of worship!

I have no doubts that immigration can and has created economic growth. However... that is no comfort to communities that have been swamped with immigrants, eg Lincolnshire where they cannot get their kids in local schools and see a doctor immediately.

London has changed dramatically since 1939. Less houses and more offices have been built I would guess? Similar theme in Bristol. Both areas have seen people pushed out to the suburbs, so both London and Bristol are probably twice the size they were pre war geographically.

Woodlands are being re-instated.... due to erosion and the effect on watercourses. None of them are from housing developments being demolished, but instead replacing hill farming (sheep grazing predominantly).

Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture.

To counter your claims I would re-state that in some areas their presence causes problems (schools GP's).
Some areas their presence has divided communities. Here in Bristol St Pauls and Easton are virtually at war with each other as Yardies take on pakistani gangs for drugs distribution/turf war. Bradford has different but greater problems along with Rochdale and Rotherham where Asians have got away with raping young girls because the police felt it un-PC to even investigate these crimes let alone make arrests.

I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists?

I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone.

I'm not blaming the immigrants for this loss of our heritage, but it a sign that our country has changed due to pressures of living, squeezing of space and people not having time to enjoy life.You mentioned London in 1939... I expect it was a nicer place to live then than now even with WWII looming.

Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you.

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leggedstruggle Croydon 03 Aug 15 10.31am
doubleplusungood - George must be laughing at this. [Link] mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler
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leggedstruggle

Croydon 03 Aug 15 10.31am

doubleplusungood - George must be laughing at this.

[Link]

mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler

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fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 03 Aug 15 8.25pm
My solution to this problem is to send the SAS in and machine gun all the 'I come England, lots of money' brigade. Machine gun the vermin, burn their camps to the ground and deny all knowledge. When another lot rock up, do exactly the same, then they'll soon realise that the only thing they'll be getting is a bullet or two. Drastic measures. And I'd be more than happy to volunteer.
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fed up eagle

Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 03 Aug 15 8.25pm

My solution to this problem is to send the SAS in and machine gun all the 'I come England, lots of money' brigade. Machine gun the vermin, burn their camps to the ground and deny all knowledge.
When another lot rock up, do exactly the same, then they'll soon realise that the only thing they'll be getting is a bullet or two. Drastic measures. And I'd be more than happy to volunteer.

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legaleagle 03 Aug 15 8.30pm
Quote Hoof Hearted at 03 Aug 2015 10.29am Thanks for replying.... appreciate it. I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable. Your first point about religion.... I guess you mean the Poles? Currently we can do nothing about them and they do not pose a threat to our security. Also their religion "jives" in with ours, so they have no need to build places of worship! I have no doubts that immigration can and has created economic growth. However... that is no comfort to communities that have been swamped with immigrants, eg Lincolnshire where they cannot get their kids in local schools and see a doctor immediately. London has changed dramatically since 1939. Less houses and more offices have been built I would guess? Similar theme in Bristol. Both areas have seen people pushed out to the suburbs, so both London and Bristol are probably twice the size they were pre war geographically. Woodlands are being re-instated.... due to erosion and the effect on watercourses. None of them are from housing developments being demolished, but instead replacing hill farming (sheep grazing predominantly). Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture. To counter your claims I would re-state that in some areas their presence causes problems (schools GP's). Some areas their presence has divided communities. Here in Bristol St Pauls and Easton are virtually at war with each other as Yardies take on pakistani gangs for drugs distribution/turf war. Bradford has different but greater problems along with Rochdale and Rotherham where Asians have got away with raping young girls because the police felt it un-PC to even investigate these crimes let alone make arrests. I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists? I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone. I'm not blaming the immigrants for this loss of our heritage, but it a sign that our country has changed due to pressures of living, squeezing of space and people not having time to enjoy life.You mentioned London in 1939... I expect it was a nicer place to live then than now even with WWII looming. Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you. I think the point Hoof,on which hopefully we can agree,is that the issue you raised initially (population density and forward planning/"effect" of immigration overall is not as simple as sometimes painted and that (at least) a number of the points we have both made are legitimate to feed into the debate. On the question of you mourning village cricket teams etc,if you are not already familiar with it,let me direct you to a great album by the Kinks called the "Village Green Preservation Society" and its depiction (partly by exaggerated fantasy)of a world already then disappearing (and not I would suggest because of immigration) in 1968 when the album came out Edited by legaleagle (03 Aug 2015 8.32pm)
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legaleagle

03 Aug 15 8.30pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 03 Aug 2015 10.29am

Thanks for replying.... appreciate it.

I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable.

Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture.

I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists?

I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone.

Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you.

I think the point Hoof,on which hopefully we can agree,is that the issue you raised initially (population density and forward planning/"effect" of immigration overall is not as simple as sometimes painted and that (at least) a number of the points we have both made are legitimate to feed into the debate.

