CONservative government incompetence.

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CONservative government incompetence.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 8.25am
Originally posted by Stirlingsays I'm not really going to get into the claims involving 'climate change' other than to state that it's factually correct that previous projections have been shown as hyperbolic by....to use Kamala Harris's enjoyable phrase, 'the passage of time'. What consequences were there for these inaccuracies? None.....What benefits were there to the people making them?....funding and topic expansion. However, let's accept the premises that everything being claimed is true and accurate and above board. There is no joined up thinking. It's clear that despite all the 'holier than thou' language and hand wringing by the numerous jet setting politicians any commitment to action on climate change is little more than virtue signalling language.....which, considering the realistic impact, paradoxically some might thank god for. Sure, they set themselves targets and ask their own people to limit themselves but that's like telling the fat boy to put down his cake. The reality is that the well to do aren't going to swap their holidays for home and instead they will be expecting the plebs to make the sacrifice. The western elites have decided to fight a cold war and in so doing created an economic and confrontational division between two economic blocks.....creating a multipolar world. Now, sorry and all that, but that doesn't sound to me like a serious commitment to changing the climate. Asking people in the west to wear a hair shirt while the other half burn coal and ignore your targets makes a parody of the whole effort. To me it kind of reveals the reality of priorities and the confused motivations....or deliberate lies that lie at the heart of these situations. If you ask me, 'climate change' comes some way down the list. So personally, I'm skeptical as to the priorities and realism of much of what is said in this area. You can be the hatchling who supports everything an establishment neo/social liberal figure says. For me, I'll listen to words and then observe actions. Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Nov 2022 5.52pm) I missed this recital of all your standard prejudices yesterday. They are all there, mythical elites conspiring to defraud us, the west creating the war, rather than Putin, false climate change claims being deliberately spread, "social liberals" being the root of all evil, etc, etc. The truth is that unless you make a start on tackling the biggest crisis we face, you will never finish. Poking holes in the way that the start is being organised is cheap and easy. Our systems need to change, but to do it we need to use the systems we have now, to recognise what needs to change. We don't have all the answers. We still have many questions. Whether, eventually, we all need to stop flying is a question that needs to be answered. It isn't today's answer. Today we are asking tomorrow's questions, whilst organising actions on those questions we can answer today. It's incredibly difficult. There are polar differences, with a variety of levels of commitment. In a poor country, with an uneducated, ill informed population often going hungry who are more concerned about today's meal than a theoretical crisis in 100 years, staying in power and cutting the use of coal to generate electricity are not a good fit. That's why we need to help. Not just because of any moral imperatives, but simply because it's in our best interests to do so. It's not going to succeed 100%. How close we get is a complete mystery. Whether new technologies will come to our rescue impossible to predict. Whether it will be enough to stop the worst effects unknown. What we do know is that we must do what we can do. That involves meeting, sharing and planning. It involves those who can lead, leading. What we mustn't do is nothing. Or continually moan about those who are trying to do something, imperfect though that might be. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 8.25am

Originally posted by Stirlingsays

I'm not really going to get into the claims involving 'climate change' other than to state that it's factually correct that previous projections have been shown as hyperbolic by....to use Kamala Harris's enjoyable phrase, 'the passage of time'.

What consequences were there for these inaccuracies? None.....What benefits were there to the people making them?....funding and topic expansion.

However, let's accept the premises that everything being claimed is true and accurate and above board.

There is no joined up thinking.

It's clear that despite all the 'holier than thou' language and hand wringing by the numerous jet setting politicians any commitment to action on climate change is little more than virtue signalling language.....which, considering the realistic impact, paradoxically some might thank god for.

Sure, they set themselves targets and ask their own people to limit themselves but that's like telling the fat boy to put down his cake. The reality is that the well to do aren't going to swap their holidays for home and instead they will be expecting the plebs to make the sacrifice.

The western elites have decided to fight a cold war and in so doing created an economic and confrontational division between two economic blocks.....creating a multipolar world.

Now, sorry and all that, but that doesn't sound to me like a serious commitment to changing the climate. Asking people in the west to wear a hair shirt while the other half burn coal and ignore your targets makes a parody of the whole effort.

To me it kind of reveals the reality of priorities and the confused motivations....or deliberate lies that lie at the heart of these situations. If you ask me, 'climate change' comes some way down the list.

So personally, I'm skeptical as to the priorities and realism of much of what is said in this area. You can be the hatchling who supports everything an establishment neo/social liberal figure says. For me, I'll listen to words and then observe actions.

