CONservative government incompetence.

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CONservative government incompetence.

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Hrolf The Ganger 20 Jan 23 10.36pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 The NHS can't take any more reform, Sunak and Starmer are politicians we have seen how they interfere and create problems. We don't need them, we need the NHS. For us, how many of us dread getting ill or an accident I know I do. I've seen instances where patients are waiting four days in corridors it's quite appalling, the staff sh****d out and demoralised. The under-funding of the NHS by the tories is a national disgrace. You just don't get it do you. The NHS is screwed. There are doctors who are clueless, not to mention lazy. There are far too many people in it who don't do anything related to treating the sick. Recruitment is a joke. Communication is pathetic and it is being asked to do more and more for more people. It cannot continue as it is. It is killing people with negligence and inefficiency. Money won't fix any of that.
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Hrolf The Ganger

20 Jan 23 10.36pm

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Originally posted by steeleye20

The NHS can't take any more reform, Sunak and Starmer are politicians we have seen how they interfere and create problems.

We don't need them, we need the NHS.

For us, how many of us dread getting ill or an accident I know I do.

I've seen instances where patients are waiting four days in corridors it's quite appalling, the staff sh****d out and demoralised.

The under-funding of the NHS by the tories is a national disgrace.

You just don't get it do you.

The NHS is screwed. There are doctors who are clueless, not to mention lazy. There are far too many people in it who don't do anything related to treating the sick.

Recruitment is a joke. Communication is pathetic and it is being asked to do more and more for more people.

It cannot continue as it is. It is killing people with negligence and inefficiency.

Money won't fix any of that.

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HKOwen Hong Kong 20 Jan 23 10.36pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 The NHS can't take any more reform, Sunak and Starmer are politicians we have seen how they interfere and create problems. We don't need them, we need the NHS. For us, how many of us dread getting ill or an accident I know I do. I've seen instances where patients are waiting four days in corridors it's quite appalling, the staff sh****d out and demoralised. The under-funding of the NHS by the tories is a national disgrace. Do you work in a hospital? Any one kept waiting for four days in a corridor is appalling Edited by HKOwen (20 Jan 2023 10.44pm) Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 20 Jan 23 10.36pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

The NHS can't take any more reform, Sunak and Starmer are politicians we have seen how they interfere and create problems.

We don't need them, we need the NHS.

For us, how many of us dread getting ill or an accident I know I do.

I've seen instances where patients are waiting four days in corridors it's quite appalling, the staff sh****d out and demoralised.

The under-funding of the NHS by the tories is a national disgrace.

Do you work in a hospital?

Any one kept waiting for four days in a corridor is appalling

Edited by HKOwen (20 Jan 2023 10.44pm)

Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.

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cryrst The garden of England 21 Jan 23 1.14am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger You just don't get it do you. The NHS is screwed. There are doctors who are clueless, not to mention lazy. There are far too many people in it who don't do anything related to treating the sick. Recruitment is a joke. Communication is pathetic and it is being asked to do more and more for more people. It cannot continue as it is. It is killing people with negligence and inefficiency. Money won't fix any of that. [Link] Negligence like this I guess although some will pin this on the tories somehow ! How many nurses will this pay for, or would it pay a rise to ? Edited by cryrst (21 Jan 2023 1.16am)
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cryrst

The garden of England 21 Jan 23 1.14am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You just don't get it do you.

The NHS is screwed. There are doctors who are clueless, not to mention lazy. There are far too many people in it who don't do anything related to treating the sick.

Recruitment is a joke. Communication is pathetic and it is being asked to do more and more for more people.

It cannot continue as it is. It is killing people with negligence and inefficiency.

Money won't fix any of that.

[Link]
Negligence like this I guess although some will pin this on the tories somehow !
How many nurses will this pay for, or would it pay a rise to ?

Edited by cryrst (21 Jan 2023 1.16am)

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Midlands Eagle 21 Jan 23 5.52am
Originally posted by steeleye20 The NHS can't take any more reform, Sunak and Starmer are politicians we have seen how they interfere and create problems. We don't need them, we need the NHS. I've mentioned this before but it's worth mentioning again. I watched a TV program a few years ago where three ex Labour Health Secretaries got round a table with six ex Tory Health secretaries and were all interviewed together. The one thing that they all agreed upon was that the biggest stumbling block to change or modernisation or indeed anything was the doctors themselves who adamantly refused to change anything whether the proposals came from a Labour or Conservative government
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Midlands Eagle

21 Jan 23 5.52am

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Originally posted by steeleye20

The NHS can't take any more reform, Sunak and Starmer are politicians we have seen how they interfere and create problems.

