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jamiemartin721 Reading 14 Nov 16 4.44pm
Originally posted by We are goin up! Except he won't make people's lives better. Socialism never does, which is why no-one in this country votes for it. Well, yes, it does, but traditionally its been for the party elite. Much like capitalism does - In Socialism as in capitalism there are Those that greatly benefit, those who do well, those who get by and those who get fked. It all really depends where you sit in the hierarchy, and how you view your position. Plenty of people who lost their jobs or suffered wage controls due to Freedom of Movement, blamed, the migrants or the EU. But it wasn't those groups that were employing the migrants over you or me. Also when people get made redundant, by companies posting record profits, do they blame capitalism? Do they fk. We believe in it, because we're culturally adapted and indocrtirnated to it. But a quick look at the third world suggests its failing an awful lot of people. "One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" [Link]
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jamiemartin721

Reading 14 Nov 16 4.44pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!

Except he won't make people's lives better. Socialism never does, which is why no-one in this country votes for it.

Well, yes, it does, but traditionally its been for the party elite. Much like capitalism does - In Socialism as in capitalism there are

Those that greatly benefit, those who do well, those who get by and those who get f**ked. It all really depends where you sit in the hierarchy, and how you view your position.

Plenty of people who lost their jobs or suffered wage controls due to Freedom of Movement, blamed, the migrants or the EU. But it wasn't those groups that were employing the migrants over you or me. Also when people get made redundant, by companies posting record profits, do they blame capitalism? Do they f**k.

We believe in it, because we're culturally adapted and indocrtirnated to it. But a quick look at the third world suggests its failing an awful lot of people.

"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug"
[Link]

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Hrolf The Ganger 14 Nov 16 4.44pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 Crime is an odd one, I think its an issue, but successive governments have gotten tougher on crime generation on generation to appease the public. The problem with crime is that a) the fear of crime exceeds the threat of crime b) that law enforcement is very much biased towards the upper working and middle classes. One of the issues of anyone living in a poor area, with high crime, tends to be that the police aren't very effective, and that the objective of policing tend to be focused towards more political agenda, rather than pragmatic approaches that focus on resolving issues of crime in poor areas, which often ends up pitting the police against the community. As for the rapidly changing cultural and political landscape - I think that's nothing new. That's been ever present in society, and something of a misnomer - I grew up in a very politically turbulent changing landscape - the 80s (the death of industrialism, changing economies, the rise of consumerism, the far left and right etc). The issue really maybe now is that there isn't really much in terms of cultural or political change - Everything has become increasingly bland and blurred into an indistinct blur (there is no left or right in government, not really and culturally generations have become less pronounced). The world and communication are far closer. We now worry about absurd things, and petty things. Which for someone who grew up with the threat of nuclear annihilation, seem rather petty. For example, where are the youth subcultures?. Edited by jamiemartin721 (14 Nov 2016 4.14pm) Perhaps so, but perception is everything. There has always been a relationship between minorities and crime and the cause of that is almost beside the point. Political change is on going of course but this time the rise of right wing attitudes has been driven by immigration and the inevitable pandering to minorities for their votes. This is probably stronger in the US that here right now but maybe not for long. The backlash had to happen eventually. Along side that, there is certainly more disdain for party politics in Britain from older generations who have seen it all before and those who fell betrayed. The younger voter, needless to say,is still naive enough to believe political soap boxing. There has been a clamber from all parties to gain the majority middle ground. New Labour and the current Tories being the best example. Corbyn has rejected this approach and will fail because of that. The rise of the internet has allowed less considered opinion to become relevant and the noisy minority to have too big a voice.
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Hrolf The Ganger

14 Nov 16 4.44pm

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Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Crime is an odd one, I think its an issue, but successive governments have gotten tougher on crime generation on generation to appease the public. The problem with crime is that a) the fear of crime exceeds the threat of crime b) that law enforcement is very much biased towards the upper working and middle classes.

One of the issues of anyone living in a poor area, with high crime, tends to be that the police aren't very effective, and that the objective of policing tend to be focused towards more political agenda, rather than pragmatic approaches that focus on resolving issues of crime in poor areas, which often ends up pitting the police against the community.

As for the rapidly changing cultural and political landscape - I think that's nothing new. That's been ever present in society, and something of a misnomer - I grew up in a very politically turbulent changing landscape - the 80s (the death of industrialism, changing economies, the rise of consumerism, the far left and right etc).

