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Username Horsham 24 Feb 17 10.28am | |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
That's a bizarre list to have a problem with. A bunch of frees and loans who cost very little. That's how clubs like us build a squad, by taking a gamble on players who can provide depth. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. If we never took risks like that, then we wouldn't have signed: Jerome, Chamakh, Ledley, Hangeland, Delaney, Jedinak, KG, Ramage, Moritz or Phillips. All of whom played a big part while they were at the club, in one way or another.
Employee of the month is a good example of how someone can be both a winner and a loser at the same time. |
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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Feb 17 10.55am | |
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Originally posted by Username
That's a bizarre list to have a problem with. A bunch of frees and loans who cost very little. That's how clubs like us build a squad, by taking a gamble on players who can provide depth. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't. If we never took risks like that, then we wouldn't have signed: Jerome, Chamakh, Ledley, Hangeland, Delaney, Jedinak, KG, Ramage, Moritz or Phillips. All of whom played a big part while they were at the club, in one way or another. My initial five would have cost around £10mill all told. Not cheap at all. Add Mutch and Fryers that's another £10mill. £20mill that could have been spent on The Academy/Training facilities. Campbell and Sako? Another £5mill-ish and counting. Bamford, Sanogo and Ameobi wages? Another few million. I could name other worthless acquisitions since promotion too. Then there is the 'value for money?' £80mill on Cabaye, Benteke and Townsend and Tomkins (incl salary)
Someone is mis-managing the finances/the golden goose.
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alaneagle1 Dunstable,Bedfordshire.England 24 Feb 17 11.06am | |
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Kermit your just finding fault with everything.
Palace 13th 2017/18. |
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dynamicdick Dormansland 24 Feb 17 11.15am | |
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Originally posted by Willo
Are you suggesting that whatever happens to this club EG we find ourselves in Division One season after next, we should just say "Oh well, we WERE saved from extinction.." ?? Admittedly the situation on 2010 was dire but we cannot keep living in the past and forever bow down to those who prevented the club from folding. We are in trouble right now and this is what matters at the current time. Edited by Willo (23 Feb 2017 11.51am) Willo, please read my post in detail, I never mentioned sliding down to Div 1 just relegation. I was as stated putting things into perspective and the fact is however you may wish to ignore it that SP and the three others saved this club at the eleventh hour plus enabling us to have conversations on this forum. I agree that you cannot keep looking back but when he (SP ) is coming in for criticism there has to be the good and not so good brought out and the events of 2010 were the launch pad for where we are today ......in the Premier league and in good financial shape. That is the balance.
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Rudi Hedman Caterham 24 Feb 17 11.27am | |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
My initial five would have cost around £10mill all told. Not cheap at all. Add Mutch and Fryers that's another £10mill. £20mill that could have been spent on The Academy/Training facilities. Campbell and Sako? Another £5mill-ish and counting. Bamford, Sanogo and Ameobi wages? Another few million. I could name other worthless acquisitions since promotion too. Then there is the 'value for money?' £80mill on Cabaye, Benteke and Townsend and Tomkins (incl salary)
Someone is mis-managing the finances/the golden goose. Kermit, your free from blame super al signed that £80mil lot whilst supposedly having palace's best interests at heart whereas I think he's always aimed to be as close to the manager as possible and safe from the sack and the offer of a new contract just around the corner. Same at Newcastle. All of which was the case just before signing that quartet and nobody else in defence or down the left hand side. Ultimately Parish and Pardew being too close is where it's gone wrong and it all stems from there. I'm sure Parish knows that now. Filling the coaching staff with pals from the early '90s and booting out Garner was highly unprofessional and arrogant and that's why we're uncohesive, unfit, unable to hang onto points and unable to salvage anything from being 1 nil down. But he thinks he did nothing wrong. Yeah nothing if you look at the table from when he was sacked and end your analysis there beside him on the sofa or in Staines Palace's mind.
