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 cryrst  The garden of England 15 Aug 23 10.17am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
So Trump has been charged again. This time with 18;others on charges related to trying to overturn the 2020 election. Charges include racketeering and forgery. This is another unprecedented event in the USA. Trump, of course, claims it is all part of the “witch hunt” being mounted against him in the run up to the 2024 election. Given what we all witnessed such a claim appears ludicrous but apparently not to his support base. I cannot see how a “freedom of speech” defence could be sustained for this but I do see significant issues in getting the case in court. Cases brought under the same legislation are stymied by jury selection. Having 19 sets of lawyers able to question each potential juror at length and then refuse them could take years. Perhaps some of those charged will be offered plea deals in return for cooperation? This will only harden the resolve of the Trump base but it will also put the GOP in an awkward position. Do they risk upsetting them or make themselves look even more ridiculous than they already have with their “political motivations “ claims and risk alienating all the independents, without whom they cannot win. It’s going to be interesting! So he asked the question of the counted votes and were they correct. The same as some did over brexit I would imagine. He hasn’t tried to change votes, simply asked a question and he’s up before the beak. He’s going to make these people look stupid. He probably knew this was coming prior to his election even. Don’t get mad get even. You wissie will be left with egg on your face, firstly in your defence of pervy Biden and his crack head son and trumps re election.
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ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 15 Aug 23 10.55am |
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Biden's dynamism, public speaking, persona and ground-breaking policies meant that he got the most votes ever for a US President by millions. Although the numbers were swayed by postal votes coming in at the last minute in several key states; although illegal block voting had actually been discovered before in the US - there is no reason at all to be suspicious about that. Just accept it unquestioningly because the system and government is always right, above reproach and never corrupt.
Red and Blue Army! |
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Wisbech Eagle  Truro Cornwall 15 Aug 23 11.15am |
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Originally posted by cryrst
So he asked the question of the counted votes and were they correct. The same as some did over brexit I would imagine. He hasn’t tried to change votes, simply asked a question and he’s up before the beak. He’s going to make these people look stupid. He probably knew this was coming prior to his election even. Don’t get mad get even. You wissie will be left with egg on your face, firstly in your defence of pervy Biden and his crack head son and trumps re election. Trump did a lot more than just as a question though. There are legitimate ways to do that, non of them illegal. You can request recounts and for courts to carry out investigations into any alleged procedural irregularities. All of these were attempted and nothing untoward was found. This was about trying to exert pressure on state officials and using fake electors to illegally certify results to change the outcome. Biden has nothing to do with this, but exactly the same applies to him as it does to Trump. The evidence should be put before a court and due process allowed to determine guilt or innocence.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 15 Aug 23 11.22am |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
Biden's dynamism, public speaking, persona and ground-breaking policies meant that he got the most votes ever for a US President by millions. Although the numbers were swayed by postal votes coming in at the last minute in several key states; although illegal block voting had actually been discovered before in the US - there is no reason at all to be suspicious about that. Just accept it unquestioningly because the system and government is always right, above reproach and never corrupt. There are perfectly legal ways to raise concerns and have them investigated. Which were tried and failed. Just because Trump didn't like the result doesn't mean it wasn't the result. Trying to overturn it through a conspiracy involving others and pressurising officials or using fake signatures is potentially a criminal act. This is what is alleged and must now be proved. There is clearly enough evidence to satisfy a Grand Jury that there is a case to answer. So now he must answer the case. If he is innocent he will have every opportunity to show why.
For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally. |
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 georgenorman 15 Aug 23 12.00pm |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
There are perfectly legal ways to raise concerns and have them investigated. Which were tried and failed. Just because Trump didn't like the result doesn't mean it wasn't the result. Trying to overturn it through a conspiracy involving others and pressurising officials or using fake signatures is potentially a criminal act. This is what is alleged and must now be proved. There is clearly enough evidence to satisfy a Grand Jury that there is a case to answer. So now he must answer the case. If he is innocent he will have every opportunity to show why. He doesn't have to, it is the prosecutor who must prove that he is guilty, just the same if you were in court.
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| Matov 15 Aug 23 12.20pm |
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We are through the looking glass here. Effectively State instituions are doing any and everything to prevent a man, who is the clear favourite by a country mile, to win the Republican nomination as Presidential candidate from being able to stand. This is beyond anything ever in a Western, supposedly 'liberal', democracy. And all it seems to do is increase his popularity. His rallies are HUGE. The Democrats, with Republican co-opertion on many levels, managed to steal an election during the Covid crisis (Biden as the most popular President ever? LOL) but know they cannot pull a similar stunt a second time. Going to be an interesting campaign. Trump needs to up his personal protection because they will come for him eventually.
