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Government cock-up thread 2019-2024
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 Stirlingsays  29 Dec 19 7.11pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
Quite bizzare but not surprising! The conversation descending into farce...if only a moderator could sort this out. Mmmmm...started with it you mean. No, a leader doesn't just take the wrap for a mistake made by underlings. A leader takes the wrap for the results of decisions they make.....It's not their fault if a civil servant does A or B.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| derby eagle Derby 29 Dec 19 7.36pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Mmmmm...started with it you mean. No, a leader doesn't just take the wrap for a mistake made by underlings. A leader takes the wrap for the results of decisions they make.....It's not their fault if a civil servant does A or B. Underlings? Class. A leader should by default take the wrap when it goes wrong and take personal responsibility for success and failure and the actions of their team. If you cannot understand or dissect the exact detail of what is going on in your organisation you probably ain't up to the task, and it would be wise not get that high up the ladder.
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Teddy Eagle  29 Dec 19 8.11pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
Underlings? Class. A leader should by default take the wrap when it goes wrong and take personal responsibility for success and failure and the actions of their team. If you cannot understand or dissect the exact detail of what is going on in your organisation you probably ain't up to the task, and it would be wise not get that high up the ladder. Different skill set. Why else do organisations employ specialists?
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| Badger11 Beckenham 29 Dec 19 8.11pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
Underlings? Class. A leader should by default take the wrap when it goes wrong and take personal responsibility for success and failure and the actions of their team. If you cannot understand or dissect the exact detail of what is going on in your organisation you probably ain't up to the task, and it would be wise not get that high up the ladder. There are thousands of civil servants you cannot expect the PM or the minister to be personally responsible for their individual mistakes. I do expect the senior politicians to take responsibility for policy decisions so if they ignore warnings from civil servants e.g. the policy is doing harm or if they fail to act after being warned of systemic failures or cover up I would hold them responsible for that. Someone pushing a wrong button , no.
One more point |
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| Stirlingsays 29 Dec 19 8.13pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
Underlings? Class. A leader should by default take the wrap when it goes wrong and take personal responsibility for success and failure and the actions of their team. If you cannot understand or dissect the exact detail of what is going on in your organisation you probably ain't up to the task, and it would be wise not get that high up the ladder. Really?....Sorry....I'm all for expecting a leader to put in a shift....but I find this plainly ridiculous and wholly unrealistic. Ok, give me an example of a leader who does this? The reality is that a political leader isn't an administrator and they have to delegate. They are not to blame for the faulty button pressings of a civil servant.
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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| derby eagle Derby 29 Dec 19 8.42pm |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
Really?....Sorry....I'm all for expecting a leader to put in a shift....but I find this plainly ridiculous and wholly unrealistic. Ok, give me an example of a leader who does this? The reality is that a political leader isn't an administrator and they have to delegate. They are not to blame for the faulty button pressings of a civil servant. Samuel Adam's or Roosevelt.
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| Teddy Eagle 29 Dec 19 8.46pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
Samuel Adam's or Roosevelt. Sorry...what about them?
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| derby eagle Derby 29 Dec 19 8.48pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Sorry...what about them? I was asked for an example of leaders where that was the case...given.
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| Teddy Eagle 29 Dec 19 9.03pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
I was asked for an example of leaders where that was the case...given. Which Roosevelt? Are you claiming they could both fully understand every job in their administrations?
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| Stirlingsays 29 Dec 19 9.04pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
Samuel Adam's or Roosevelt. Absurd. Franklin or Theodore?
'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen) |
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cryrst  The garden of England 29 Dec 19 9.07pm |
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Originally posted by derby eagle
How amusing. I absolutely agree with that statement. And parents should 100% accountable for their kids actions. I dont have kids by the way and I'm in my mid 40s. A conscious desison for all sorts of reasons. Next! Mid forties.
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| derby eagle Derby 29 Dec 19 9.09pm |
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Originally posted by cryrst
Mid forties. Bad AT maths.
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