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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Feb 17 11.37am | |
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Originally posted by alaneagle1
Kermit your just finding fault with everything. I'm cool, alan. This will be my eighth relegation and your's i believe. We are used to it We've never had anything like this kind of money go through the tills before though Edited by Kermit8 (24 Feb 2017 11.38am)
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Username Horsham 24 Feb 17 11.39am | |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
My initial five would have cost around £10mill all told. Not cheap at all. Add Mutch and Fryers that's another £10mill. £20mill that could have been spent on The Academy/Training facilities. Campbell and Sako? Another £5mill-ish and counting. Bamford, Sanogo and Ameobi wages? Another few million. I could name other worthless acquisitions since promotion too. Then there is the 'value for money?' £80mill on Cabaye, Benteke and Townsend and Tomkins (incl salary)
Someone is mis-managing the finances/the golden goose. Not when we were at the bottom of the champ they weren't. The figures might be higher these days, but then as a club we have a budget that is 100x what we had previously to work with. And you're right, my lot did give more. That's the point I'm making. Sometimes these work out, and sometimes they don't. You can't sign Jedinak or Jerome every time. Sometimes you end up with Adebayor. Mutch didn't work out, McArthur did. There isn't a single club in football who has a 100% success rate. The fees you mention? Have a look at other clubs. That's how much player's cost these days if you are a Premier League club. We sold Yannick for £30m, Bournemouth paid £15m for Ibe etc. If you're a Premier League club signing a player who you expect to start for you, £10m is a pretty common starting price. That's why Cabaye's fee doesn't seem so ridiculous to me? He's a regular starter who was exactly in that price range. Benteke? There are only 10 players who have scored more than him in the league this season: Sanchez (£36m) Six of those have reportedly cost more than, or a similar amount to Benteke (and I imagine Lukaku, Hazard and Aguero would all cost a lot more now). Other than that, you've got a 34 year old Jermain Defoe (CB is 26), a 35 year old Ibrahimovic (who let's face it is not exactly in our category) and Harry Kane and Delle Alli, who would probably cost £50m each as well. Point is, in terms of goals Benteke is pretty much performing where he should be based on the transfer fees, and likely salaries, of those ahead of him on the list. If we wanted to replace him, we either have to gamble on someone who could flop completely, or spend at least the same amount again. Islam Slimani has 5 league goals for Leicester this season and cost about the same as Benteke. Those price tags are why it's still worth gambling on Flamini or Remy. If these sorts of players were guaranteed top performers then they wouldn't be available on a free or on loan would they?
Employee of the month is a good example of how someone can be both a winner and a loser at the same time. |
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Palace in the Blood 24 Feb 17 11.40am | |
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I am afraid that the appointment of SA was the end of the road. The players have just not responded to him. He has had money and he has had time I am not saying AP was great in last year and I am not his greatest supporter but the side had much more fight under him
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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Feb 17 11.41am | |
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Originally posted by Rudi Hedman
Kermit, your free from blame super al signed that £80mil lot whilst supposedly having palace's best interests at heart whereas I think he's always aimed to be as close to the manager as possible and safe from the sack and the offer of a new contract just around the corner. Same at Newcastle. All of which was the case just before signing that quartet and nobody else in defence or down the left hand side. Ultimately Parish and Pardew being too close is where it's gone wrong and it all stems from there. I'm sure Parish knows that now. Filling the coaching staff with pals from the early '90s and booting out Garner was highly unprofessional and arrogant and that's why we're uncohesive, unfit, unable to hang onto points and unable to salvage anything from being 1 nil down. But he thinks he did nothing wrong. Yeah nothing if you look at the table from when he was sacked and end your analysis there beside him on the sofa or in Staines Palace's mind. Rudi - i started a thread on here a year or so ago lamenting just how awful Palace have been through the decades with getting the right 'big money' signings and not wasting money and hoping Parish hadn't forgotten the past and learn from it. He has and he hasn't, obviously.