On the question of you mourning village cricket teams etc,if you are not already familiar with it,let me direct you to a great album by the Kinks called the "Village Green Preservation Society" and its depiction (partly by exaggerated fantasy)of a world already then disappearing (and not I would suggest because of immigration) in 1968 when the album came out

Edited by legaleagle (03 Aug 2015 8.32pm)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 03 Aug 15 8.37pm
Quote legaleagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.30pm Quote Hoof Hearted at 03 Aug 2015 10.29am Thanks for replying.... appreciate it. I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable. Your first point about religion.... I guess you mean the Poles? Currently we can do nothing about them and they do not pose a threat to our security. Also their religion "jives" in with ours, so they have no need to build places of worship! I have no doubts that immigration can and has created economic growth. However... that is no comfort to communities that have been swamped with immigrants, eg Lincolnshire where they cannot get their kids in local schools and see a doctor immediately. London has changed dramatically since 1939. Less houses and more offices have been built I would guess? Similar theme in Bristol. Both areas have seen people pushed out to the suburbs, so both London and Bristol are probably twice the size they were pre war geographically. Woodlands are being re-instated.... due to erosion and the effect on watercourses. None of them are from housing developments being demolished, but instead replacing hill farming (sheep grazing predominantly). Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture. To counter your claims I would re-state that in some areas their presence causes problems (schools GP's). Some areas their presence has divided communities. Here in Bristol St Pauls and Easton are virtually at war with each other as Yardies take on pakistani gangs for drugs distribution/turf war. Bradford has different but greater problems along with Rochdale and Rotherham where Asians have got away with raping young girls because the police felt it un-PC to even investigate these crimes let alone make arrests. I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists? I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone. I'm not blaming the immigrants for this loss of our heritage, but it a sign that our country has changed due to pressures of living, squeezing of space and people not having time to enjoy life.You mentioned London in 1939... I expect it was a nicer place to live then than now even with WWII looming. Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you. I think the point Hoof,on which hopefully we can agree,is that the issue you raised initially (population density and forward planning/"effect" of immigration overall is not as simple as sometimes painted and that (at least) a number of the points we have both made are legitimate to feed into the debate. On the question of you mourning village cricket teams etc,if you are not already familiar with it,let me direct you to a great album by the Kinks called the "Village Green Preservation Society" and its depiction (partly by exaggerated fantasy)of a world already then disappearing (and not I would suggest because of immigration) in 1968 when the album came out Edited by legaleagle (03 Aug 2015 8.32pm) Come to Shizzlehurst, we've got all of that and a duck pond to boot. Shame that the library is soon to be closed.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 03 Aug 15 8.37pm

Quote legaleagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.30pm

Quote Hoof Hearted at 03 Aug 2015 10.29am

Thanks for replying.... appreciate it.

I wasn't specifically labelling you as "advocating wholesale immigration".... I think most of your posts are sensible and quite reasonable.

Your last collection of points revolve around the economic effects of immigrants and whether or not they enrich or diversify our culture.

I also worry about our security. How many of those trying to get in from Calais or elsewhere are fundamentalists?

I've seen a great change in the UK since I was born in 1954 and for me, not for the better. A lot of things like seeing a maypole, village cricket teams, country pubs, carnivals have all but gone.

Seriously legal, in terms of space (ignoring economics) enough is enough - I don't want to be as crowded as Singapore thank you.

Edited by legaleagle (03 Aug 2015 8.32pm)

Come to Shizzlehurst, we've got all of that and a duck pond to boot.

Shame that the library is soon to be closed.

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Kermit8 Hevon 03 Aug 15 8.44pm
Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.25pm My solution to this problem is to send the SAS in and machine gun all the 'I come England, lots of money' brigade. Machine gun the vermin, burn their camps to the ground and deny all knowledge. When another lot rock up, do exactly the same, then they'll soon realise that the only thing they'll be getting is a bullet or two. Drastic measures. And I'd be more than happy to volunteer. Permission to come with you and hold your billycan, Mr Mainwaring sir. Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 03 Aug 15 8.44pm

Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.25pm

Permission to come with you and hold your billycan, Mr Mainwaring sir.

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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elgrande bedford 03 Aug 15 9.08pm
Quote Kermit8 at 03 Aug 2015 8.44pm Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.25pm My solution to this problem is to send the SAS in and machine gun all the 'I come England, lots of money' brigade. Machine gun the vermin, burn their camps to the ground and deny all knowledge. When another lot rock up, do exactly the same, then they'll soon realise that the only thing they'll be getting is a bullet or two. Drastic measures. And I'd be more than happy to volunteer. Permission to come with you and hold your billycan, Mr Mainwaring sir. Ha ha , that is funny Kermes always a Norwood boy, where ever I live.
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elgrande

bedford 03 Aug 15 9.08pm

Quote Kermit8 at 03 Aug 2015 8.44pm

Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.25pm

Permission to come with you and hold your billycan, Mr Mainwaring sir.

Ha ha , that is funny Kermes

always a Norwood boy, where ever I live.

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-TUX- Alphabettispaghetti 03 Aug 15 9.21pm
Quote elgrande at 03 Aug 2015 9.08pm Quote Kermit8 at 03 Aug 2015 8.44pm Quote fed up eagle at 03 Aug 2015 8.25pm My solution to this problem is to send the SAS in and machine gun all the 'I come England, lots of money' brigade. Machine gun the vermin, burn their camps to the ground and deny all knowledge. When another lot rock up, do exactly the same, then they'll soon realise that the only thing they'll be getting is a bullet or two. Drastic measures. And I'd be more than happy to volunteer. Permission to come with you and hold your billycan, Mr Mainwaring sir. Ha ha , that is funny Kermes The correct answer is 'Shut up Pike'. Time to move forward together.
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-TUX-