Euro 2024
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 silvertop  Portishead 02 Jul 24 12.41pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
I can't be bothered to look it up but I'd be surprised if there's much difference in playing time - half their squad plays in the Premier League and the rest at top European clubs with comparable fixture lists to ours. They did rotate most of their team for the 3rd group game though, which we also should have done. A lot play in the EPL but look at Portugal Germany France and Spain. Deduct their EPL players they still have pretty good squads. It's our Cup games and the requirement to field "proper" teams. Take that out of the equation and the difference all but disappears. I am not suggesting we do that. But we do have to work with that pre tournament handicap and this is how I think they do it. No more exhausted players running on empty by the QF. But for that wonder goal by Denmark (that the player has never scored the like of and never will again) I suspect we could have rotated. Then again, I agree the criticism of GS being stubbornly wedded to one line up so perhaps not.
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| MrRobbo Purley 02 Jul 24 1.39pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Right, so both approaches are imperfect - that still doesn't support this idea that we're so uniquely s*** in a tournament where pretty much everyone is struggling. France haven't scored a goal from open play yet. (only own goals + penalties) Portugal played so expansively and excitingly that they failed to score in 120 minutes, having already lost to Georgia. For me the difference is that other teams have had sticky periods, or whole games. We've been useless for almost all of our 4. This is a pretty interesting/damming article that highlights some of our issues: Key statistical findings: England rank second-bottom for shots on target and expected goals per game England have registered far more passes in their own half than any other side (ineffective possession) England's average starting distance at Euro 2024 is 42.4m (8th) (sitting deep) England have typically allowed opponents to make 16.1 passes before attempting to intervene - only Slovenia and Romania have been less intense. (lack of intensity and pressing) Only Slovenia's Andraz Sporar has averaged fewer touches per 90 minutes than Harry Kane among the teams remaining at Euro 2024
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| CrazyBadger Ware 02 Jul 24 1.44pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
Right, so both approaches are imperfect - that still doesn't support this idea that we're so uniquely s*** in a tournament where pretty much everyone is struggling. France haven't scored a goal from open play yet. (only own goals + penalties) Portugal played so expansively and excitingly that they failed to score in 120 minutes, having already lost to Georgia. Yes, both are imperfect, very few approaches are perfect. but one is eminently more enjoyable to watch and shows that they at least have brought the correct picking kit to unlock the door. All other teams may not be getting the Results they are looking for, but where they're not 'clicking', we are looking void of all ideas.
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| CrazyBadger Ware 02 Jul 24 1.45pm |
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Originally posted by MrRobbo
For me the difference is that other teams have had sticky periods, or whole games. We've been useless for almost all of our 4. This is a pretty interesting/damming article that highlights some of our issues: Key statistical findings: England rank second-bottom for shots on target and expected goals per game England have registered far more passes in their own half than any other side (ineffective possession) England's average starting distance at Euro 2024 is 42.4m (8th) (sitting deep) England have typically allowed opponents to make 16.1 passes before attempting to intervene - only Slovenia and Romania have been less intense. (lack of intensity and pressing) Only Slovenia's Andraz Sporar has averaged fewer touches per 90 minutes than Harry Kane among the teams remaining at Euro 2024
"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one" |
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 EverybodyDannsNow SE19 02 Jul 24 1.58pm |
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Originally posted by MrRobbo
For me the difference is that other teams have had sticky periods, or whole games. We've been useless for almost all of our 4. This is a pretty interesting/damming article that highlights some of our issues: Key statistical findings: England rank second-bottom for shots on target and expected goals per game England have registered far more passes in their own half than any other side (ineffective possession) England's average starting distance at Euro 2024 is 42.4m (8th) (sitting deep) England have typically allowed opponents to make 16.1 passes before attempting to intervene - only Slovenia and Romania have been less intense. (lack of intensity and pressing) Only Slovenia's Andraz Sporar has averaged fewer touches per 90 minutes than Harry Kane among the teams remaining at Euro 2024 And we also top basically all of the defensive statistics for how many chances we give away and the quality of those chances, because we are a defensive team. Again, there is no right and wrong here, just a difference in approaches, but it's very clear England are not unique in their struggles in this tournament. Portugal have just failed to score in a combined 210 mins play against Georgia and Slovenia - forgive me if I don't look at that as something we should aspire to be in the name of 'looking exciting'.