We don't need them, we need the NHS.

I've mentioned this before but it's worth mentioning again. I watched a TV program a few years ago where three ex Labour Health Secretaries got round a table with six ex Tory Health secretaries and were all interviewed together.

The one thing that they all agreed upon was that the biggest stumbling block to change or modernisation or indeed anything was the doctors themselves who adamantly refused to change anything whether the proposals came from a Labour or Conservative government

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Midlands Eagle 21 Jan 23 5.56am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger You forgot about Steeleye. He has Jeremy Corbyn wallpaper and wears a ushanka in the bath. I excluded Steeleye as I didn't think he was a real person but a bot programmed to inject anti government propaganda three times a day in order to liven up the forum
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Midlands Eagle

21 Jan 23 5.56am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

You forgot about Steeleye.

He has Jeremy Corbyn wallpaper and wears a ushanka in the bath.

I excluded Steeleye as I didn't think he was a real person but a bot programmed to inject anti government propaganda three times a day in order to liven up the forum

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HKOwen Hong Kong 21 Jan 23 6.59am
Originally posted by steeleye20 Fiona Bruce says Tory's NHS stats 'don't look so good' in awkward Question Time moment BBC Question Time presenter Fiona Bruce said a Conservative claim of record spending on the NHS “doesn’t look so good” in an excruciating moment on the show. Even in the financial crisis labour prioritised the NHS. The tories have managed an average annual increase of only 1.6% despite covid and all the increased pressures and costs over the last 10 3years. Fiona Bruce is a presenter whose opinion is worthless on such matters.She is not a journalist or a political analyst. Her awkward comment contradicts the BBC position of being non partisan, I don't know whether she was told to say this by the producer or took it upon herself, either way she spoke out of turn. The Conservative was pretty useless, politicians of all shades will compare apples with oranges when it suits them. The NHS needs proper funding and a major overhaul, it's not one or the other. Edited by HKOwen (21 Jan 2023 7.01am) Edited by HKOwen (21 Jan 2023 7.04am) Responsibility Deficit Disorder is a medical condition. Symptoms include inability to be corrected when wrong, false sense of superiority, desire to share personal info no else cares about, general hubris. It's a medical issue rather than pure arrogance.
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HKOwen

Hong Kong 21 Jan 23 6.59am

Originally posted by steeleye20

Fiona Bruce says Tory's NHS stats 'don't look so good' in awkward Question Time moment

BBC Question Time presenter Fiona Bruce said a Conservative claim of record spending on the NHS “doesn’t look so good” in an excruciating moment on the show.

Even in the financial crisis labour prioritised the NHS.

The tories have managed an average annual increase of only 1.6% despite covid and all the increased pressures and costs over the last 10 3years.

Fiona Bruce is a presenter whose opinion is worthless on such matters.She is not a journalist or a political analyst.

Her awkward comment contradicts the BBC position of being non partisan, I don't know whether she was told to say this by the producer or took it upon herself, either way she spoke out of turn.

The Conservative was pretty useless, politicians of all shades will compare apples with oranges when it suits them.

The NHS needs proper funding and a major overhaul, it's not one or the other.
Edited by HKOwen (21 Jan 2023 7.01am)

Edited by HKOwen (21 Jan 2023 7.04am)

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Badger11 Beckenham 21 Jan 23 9.14am
Sajid Javid on charging for appointments. [Link] I agree with his point about the religious fervour of some about the NHS the model has to change however I am not convinced about appointment charging. What is the goal? Is it to raise revenue or cut down on missed appointments. Raising revenue: How much will it raise? Is it worth the extra cost of collecting and chasing people who can't pay wont pay. (Would it be a poll tax revolt). He hints that the poor would be protected in other words this is just yet another tax on the middle classes. No Show Appointments: I am sure it will reduce the number of missed appointments but at what cost? There are other ways of doing it. One example: All GP appointments are unconfirmed the patient has to confirm they will be attending e.g. the day before the appointment if not confirmed by a deadline the appointment is released and reused. All of this can be done by technology e.g. automated phone system press 1 to confirm appointment or by web or APP. Conclusion I think missed appointments are a nuisance but are a distraction to the bigger issues of the NHS. If they want to raise revenue then put up income tax. Edited by Badger11 (21 Jan 2023 9.15am) One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 21 Jan 23 9.14am

Sajid Javid on charging for appointments.