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Willo South coast - west of Brighton. 24 Feb 17 11.51am | |
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Originally posted by dynamicdick
Willo, please read my post in detail, I never mentioned sliding down to Div 1 just relegation. I was as stated putting things into perspective and the fact is however you may wish to ignore it that SP and the three others saved this club at the eleventh hour plus enabling us to have conversations on this forum. I agree that you cannot keep looking back but when he (SP ) is coming in for criticism there has to be the good and not so good brought out and the events of 2010 were the launch pad for where we are today ......in the Premier league and in good financial shape. That is the balance. Dynamic Dick I am certainly not in "Ignore mode" in the manner you have suggested and having read the post above I understand where you are coming from in terms of "Balance". I fully appreciate the part CPFC2010 played in saving our club from extinction and appreciate the "Launch pad" effect which you stated. All I was saying is that through all our trials and tribulations now and possibly in future years we simply cannot keep up the mantra of "Oh well, we nearly went bust blah, blah ,blah etc etc". I am eternally grateful for CPFC2010 but sometimes in life one has to move on and face the 'Music' in the current without making comparisons with the past.
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Kermit8 Hevon 24 Feb 17 11.59am | |
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Originally posted by Username
Not when we were at the bottom of the champ they weren't. The figures might be higher these days, but then as a club we have a budget that is 100x what we had previously to work with. And you're right, my lot did give more. That's the point I'm making. Sometimes these work out, and sometimes they don't. You can't sign Jedinak or Jerome every time. Sometimes you end up with Adebayor. Mutch didn't work out, McArthur did. There isn't a single club in football who has a 100% success rate. The fees you mention? Have a look at other clubs. That's how much player's cost these days if you are a Premier League club. We sold Yannick for £30m, Bournemouth paid £15m for Ibe etc. If you're a Premier League club signing a player who you expect to start for you, £10m is a pretty common starting price. That's why Cabaye's fee doesn't seem so ridiculous to me? He's a regular starter who was exactly in that price range. Benteke? There are only 10 players who have scored more than him in the league this season: Sanchez (£36m) Six of those have reportedly cost more than, or a similar amount to Benteke (and I imagine Lukaku, Hazard and Aguero would all cost a lot more now). Other than that, you've got a 34 year old Jermain Defoe (CB is 26), a 35 year old Ibrahimovic (who let's face it is not exactly in our category) and Harry Kane and Delle Alli, who would probably cost £50m each as well. Point is, in terms of goals Benteke is pretty much performing where he should be based on the transfer fees, and likely salaries, of those ahead of him on the list. If we wanted to replace him, we either have to gamble on someone who could flop completely, or spend at least the same amount again. Islam Slimani has 5 league goals for Leicester this season and cost about the same as Benteke. Those price tags are why it's still worth gambling on Flamini or Remy. If these sorts of players were guaranteed top performers then they wouldn't be available on a free or on loan would they? I was no major Dwight Gayle fan but even I recognise he would have scored as many goals as Benteke given the same amount of playing time. Just using goals as a pointer to overall worth is mis-leading. You may think Parish/the managers have been successful and used most of the Prem dosh wisely and with prudence and in-keeping with what was expected given the status but I politely strongly disagree.
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bexleydave Barnehurst 24 Feb 17 12.00pm | |
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Originally posted by Willo
I fully appreciate the part CPFC2010 played in saving our club from extinction and appreciate the "Launch pad" effect which you stated. All I was saying is that through all our trials and tribulations now and possibly in future years we simply cannot keep up the mantra of "Oh well, we nearly went bust blah, blah ,blah etc etc". I am eternally grateful for CPFC2010 but sometimes in life one has to move on and face the 'Music' in the current without making comparisons with the past.
Bexley Dave Can you hear the Brighton sing? I can't hear a ******* thing! "The most arrogant, obnoxious bunch of deluded little sun tanned, loafer wearing mummy's boys I've ever had the misfortune of having to listen to" (Burnley forum) |
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