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eagleman13  On The Road To Hell & Alicante 02 Jul 24 2.28pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
A lot play in the EPL but look at Portugal Germany France and Spain. Deduct their EPL players they still have pretty good squads. It's our Cup games and the requirement to field "proper" teams. Take that out of the equation and the difference all but disappears. I am not suggesting we do that. But we do have to work with that pre tournament handicap and this is how I think they do it. No more exhausted players running on empty by the QF. But for that wonder goal by Denmark (that the player has never scored the like of and never will again) I suspect we could have rotated. Then again, I agree the criticism of GS being stubbornly wedded to one line up so perhaps not. Rubbish. Football in England has been played with domestic cups & 'proper' teams as you call it, virtually since football started. Players are now having to go to far flung countries to play friendlies pre-season(& mid-season sometimes) plus, FIFA & associated partners(UEFA, AFCON etc) have numerous club & country comps ie Nations League, World Club Cup etc & all are now expanded to allow more teams in which means even more games. The FA is now having to cut back on traditional cup games(replays) to fit UEFA's expanded formats as there is no room in the calendar to have our usual comps, there's hardly any time for players to even have a proper break now. So, no, our cups are not the cause.
Joy And Pain is like Sunshine and Rain |
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ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 02 Jul 24 2.37pm |
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Has it come home yet?
Red and Blue Army! |
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| MrRobbo Purley 02 Jul 24 3.31pm |
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Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow
And we also top basically all of the defensive statistics for how many chances we give away and the quality of those chances, because we are a defensive team. Again, there is no right and wrong here, just a difference in approaches, but it's very clear England are not unique in their struggles in this tournament. Portugal have just failed to score in a combined 210 mins play against Georgia and Slovenia - forgive me if I don't look at that as something we should aspire to be in the name of 'looking exciting'. The issue that most have is that we don't believe that England should be a defensive team. Or at least not this cautious. It's not like we are not short on attacking talent, and have no option but to rely on the defence. We have some of the best attacking talent in world football. Added to that, the majority of our team, play for attacking teams, that are usually brilliant at doing all the things that we now cannot do.
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| CrazyBadger Ware 02 Jul 24 3.58pm |
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Originally posted by MrRobbo
The issue that most have is that we don't believe that England should be a defensive team. Or at least not this cautious. It's not like we are not short on attacking talent, and have no option but to rely on the defence. We have some of the best attacking talent in world football. Added to that, the majority of our team, play for attacking teams, that are usually brilliant at doing all the things that we now cannot do. We're not a defensive team.
"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one" |
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| Elpis In a pub 02 Jul 24 4.04pm |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
Has it come home yet? No , but its on its way
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| silvertop Portishead 02 Jul 24 4.19pm |
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Originally posted by eagleman13
Rubbish. Football in England has been played with domestic cups & 'proper' teams as you call it, virtually since football started. Players are now having to go to far flung countries to play friendlies pre-season(& mid-season sometimes) plus, FIFA & associated partners(UEFA, AFCON etc) have numerous club & country comps ie Nations League, World Club Cup etc & all are now expanded to allow more teams in which means even more games. The FA is now having to cut back on traditional cup games(replays) to fit UEFA's expanded formats as there is no room in the calendar to have our usual comps, there's hardly any time for players to even have a proper break now. So, no, our cups are not the cause. You appear to have highlighted my paragraph in angry red which you dismiss as "rubbish" in order to violently agree with me save for a different (and probably correct) reason.
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| eagleman13 On The Road To Hell & Alicante 02 Jul 24 4.47pm |
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Originally posted by silvertop
You appear to have highlighted my paragraph in angry red which you dismiss as "rubbish" in order to violently agree with me save for a different (and probably correct) reason. 'Angry' red? it is one of the colours available to use by this site, i could've used yellow, but that would strain posters eyes. 'Violently' agree? i have never indicated violence to you on your post. As for saving you for a different reason, your post indicated that you meant the FA & League cups, that is how it read as far as i'm concerned. Enjoy the rest of your day.
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