Did Russia ever stop being an enemy or was there just a temporary pause whilst they flirted with democracy until the mob got control again and Putin his hands on the levers of power?

Those who relax their guard will get a bloody nose. Or worse.

Just as when we adopted a suppression strategy, rather than one of containment, with Covid, there are economic consequences which impact our future.

However, it’s better to have a future than take the risk we might not.

None of these are easy judgements. It is thought easy to theorise about things which didn’t happen and conclude they would have produced a better outcome, when the truth is they may have been much worse.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Allowing Russia to have taken over Ukraine with her military and economy undamaged would have had the potential to have started a domino effect in Eastern Europe, leaving Russia directly at our borders.

A new Cold War would have been a very likely consequence of that, which we have now anyway, but with a weakened Russia who now have to rebuild.

Russia is already winning the cyber war and has cultivated support in the west from the gullible this way. What is called Russiagate by some is real enough. It’s just unproven at the moment.

Russia won’t invade us, but they are trying to undermine our resolve and are supporting politicians sympathetic to their authoritarian style. There are other ways than a military takeover to change our future.

Orban is an evil dictator who has no regard for either his people or democracy. To hold him up as an example to be followed is to point out why Russia needs to be opposed.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

As to a certain poster's latest comment....'go on then, get yourself down to the trenches and live out your principles'.

Now, if that were the standard there would be far less windbags in this world.

To quote Bismarck.....someone who knew a little something about war.

'It is easy for a statesman ... to use the people’s wind to give a blast on the war trumpet while warming his feet at his fireside or delivering rousing speeches from this platform, and to leave it up to the musketeer bleeding in the snow whether or not his system wins the day and reaps the glory. There is nothing easier, but woe betide the statesman who in this age fails to seek a reason for war that remains valid after the war is over. Prussian honour does not consist in Prussia playing the Don Quixote all over Germany for the benefit of every disgruntled parliamentary celebrity who feels his local constitution is in jeopardy…'
(Bismarck 1850)'

Edited by Stirlingsays (24 Nov 2023 11.47pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

I thought Blackadder summed it up more succinctly, “Clearly, Field Marshal Haig is about to make yet another gargantuan effort to move his drinks cabinet six inches closer to Berlin.”

Well, it would be great if the war was about to end.

I guess Putin better call off his troops then.

Meanwhile Zelensky posted on Telegram yesterday, 'Difficult weather, difficult defence on the Lyman, Bakhmut, Donetsk and Avdiivka fronts. Offensive actions in the south'.

Considering he's only going to put the best spin on things I'll let you come to your own conclusions.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

I find it difficult to believe the narrative on both sides, which is why I largely stay out of this sort of debate. The truth is probably best found by taking the opposite view to what you are being told such is the level of mis and disinformation these days. Might be too cynical a view, but then again maybe not.