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
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| silvertop Portishead 15 Aug 23 1.07pm |
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Having started this thread I am not sure I have commented again. Seemed rude. However, the following on the current charges. I hate Trump. I make no bones about it. I would like to see him behind bars purely because I think he is a c**t. However, that is not a crime. With sizeable regret, I can't help feeling some sympathy for the argument that the current charges are, at least in part, politically motivated. Understatement? The Stormy Daniels charges are utter bollox. How a prosecuting authority can genuinely hope to get this over the line with proper regard to the rule of law and a genuinely impartial jury is anyone's guess. The vote rigging thing perhaps, but it is current process is it not? They all do it and a blind eye is USUALLY shown. Dubya stole his election through his Florida connections in a way that was obvious and open and kindly overlooked. Why this time a prosecution? The only one that holds any water is the confidential files at home. This is particularly if there were names in the secret files that were put at risk. However, if there were not, then I bet Clinton, both Bushes and Biden (up until the prosecution) all took work home with them in homes that are nigh on impregnable fortresses. Does the establishment not realize that this is further polarizing that nation along pre-existing lines; and actually emboldening Trump supporters.
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Teddy Eagle  15 Aug 23 1.10pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Having started this thread I am not sure I have commented again. Seemed rude. However, the following on the current charges. I hate Trump. I make no bones about it. I would like to see him behind bars purely because I think he is a c**t. However, that is not a crime. With sizeable regret, I can't help feeling some sympathy for the argument that the current charges are, at least in part, politically motivated. Understatement? The Stormy Daniels charges are utter bollox. How a prosecuting authority can genuinely hope to get this over the line with proper regard to the rule of law and a genuinely impartial jury is anyone's guess. The vote rigging thing perhaps, but it is current process is it not? They all do it and a blind eye is USUALLY shown. Dubya stole his election through his Florida connections in a way that was obvious and open and kindly overlooked. Why this time a prosecution? The only one that holds any water is the confidential files at home. This is particularly if there were names in the secret files that were put at risk. However, if there were not, then I bet Clinton, both Bushes and Biden (up until the prosecution) all took work home with them in homes that are nigh on impregnable fortresses. Does the establishment not realize that this is further polarizing that nation along pre-existing lines; and actually emboldening Trump supporters. A very fair summation. You might need your tin hat on though.
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| silvertop Portishead 15 Aug 23 1.21pm |
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Originally posted by Matov
We are through the looking glass here. Effectively State instituions are doing any and everything to prevent a man, who is the clear favourite by a country mile, to win the Republican nomination as Presidential candidate from being able to stand. This is beyond anything ever in a Western, supposedly 'liberal', democracy. And all it seems to do is increase his popularity. His rallies are HUGE. The Democrats, with Republican co-opertion on many levels, managed to steal an election during the Covid crisis (Biden as the most popular President ever? LOL) but know they cannot pull a similar stunt a second time. Going to be an interesting campaign. Trump needs to up his personal protection because they will come for him eventually. After my last post and by way of balance, this is utter conspiracy hogwash (well not over and above the usual tomfoolery undoubtedly perpetrated by both sides where the endemic corruption balances out).
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| silvertop Portishead 15 Aug 23 1.23pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
A very fair summation. You might need your tin hat on though. Possibly. But from which side?
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| Teddy Eagle 15 Aug 23 1.27pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Possibly. But from which side? The one which supports the wispy haired old codger.
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Nicholas91  The Democratic Republic of Kent 15 Aug 23 1.27pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
Having started this thread I am not sure I have commented again. Seemed rude. However, the following on the current charges. I hate Trump. I make no bones about it. I would like to see him behind bars purely because I think he is a c**t. However, that is not a crime. With sizeable regret, I can't help feeling some sympathy for the argument that the current charges are, at least in part, politically motivated. Understatement? The Stormy Daniels charges are utter bollox. How a prosecuting authority can genuinely hope to get this over the line with proper regard to the rule of law and a genuinely impartial jury is anyone's guess. The vote rigging thing perhaps, but it is current process is it not? They all do it and a blind eye is USUALLY shown. Dubya stole his election through his Florida connections in a way that was obvious and open and kindly overlooked. Why this time a prosecution? The only one that holds any water is the confidential files at home. This is particularly if there were names in the secret files that were put at risk. However, if there were not, then I bet Clinton, both Bushes and Biden (up until the prosecution) all took work home with them in homes that are nigh on impregnable fortresses. Does the establishment not realize that this is further polarizing that nation along pre-existing lines; and actually emboldening Trump supporters. Like that, fair. I thought it would be ubiquitously acknowledged that the attempted slander of Trump is only that and US elections had long been popularity contests, between characters, as opposed to anything based in politic or rational thinking? TBH I think it plays into Trump's hands, rousing his supporters and what not.
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
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