This page is no longer updated, and is the old forum. For new topics visit the New HOL forum.
Register | Edit Profile | Subscriptions | Forum Rules | Log In
DulwichFan West Dulwich 20 Apr 17 7.44pm | |
---|---|
Not sure if this adds to the debate, or should be posted under football talk, but am thinking of chipping in... (and sorry if already posted - I only read back a few pages...) he won't go now till after he and labour are soundly beaten - even then I'm not sure as he hasn't exactly fallen on his sword at any other opportunity! If only he would vacate the position now and let someone like Hillary Benn take on the Tories instead, then Theresa might be given a surprise! And I don't care for any of the 'democratically elected' stuff - yes but by a flawed system that was exploited - and what does it matter when it's convincing the wider electorate that counts not the internal, already persuaded members?!
I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but it is my chief duty to accomplish small tasks as if they were great and noble. |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
nickgusset Shizzlehurst 20 Apr 17 7.49pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by hedgehog50
He wants to reintroduce Clause 4 'State control of all means of production, distribution and exchange'. How does that differ from communist policy? Nationalisation of public assets, electricity, water railways etc. Surely better than the way we are being screwed by the likes of southern rail who take taxpayers money dont provide a good service yet still turn a tidy profit. Where does corbyns help for small business and entrepreneurs fit into your labour = communist twaddle?
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Hrolf The Ganger 20 Apr 17 7.55pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by nickgusset
Nationalisation of public assets, electricity, water railways etc. Surely better than the way we are being screwed by the likes of southern rail who take taxpayers money dont provide a good service yet still turn a tidy profit. Where does corbyns help for small business and entrepreneurs fit into your labour = communist twaddle? It is very annoying to see your yearly pay rise siphoned off by rail network fat cats I agree but at least, and I say this begrudgingly, only train users foot the bill rather than the wider tax payer.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
nickgusset Shizzlehurst 20 Apr 17 7.59pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
It is very annoying to see your yearly pay rise siphoned off by rail network fat cats I agree but at least, and I say this begrudgingly, only train users foot the bill rather than the wider tax payer. Rail privatisation was promoted in the early 1990s in the UK with promises of a better, cheaper service for rail users and reduced taxpayer subsidy. Private rail companies, it was argued, would bring in capital and business expertise which would transform the sector’s performance while competition would drive efficiency and innovation. Action for Rail has published new analysis which comprehensively debunks these ‘myths’ of rail privatisation. To see the new, short report – The Four Big Myths of UK Rail Privatisation, please click here. On each of the above measures, UK rail privatisation has been a failure. Today’s railways require billions more in government funding, private investment has failed to materialise and passengers face the highest fares and travel on some of the oldest rolling stock in Europe. Private train operating companies are net recipients of public subsidy while distributing nearly all their operating profits as dividends to the shareholders of their parent companies. Advocates of rail privatisation adhere to the myth of franchising as a success story for the passenger and the taxpayer. This document busts those myths. Here are some key facts from the mythbusting report:
Growth in rail passenger journeys is driven by three key factors that have nothing to do with train operating companies: longterm growth in GDP, changing commuting patterns as employment has concentrated in major urban areas, particularly in London and the South East, and increase in motoring costs.
Over 90 per cent of new investment in the railways in recent years has been financed by public sector body Network Rail, and comes mainly from taxpayer funding or government-underwritten borrowing.
Since rail privatisation in 1995 up to 2015, all tickets (regulated and unregulated) have increased by an average of 117 per cent, or by 24 per cent in real terms.
The cost of running the railway has more than doubled in real terms since privatisation from £2.4bn per year (1990–91 to 1994–95) to approximately £5.4bn per year (2005–06 to 2009–10). Ain't right is it?
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Hrolf The Ganger 20 Apr 17 8.09pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by nickgusset
Rail privatisation was promoted in the early 1990s in the UK with promises of a better, cheaper service for rail users and reduced taxpayer subsidy. Private rail companies, it was argued, would bring in capital and business expertise which would transform the sector’s performance while competition would drive efficiency and innovation. Action for Rail has published new analysis which comprehensively debunks these ‘myths’ of rail privatisation. To see the new, short report – The Four Big Myths of UK Rail Privatisation, please click here. On each of the above measures, UK rail privatisation has been a failure. Today’s railways require billions more in government funding, private investment has failed to materialise and passengers face the highest fares and travel on some of the oldest rolling stock in Europe. Private train operating companies are net recipients of public subsidy while distributing nearly all their operating profits as dividends to the shareholders of their parent companies. Advocates of rail privatisation adhere to the myth of franchising as a success story for the passenger and the taxpayer. This document busts those myths. Here are some key facts from the mythbusting report:
Growth in rail passenger journeys is driven by three key factors that have nothing to do with train operating companies: longterm growth in GDP, changing commuting patterns as employment has concentrated in major urban areas, particularly in London and the South East, and increase in motoring costs.