[Link]

I agree with his point about the religious fervour of some about the NHS the model has to change however I am not convinced about appointment charging.

What is the goal? Is it to raise revenue or cut down on missed appointments.

Raising revenue:
How much will it raise? Is it worth the extra cost of collecting and chasing people who can't pay wont pay. (Would it be a poll tax revolt). He hints that the poor would be protected in other words this is just yet another tax on the middle classes.

No Show Appointments:
I am sure it will reduce the number of missed appointments but at what cost? There are other ways of doing it.

One example: All GP appointments are unconfirmed the patient has to confirm they will be attending e.g. the day before the appointment if not confirmed by a deadline the appointment is released and reused.

All of this can be done by technology e.g. automated phone system press 1 to confirm appointment or by web or APP.

Conclusion
I think missed appointments are a nuisance but are a distraction to the bigger issues of the NHS. If they want to raise revenue then put up income tax.

Edited by Badger11 (21 Jan 2023 9.15am)

One more point

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cryrst The garden of England 21 Jan 23 10.45am
Originally posted by Badger11 Sajid Javid on charging for appointments. [Link] I agree with his point about the religious fervour of some about the NHS the model has to change however I am not convinced about appointment charging. What is the goal? Is it to raise revenue or cut down on missed appointments. Raising revenue: How much will it raise? Is it worth the extra cost of collecting and chasing people who can't pay wont pay. (Would it be a poll tax revolt). He hints that the poor would be protected in other words this is just yet another tax on the middle classes. No Show Appointments: I am sure it will reduce the number of missed appointments but at what cost? There are other ways of doing it. One example: All GP appointments are unconfirmed the patient has to confirm they will be attending e.g. the day before the appointment if not confirmed by a deadline the appointment is released and reused. All of this can be done by technology e.g. automated phone system press 1 to confirm appointment or by web or APP. Conclusion I think missed appointments are a nuisance but are a distraction to the bigger issues of the NHS. If they want to raise revenue then put up income tax. Edited by Badger11 (21 Jan 2023 9.15am) Til someone had a cancelled appointment and turns up for a fight or a patient dies because they couldn’t see the quack.
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cryrst

The garden of England 21 Jan 23 10.45am

Originally posted by Badger11

Sajid Javid on charging for appointments.

[Link]

I agree with his point about the religious fervour of some about the NHS the model has to change however I am not convinced about appointment charging.

What is the goal? Is it to raise revenue or cut down on missed appointments.

No Show Appointments:
I am sure it will reduce the number of missed appointments but at what cost? There are other ways of doing it.

All of this can be done by technology e.g. automated phone system press 1 to confirm appointment or by web or APP.

Conclusion
I think missed appointments are a nuisance but are a distraction to the bigger issues of the NHS. If they want to raise revenue then put up income tax.

Edited by Badger11 (21 Jan 2023 9.15am)

Til someone had a cancelled appointment and turns up for a fight or a patient dies because they couldn’t see the quack.

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becky over the moon 21 Jan 23 11.40am
Originally posted by Badger11 Sajid Javid on charging for appointments. [Link] I agree with his point about the religious fervour of some about the NHS the model has to change however I am not convinced about appointment charging. What is the goal? Is it to raise revenue or cut down on missed appointments. Raising revenue: How much will it raise? Is it worth the extra cost of collecting and chasing people who can't pay wont pay. (Would it be a poll tax revolt). He hints that the poor would be protected in other words this is just yet another tax on the middle classes. No Show Appointments: I am sure it will reduce the number of missed appointments but at what cost? There are other ways of doing it. One example: All GP appointments are unconfirmed the patient has to confirm they will be attending e.g. the day before the appointment if not confirmed by a deadline the appointment is released and reused. All of this can be done by technology e.g. automated phone system press 1 to confirm appointment or by web or APP. Conclusion I think missed appointments are a nuisance but are a distraction to the bigger issues of the NHS. If they want to raise revenue then put up income tax. Edited by Badger11 (21 Jan 2023 9.15am) If they really want to raise revenue, how about a prepay demand from all those overseas health 'tourists' who don't qualify for free treatment and are allowed to walk out without paying because no-one has the time (or inclination) to chase them up? Estimated at between £110 - 208 million a year, would bring in a lot more than missed appointment charges. A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers
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becky

over the moon 21 Jan 23 11.40am

Originally posted by Badger11

Sajid Javid on charging for appointments.

