Utter rot, the US backed one side within internal disputes. All completely unethical of course but it has zero impact on their historic economic wealth.

It was sh1te before the Americans, it's was sh1te after the Americans....Who didn't run the places anyway.

Pure excuse politics.

Really....strange then how it only took a few gunships for the British to beat them in the Opium Wars and the Islands of Japan to roll over them in 37.

No China haven't always been a super power......but they made a success once they abandoned pure communism for social communism, economic statist capitalism.

As for the abilities and successes of the Chinese......apparently someone should tell them that 'diversity is a strength' because they didn't get the memo.

They had western interventionism and succeeded a long long time ago.

Japan were successful before and after western interventionism.....As for being a US ally....Well so are most of the South American countries.

Indeed, there is.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 8.46pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Mmmm....

I'm fifty, I've been a teacher for years. I looked into all this over twenty years ago. Yet you tell me to read material that you believe in, when I could direct you to material that you wouldn't believe in.....no point.

South America has plenty of resources and shouldn't be poor anymore than North America is rich. Both the North and South have considerable resources of oil....the fact that South America and Chavez produce economies that are just 'all eggs in one basket' is a function of their institutions and corruption.

I think you are just repeating the left wing explanations and talking points that over emphasizes American effects due to basic anti Americanism and ignores the holistic reality that different societies have different levels of trust and faith/corruption in institutions....and hence investment and hence talent.

Basically if Europeans had decided to take over South America remove all the Hispanics and stay there....Then South America would be rich and North America would be the sh1teshow.....Not politically correct but just true.

That's not to say that there aren't talented and good Hispanics of course there are.....but honest readings of the facts don't lie.

You'd prefer to believe in excuses from those wanting to give them and those wanting to believe them.

As for the point about the UK economy....It switched to services and finance much more in the late seventies....it is most certainly not the feature of our economy until the recent times. From agriculture to the industrial revolution to today's services we had multi threaded approaches to the economy.

The British basically has never had a one trick pony economy because that's not what successful economies do.

That is the very opposite of what I said....sigh.

As for the reading, I suspect I've read far more than yourself.
You said they have always been a superpower....No they haven't. A superpower projects power beyond their region.....China has been invaded and knocked around by the Mongols, British, Japaneses.....all vastly smaller nations. Like India, it was too large to coordinate or control its resources until relatively modern times where it has the benefits and advantages of the west's advances.

I did not speculate upon their civilisation.....which has always been impressive....and just proves my wider point anyway.

Fine, if you just completely ignore the Chinese attitude to foreigners and immigrants. The Han don't allow anyone who isn't Han to have any power on the mainland....that's just reality.

Sure, and they succeeded as they had done before and as they did after.....whereas, you are still blaming the west for everyone who doesn't.

Sure.

Edited by Stirlingsays (01 Dec 2019 10.31pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

No I don't see you as that. I don't think I'd engage you in long discussions if you were. I see you as a left learning neo liberal. A common and well respected political position....that I view as very wrong for us long term.... But I don't deny that it's well meaning.

You want me to spend time researching something from a long time ago? What for? To argue something you wouldn't accept anyway. I've already made some of the arguments.

The only thing the US is to blame for is in being a successful country and in looking out for its own self interest.....Which is the Modus operandi of all other countries.

However, because it's been successful, like all the anglosphere, it's held to a different standard.....Something the left wing Europeans tend to do due to their egalitarian impulses.

Yeah, higher levels of corruption. The US and the anglosphere in general is not responsible for South American culture....or for any other unsuccessful culture.

Really, not excuses?.....South America has never had a successful economy with living standards comparable to Europe. This idea that it was ever different is just not reality.

And it's true, European cultures are less corrupt and higher trust socieities in general....Less crime and more stable societies leading to higher business investment and all the rest of it. That's the real driver between the lack of investment and working institutions, retention of talent and hence wealth.

All realities that lie behind the original contention....Not 'it was America that did it'.

You say, 'lets try a different approach' when I've already answered this.

America didn't 'impose' it picked one side of an existing group within that state.

Sure it benefited the US for a time and it also made little difference......It is not the reason South and Central America is poor and not the reason it's an economic 'sh1tshow'.

John Bolton did not state that the US is responsible for the economies and societal problems of South American countries.

Once again, there are plenty of countries America has intervened in and actually ran....like Japan, which are highly successful.....You just choose to believe victim narratives that point the finger at others because of their own inadequacies.

Once again, it was a sh1tshow before the Americans and it's been a s***eshow long after American interference....A point continually ignored.

You're parroting left wing narratives that blame the west for the problems of less successful countries and then stating it as fact. I've pointed out the inconsistencies of that view.....ie different countries success levels and how different societies create different environments for economies.

Edited by Stirlingsays (02 Dec 2019 10.51am)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

Ahhh. Ok.

2.22am. You students are really lucky.

Trump like petty almost.

Black friday...
Strange it hasnt been renamed due to the fact it has a link to slavery.
It is named after the slave sales the day after Thanksgiving.
Food for thought really.