Over 90 per cent of new investment in the railways in recent years has been financed by public sector body Network Rail, and comes mainly from taxpayer funding or government-underwritten borrowing.
Since rail privatisation in 1995 up to 2015, all tickets (regulated and unregulated) have increased by an average of 117 per cent, or by 24 per cent in real terms.
The cost of running the railway has more than doubled in real terms since privatisation from £2.4bn per year (1990–91 to 1994–95) to approximately £5.4bn per year (2005–06 to 2009–10). Ain't right is it? I won't dispute your figures as I have none of my own but it is true that the rail network had to be modernised and that costs a lot of money. British Rail were bywords for inefficiency in the 70's and 80's and tax increases to flog a dead horse is not a vote winner.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
croydon proud Any european country i fancy! 20 Apr 17 8.31pm | |
---|---|
Talks a lot of truth if you listen, probably one of the few who does, on the other side we had a pm in cameron letting a company, uber, free role breaking taxi laws as his childs godmother was head of them in uk, even thou they pay no tax, most of there 125000 drivers are not paid minimum wage so get tax credits and rent paid by you, and companys worth 60 billion, big profit in letting taxpayer pay your employees wages, genius! And the chancellor and mayor of london in on the deal, although to be fair to boris he did try and point out it was illegal and wrong, but was shouted down by cameron and six jobs with numerous phone calls and e mails! Jeremy? couldnt be any more useless or corrupt!
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
steeleye20 Croydon 20 Apr 17 9.22pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
I won't dispute your figures as I have none of my own but it is true that the rail network had to be modernised and that costs a lot of money. British Rail were bywords for inefficiency in the 70's and 80's and tax increases to flog a dead horse is not a vote winner. You are missing the point here that the railways are not privatised, a privately owned business has to stand on its own two feet and then it can make profits. It cannot be subsidised by the tax-payer that is ridiculous just to give rich pickings to private individuals - just like any other business the private company has to make its own provision for rolling stock and everything involved in their operation but these people think the tax-payer owes them a living. Profits in the rail industry must be returned to the treasury for the investment in rolling stock and the network to be made. If only Mr and Mrs Normal realised how much they are being screwed every day of this government.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Hrolf The Ganger 20 Apr 17 9.26pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by steeleye20
You are missing the point here that the railways are not privatised, a privately owned business has to stand on its own two feet and then it can make profits. It cannot be subsidised by the tax-payer that is ridiculous just to give rich pickings to private individuals - just like any other business the private company has to make its own provision for rolling stock and everything involved in their operation but these people think the tax-payer owes them a living. Profits in the rail industry must be returned to the treasury for the investment in rolling stock and the network to be made. If only Mr and Mrs Normal realised how much they are being screwed every day of this government.
That is a massive stretch.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
steeleye20 Croydon 20 Apr 17 9.49pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger
That is a massive stretch. Railway users don't just get screwed with the price of their tickets they also get screwed paying taxes to them as well. No stretch at all just how it is. Don't be ideological if privatisation does not fit change it so that profits are ploughed back into the railways and make sure that is actually done. It doesn't have to be like the old British Rail image.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
steeleye20 Croydon 23 Apr 17 1.25pm | |
---|---|
"This morning we learnt that Jeremy Corbyn would refuse to strike against terrorists, dismantle our nuclear defences and fail to control our borders," said Home Secretary Amber Rudd. I can see Jeremy's problem over being mis-reported as he actually said the opposite of what Ms Rudd says. He actually said he would never authorise 'first strike'. That is the position all PMs are in as the missiles can only ever be used in defence. He also agreed that free movement would end when England and Wales leave the EU shame IMO but that's what he said. I don't think thousands of viewers will ring to complain as its a given these days that Mrs May and Ms Rudd are not capable of being truthful in any matter including calling the election. Mrs T hated women in her government I think there were only ever 2 and they were got rid of perhaps this is why. OK I am anti May and anti Rudd too for that matter but if they stopped lying I would have less reason to be.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
DulwichFan West Dulwich 23 Apr 17 2.05pm | |
---|---|
Sorry but have to pull you up on basically saying that all women are liars and can't be trusted! Even if you would qualify it by saying 'in positions of power' or some such excuse, it's a despicable thing to suggest and does you no favour.
I long to accomplish a great and noble task, but it is my chief duty to accomplish small tasks as if they were great and noble. |
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
steeleye20 Croydon 23 Apr 17 2.24pm | |
---|---|
Originally posted by DulwichFan
Sorry but have to pull you up on basically saying that all women are liars and can't be trusted! Even if you would qualify it by saying 'in positions of power' or some such excuse, it's a despicable thing to suggest and does you no favour. No that is exactly what I mean.
|
|
Alert a moderator to this post |
Registration is now on our new message board
To login with your existing username you will need to convert your account over to the new message board.
All images and text on this site are copyright © 1999-2024 The Holmesdale Online, unless otherwise stated.
Web Design by Guntrisoft Ltd.