[Link]

I agree with his point about the religious fervour of some about the NHS the model has to change however I am not convinced about appointment charging.

What is the goal? Is it to raise revenue or cut down on missed appointments.

No Show Appointments:
I am sure it will reduce the number of missed appointments but at what cost? There are other ways of doing it.

All of this can be done by technology e.g. automated phone system press 1 to confirm appointment or by web or APP.

Conclusion
I think missed appointments are a nuisance but are a distraction to the bigger issues of the NHS. If they want to raise revenue then put up income tax.

Edited by Badger11 (21 Jan 2023 9.15am)

If they really want to raise revenue, how about a prepay demand from all those overseas health 'tourists' who don't qualify for free treatment and are allowed to walk out without paying because no-one has the time (or inclination) to chase them up?

Estimated at between £110 - 208 million a year, would bring in a lot more than missed appointment charges.

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

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Badger11 Beckenham 21 Jan 23 11.46am
Originally posted by becky If they really want to raise revenue, how about a prepay demand from all those overseas health 'tourists' who don't qualify for free treatment and are allowed to walk out without paying because no-one has the time (or inclination) to chase them up? Estimated at between £110 - 208 million a year, would bring in a lot more than missed appointment charges. Compulsory Health Insurance should be part of the visa system. That would take care of most of the problems. As for EU citizens we can claim that back if we are not doing that somebody should be sacked. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 21 Jan 23 11.46am

Originally posted by becky

Estimated at between £110 - 208 million a year, would bring in a lot more than missed appointment charges.

Compulsory Health Insurance should be part of the visa system. That would take care of most of the problems.

As for EU citizens we can claim that back if we are not doing that somebody should be sacked.

One more point

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Mapletree Croydon 21 Jan 23 2.45pm
Hospital treatment is free to people who are "ordinarily resident" in the UK. To be considered ordinarily resident and entitled to free hospital treatment, you must be living in the UK on a lawful and properly settled basis for the time being. You may be asked to prove this. You cannot be considered ordinarily resident in the UK unless you have indefinite leave to remain or status under the EU Settlement Scheme. If you're coming to the UK on a temporary stay of more than 6 months, you may be required to pay an immigration health surcharge at the time of your visa application. It is a legal requirement for providers of relevant NHS services to recover the estimated full cost of a course of treatment in advance unless doing so would prevent or delay the provision of immediately necessary or urgent treatment. Edited by Mapletree (21 Jan 2023 2.49pm)
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Mapletree

Croydon 21 Jan 23 2.45pm

Hospital treatment is free to people who are "ordinarily resident" in the UK.

To be considered ordinarily resident and entitled to free hospital treatment, you must be living in the UK on a lawful and properly settled basis for the time being. You may be asked to prove this.

You cannot be considered ordinarily resident in the UK unless you have indefinite leave to remain or status under the EU Settlement Scheme.

If you're coming to the UK on a temporary stay of more than 6 months, you may be required to pay an immigration health surcharge at the time of your visa application.

It is a legal requirement for providers of relevant NHS services to recover the estimated full cost of a course of treatment in advance unless doing so would prevent or delay the provision of immediately necessary or urgent treatment.

Edited by Mapletree (21 Jan 2023 2.49pm)

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Midlands Eagle 21 Jan 23 2.48pm
Originally posted by cryrst Til someone had a cancelled appointment and turns up for a fight or a patient dies because they couldn’t see the quack. It isn't just getting appointments that is the problem. I am diabetic and re-ordered my meds using Patient Access last Monday. By Friday morning the doctor or pharmacist still hadn't approved it so I telephoned and the receptionist said that she would give the practice pharmacist a reminder. He still didn't approve it and in a couple more days I am out of meds which are not just for diabetes but also statins, blood pressure pills and a couple of other bits and pieces
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Midlands Eagle

21 Jan 23 2.48pm

Originally posted by cryrst

Til someone had a cancelled appointment and turns up for a fight or a patient dies because they couldn’t see the quack.

It isn't just getting appointments that is the problem. I am diabetic and re-ordered my meds using Patient Access last Monday. By Friday morning the doctor or pharmacist still hadn't approved it so I telephoned and the receptionist said that she would give the practice pharmacist a reminder.

He still didn't approve it and in a couple more days I am out of meds which are not just for diabetes but also statins, blood pressure pills and a couple of other bits and pieces

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