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House of Commons Attack
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nickgusset  Shizzlehurst 28 Mar 17 11.29am |
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Originally posted by NickinOX
It's funny what an extremely selective use of statistics will provide. Perhaps a more global and less parochial view might help. I was thinking specifically about the UK. Doesn't really feature in your link.
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| nickgusset Shizzlehurst 28 Mar 17 11.35am |
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Originally posted by hedgehog50
By apologist, we are not saying that the left are actually apologising for Islamic inspired attacks. We are highlighting the fact that the left plays down such attacks (more killed by the flu etc) and attempts to distance the attacks from their Islamic roots (nothing whatsoever to do with Islam etc). At the same time, practically any other attack is portrayed as the rise of Fascism. Your recent post concerning 'Adrian': Compare that to your response to the murder of Jo Cox last year: "Britain First and other Infidels are advocating violence talking about taking things to the 'next level ' and threatening Labour MP's. Whether Mair is unhinged or not,ideas are not formed in a vacuum. Some have said the crime wasn't political, but according to press reports Mair told police he was a 'political activist' as he was arrested a mile from the scene, the prosecution said.'I think there's a good chance that his links with hard right wing ideology alongside photos of Mair (if it was him) behind a Britain First banner shows him to be racist. Although we all like the idea of free speech, should Britain First and their ilk be outlawed because of incitement to racial hatred?" "No I am showing that the murder of Jo Cox is the result of a worrying rise of right wing fascism in this country brought about in part by vilification of foreigners." So it would appear that you did not consider Mair to be 'an unhinged nutter' who just happened to have extreme right wing views. Why the inconsistency comrade?
Even if it was found a Muslim who killed people didn't have anything to do with fundamentalism they would still be painted us such.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 28 Mar 17 11.55am |
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Originally posted by Stirlingsays
I think this suggestion misses out the reality that these people aren't exactly getting the opportunity to safely join these groups. They obviously have an interest but outside of watching online videos the action by the state makes interaction with these groups a very risky activity. I find this....'oh they are mentally ill' line of reasoning to be quite amusing. Is this line taken with say Nazi sympathizers or activists? No, that lot get the two barrels....but be connected with a minority religion and then some people start talking about mental illness. Edited by Stirlingsays (28 Mar 2017 10.51am) As I said, for both Muir and Brevik as well, I think its possible to be mentally ill and a 'terrorist' in some cases. There is a pattern of pathology in their behaviour, and in these kinds of 'one man actions' it tends to be people with serious issues, that have effectively wrapped their mental illness and severe issue into an extremist ideology. Rather than being someone who is directly active within a cause and agenda. This bloke has issues with knives and stabbing people that predate his interest in Islam, and a history of seeking out groups that allowed or encouraged him to express himself in violence (the NF, Football Hooliganism, Islamic Fundamentalism). Also there are stories from his ex-wife, and friends that paint a picture of a man who wasn't really stable. The more you look into the history of this guy and people who knew him, the more you get a picture that suggests he's 'a nutter'. That seems a reasonable basis.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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  Hrolf The Ganger 28 Mar 17 11.55am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Even if it was found a Muslim who killed people didn't have anything to do with fundamentalism they would still be painted us such. Yes we get it Nick.
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| reborn 28 Mar 17 11.57am |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
So has anyone else come to the conclusion that the murderer was an unhinged nutter who just happens to be Muslim. Yep. Plus ISIS 'claim' anyone that does this s***. Would be much better to report the whole thing as a 'crime', and let it sink into obscurity. Wall to wall reporting and overt sensationalism about the 'threat' is playing into their hands. To coin a well worn phrase, you have more chance of being run over by a bus than being the victim of these loons.
My username has nothing to do with my religious beliefs |
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| Hrolf The Ganger 28 Mar 17 11.58am |
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Originally posted by jamiemartin721
As I said, for both Muir and Brevik as well, I think its possible to be mentally ill and a 'terrorist' in some cases. There is a pattern of pathology in their behaviour, and in these kinds of 'one man actions' it tends to be people with serious issues, that have effectively wrapped their mental illness and severe issue into an extremist ideology. Rather than being someone who is directly active within a cause and agenda. This bloke has issues with knives and stabbing people that predate his interest in Islam, and a history of seeking out groups that allowed or encouraged him to express himself in violence (the NF, Football Hooliganism, Islamic Fundamentalism). Also there are stories from his ex-wife, and friends that paint a picture of a man who wasn't really stable. The more you look into the history of this guy and people who knew him, the more you get a picture that suggests he's 'a nutter'. That seems a reasonable basis. So the rise of IS is responsible for making all those closet nutters decide to go on mass murdering sprees? Islamic fundamentalism is the problem after all.
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| reborn 28 Mar 17 12.13pm |
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I think the message of Islamic Fundamentalism is of particular attraction, to the some disturbed and inadequate people Hrolf.
My username has nothing to do with my religious beliefs |
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| Hrolf The Ganger 28 Mar 17 12.23pm |
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Originally posted by reborn
I think the message of Islamic Fundamentalism is of particular attraction, to the some disturbed and inadequate people Hrolf. Maybe so but there are an awful lot of inadequate people and to play up that angle really doesn't get to the core of the immediate problem which is the spread of religious zealotry and the arrival of increasing numbers of those people likely to be affected.
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Kermit8  Hevon 28 Mar 17 12.35pm |
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Look Hitler failed, the IRA failed and wahhabi extremists will fail. Snow is the only thing that can stop the UK. Ice-is if you will.
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 28 Mar 17 12.47pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
So the rise of IS is responsible for making all those closet nutters decide to go on mass murdering sprees? Islamic fundamentalism is the problem after all. No, they're people who are inevitably violent because of their issues, and drawn to violent causes. People like this tend to find reasons to kill and indulge their violence (whether rational or absurd), because their psychosis is feed by cues from the world around them. He had two prior convictions for slashing people with knives prior to conversion to Islam, doing time for both. But yes, Islamic fundamentalism is still a major problem. All forms of fundamentalism represent a danger to society, its just the most prevalent one at present.
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| jamiemartin721 Reading 28 Mar 17 12.53pm |
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Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
Maybe so but there are an awful lot of inadequate people and to play up that angle really doesn't get to the core of the immediate problem which is the spread of religious zealotry and the arrival of increasing numbers of those people likely to be affected. Problem is, a lot of those people arriving are also fleeing religious zealotry. I'd imagine that few of the refugees from Syria are actually supporters of IS or hardline Sunni's. Yes, I think we should be very through in determining who we accept into the UK before you ask, but we shouldn't just 'haul up the drawbridge' and hope the refugee crisis resolves itself - that will create new problems - and create further instability. Odd as it seems, the largest number of Syrian refugees taken in by the UK, was 5000, following the outbreak of civil war, which literally was anyone currently working in the UK from Syria (including Embassy staff).
"One Nation Under God, has turned into One Nation Under the Influence of One Drug" |
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| hedgehog50 Croydon 28 Mar 17 1.17pm |
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Originally posted by nickgusset
Even if it was found a Muslim who killed people didn't have anything to do with fundamentalism they would still be painted us such. Yes, but you more or less treated Jo Cox's killing as the advent of the Fourth Reich while dismissing Islamic terrorism as practically non-existent.
We have now sunk to a depth at which the restatement of the obvious is the first duty of intelligent men. [Orwell] |
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