The issue really maybe now is that there isn't really much in terms of cultural or political change - Everything has become increasingly bland and blurred into an indistinct blur (there is no left or right in government, not really and culturally generations have become less pronounced).

The world and communication are far closer. We now worry about absurd things, and petty things. Which for someone who grew up with the threat of nuclear annihilation, seem rather petty.

For example, where are the youth subcultures?.

Edited by jamiemartin721 (14 Nov 2016 4.14pm)

Perhaps so, but perception is everything.
There has always been a relationship between minorities and crime and the cause of that is almost beside the point.
Political change is on going of course but this time the rise of right wing attitudes has been driven by immigration and the inevitable pandering to minorities for their votes. This is probably stronger in the US that here right now but maybe not for long. The backlash had to happen eventually.
Along side that, there is certainly more disdain for party politics in Britain from older generations who have seen it all before and those who fell betrayed. The younger voter, needless to say,is still naive enough to believe political soap boxing. There has been a clamber from all parties to gain the majority middle ground. New Labour and the current Tories being the best example. Corbyn has rejected this approach and will fail because of that.

The rise of the internet has allowed less considered opinion to become relevant and the noisy minority to have too big a voice.

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Part Time James 14 Nov 16 4.45pm
Originally posted by Nest Please tell me what political belief makes life better so i can vote for it Voting is dead. If you are serious about anything enough to want to force it to happen you have to gather about 50 other people together and mount an aggressive Facebook campaign.
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Part Time James

14 Nov 16 4.45pm

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Originally posted by Nest

Please tell me what political belief makes life better so i can vote for it

Voting is dead. If you are serious about anything enough to want to force it to happen you have to gather about 50 other people together and mount an aggressive Facebook campaign.

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We are goin up! Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 4.46pm
Originally posted by Nest Please tell me what political belief makes life better so i can vote for it Capitalism has made lives infinitely better across the globe. Something to watch: [Link] The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.
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We are goin up!

Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 4.46pm

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Originally posted by Nest

Please tell me what political belief makes life better so i can vote for it

Capitalism has made lives infinitely better across the globe.

Something to watch:

[Link]

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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Nest 14 Nov 16 4.49pm
Originally posted by Part Time James Voting is dead. If you are serious about anything enough to want to force it to happen you have to gather about 50 other people together and mount an aggressive Facebook campaign. Um........really
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Nest

14 Nov 16 4.49pm

Originally posted by Part Time James

Voting is dead. If you are serious about anything enough to want to force it to happen you have to gather about 50 other people together and mount an aggressive Facebook campaign.

Um........really

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Nest 14 Nov 16 4.50pm
Originally posted by We are goin up! Capitalism has made lives infinitely better across the globe. Something to watch: [Link] my original post had a double edge
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Nest

14 Nov 16 4.50pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!

Capitalism has made lives infinitely better across the globe.

Something to watch:

[Link]

my original post had a double edge

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We are goin up! Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 4.54pm
Originally posted by jamiemartin721 Well, yes, it does, but traditionally its been for the party elite. Much like capitalism does - In Socialism as in capitalism there are Those that greatly benefit, those who do well, those who get by and those who get fked. It all really depends where you sit in the hierarchy, and how you view your position. Plenty of people who lost their jobs or suffered wage controls due to Freedom of Movement, blamed, the migrants or the EU. But it wasn't those groups that were employing the migrants over you or me. Also when people get made redundant, by companies posting record profits, do they blame capitalism? Do they fk. We believe in it, because we're culturally adapted and indocrtirnated to it. But a quick look at the third world suggests its failing an awful lot of people. Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa. At the moment, Africa has a 30% tarriff to sell us goods, if we took those protectionist (anti-capitalist) tariffs down and promoted free trade the market would create many, many more jobs in that area. Real jobs. And prices of our goods would fall, making us wealthier. The EU's protectionist policies directly contribute to poverty. Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives. Attachment: capitalism.jpg (97.99Kb) The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.
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We are goin up!

Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 4.54pm

Originally posted by jamiemartin721

Well, yes, it does, but traditionally its been for the party elite. Much like capitalism does - In Socialism as in capitalism there are

Those that greatly benefit, those who do well, those who get by and those who get f**ked. It all really depends where you sit in the hierarchy, and how you view your position.

We believe in it, because we're culturally adapted and indocrtirnated to it. But a quick look at the third world suggests its failing an awful lot of people.

Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa.

At the moment, Africa has a 30% tarriff to sell us goods, if we took those protectionist (anti-capitalist) tariffs down and promoted free trade the market would create many, many more jobs in that area. Real jobs. And prices of our goods would fall, making us wealthier. The EU's protectionist policies directly contribute to poverty.

Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives.

Attachment: capitalism.jpg (97.99Kb)

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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Part Time James 14 Nov 16 5.00pm
Originally posted by Nest Um........really It's about as active as some self professed politically passionate people seem to get, yeah!
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Part Time James

14 Nov 16 5.00pm

Originally posted by Nest

Um........really

It's about as active as some self professed politically passionate people seem to get, yeah!

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Stuk Top half 14 Nov 16 5.06pm
Originally posted by We are goin up! Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa. At the moment, Africa has a 30% tarriff to sell us goods, if we took those protectionist (anti-capitalist) tariffs down and promoted free trade the market would create many, many more jobs in that area. Real jobs. And prices of our goods would fall, making us wealthier. The EU's protectionist policies directly contribute to poverty. Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives. No wonder diamonds are so pricey. Optimistic as ever
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Stuk

Top half 14 Nov 16 5.06pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!

Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa.

At the moment, Africa has a 30% tarriff to sell us goods, if we took those protectionist (anti-capitalist) tariffs down and promoted free trade the market would create many, many more jobs in that area. Real jobs. And prices of our goods would fall, making us wealthier. The EU's protectionist policies directly contribute to poverty.

Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives.

No wonder diamonds are so pricey.

Optimistic as ever

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Nest 14 Nov 16 5.25pm
Originally posted by We are goin up! Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa. At the moment, Africa has a 30% tarriff to sell us goods, if we took those protectionist (anti-capitalist) tariffs down and promoted free trade the market would create many, many more jobs in that area. Real jobs. And prices of our goods would fall, making us wealthier. The EU's protectionist policies directly contribute to poverty. Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives. Not true on all produce but this is an increasing problem which many westerners do not even know exists. As far as 'Capitalism is the best system ever created by man' i think you need to look outside the (your) box
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Nest

14 Nov 16 5.25pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!

Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa.

Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives.

Not true on all produce but this is an increasing problem which many westerners do not even know exists. As far as 'Capitalism is the best system ever created by man' i think you need to look outside the (your) box

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We are goin up! Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 5.28pm
Originally posted by Nest Not true on all produce but this is an increasing problem which many westerners do not even know exists. As far as 'Capitalism is the best system ever created by man' i think you need to look outside the (your) box Go on then. I'm listening. The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.
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We are goin up!

Coulsdon 14 Nov 16 5.28pm

Originally posted by Nest

Not true on all produce but this is an increasing problem which many westerners do not even know exists. As far as 'Capitalism is the best system ever created by man' i think you need to look outside the (your) box

Go on then. I'm listening.

The problem with socialism is that you eventually run out of other people's money.

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.TUX. 14 Nov 16 5.33pm
Originally posted by We are goin up! Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa. At the moment, Africa has a 30% tarriff to sell us goods, if we took those protectionist (anti-capitalist) tariffs down and promoted free trade the market would create many, many more jobs in that area. Real jobs. And prices of our goods would fall, making us wealthier. The EU's protectionist policies directly contribute to poverty. Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives. I agree, and for thousands of years it worked perfectly without the 'help' of govt. When the powers that be start dicking about with a perfectly good system the system is no longer 'free', it's manipulated. The opposite of the system that you believe we currently have. Sadly you're not alone in your thinking. Buy Litecoin.
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.TUX.

14 Nov 16 5.33pm

Originally posted by We are goin up!

Completely disagree. One of my main arguments for Brexit was that getting out of the EU meant we could trade with Africa.

Capitalism is the best system ever created by man, it's not perfect but it is a darn sight better than any of the current alternatives.

I agree, and for thousands of years it worked perfectly without the 'help' of govt.
When the powers that be start dicking about with a perfectly good system the system is no longer 'free', it's manipulated. The opposite of the system that you believe we currently have.
Sadly you're not alone in your thinking.

Buy Litecoin.

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