Edited by Stirlingsays (09 Nov 2022 5.52pm)

I missed this recital of all your standard prejudices yesterday. They are all there, mythical elites conspiring to defraud us, the west creating the war, rather than Putin, false climate change claims being deliberately spread, "social liberals" being the root of all evil, etc, etc.

The truth is that unless you make a start on tackling the biggest crisis we face, you will never finish. Poking holes in the way that the start is being organised is cheap and easy. Our systems need to change, but to do it we need to use the systems we have now, to recognise what needs to change.

We don't have all the answers. We still have many questions.

Whether, eventually, we all need to stop flying is a question that needs to be answered. It isn't today's answer. Today we are asking tomorrow's questions, whilst organising actions on those questions we can answer today.

It's incredibly difficult. There are polar differences, with a variety of levels of commitment. In a poor country, with an uneducated, ill informed population often going hungry who are more concerned about today's meal than a theoretical crisis in 100 years, staying in power and cutting the use of coal to generate electricity are not a good fit. That's why we need to help. Not just because of any moral imperatives, but simply because it's in our best interests to do so.

It's not going to succeed 100%. How close we get is a complete mystery. Whether new technologies will come to our rescue impossible to predict. Whether it will be enough to stop the worst effects unknown.

What we do know is that we must do what we can do. That involves meeting, sharing and planning. It involves those who can lead, leading.

What we mustn't do is nothing. Or continually moan about those who are trying to do something, imperfect though that might be.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Badger11 Beckenham 10 Nov 22 8.28am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle I missed this recital of all your standard prejudices yesterday. They are all there, mythical elites conspiring to defraud us, the west creating the war, rather than Putin, false climate change claims being deliberately spread, "social liberals" being the root of all evil, etc, etc. The truth is that unless you make a start on tackling the biggest crisis we face, you will never finish. Poking holes in the way that the start is being organised is cheap and easy. Our systems need to change, but to do it we need to use the systems we have now, to recognise what needs to change. We don't have all the answers. We still have many questions. Whether, eventually, we all need to stop flying is a question that needs to be answered. It isn't today's answer. Today we are asking tomorrow's questions, whilst organising actions on those questions we can answer today. It's incredibly difficult. There are polar differences, with a variety of levels of commitment. In a poor country, with an uneducated, ill informed population often going hungry who are more concerned about today's meal than a theoretical crisis in 100 years, staying in power and cutting the use of coal to generate electricity are not a good fit. That's why we need to help. Not just because of any moral imperatives, but simply because it's in our best interests to do so. It's not going to succeed 100%. How close we get is a complete mystery. Whether new technologies will come to our rescue impossible to predict. Whether it will be enough to stop the worst effects unknown. What we do know is that we must do what we can do. That involves meeting, sharing and planning. It involves those who can lead, leading. What we mustn't do is nothing. Or continually moan about those who are trying to do something, imperfect though that might be. I'm am all in favour of new cleaner technologies as long as they work and make financial sense. I am not in favour of wearing a hair shirt whilst the rest of the world pays lip service and I am definitely not in favour of throwing money at poorer countries when we have major problems at home. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 10 Nov 22 8.28am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

We don't have all the answers. We still have many questions.

What we do know is that we must do what we can do. That involves meeting, sharing and planning. It involves those who can lead, leading.

What we mustn't do is nothing. Or continually moan about those who are trying to do something, imperfect though that might be.

I'm am all in favour of new cleaner technologies as long as they work and make financial sense. I am not in favour of wearing a hair shirt whilst the rest of the world pays lip service and I am definitely not in favour of throwing money at poorer countries when we have major problems at home.

One more point

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 8.34am
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle Still doesn't answer where this money is coming from. There is no answer. Who knows what the economic strength of the future world will be and who has what? Who knows what technological developments will create wealth? All we know is that whatever the cost might be, and for sure the current estimate is just a finger in the wind, it must be met. One person's cost is another's income. Employing people in green energy efforts is still employing people. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 8.34am

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

Still doesn't answer where this money is coming from.

There is no answer.

Who knows what the economic strength of the future world will be and who has what? Who knows what technological developments will create wealth?

All we know is that whatever the cost might be, and for sure the current estimate is just a finger in the wind, it must be met.

One person's cost is another's income. Employing people in green energy efforts is still employing people.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 10 Nov 22 8.46am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle There is no answer. Who knows what the economic strength of the future world will be and who has what? Who knows what technological developments will create wealth? All we know is that whatever the cost might be, and for sure the current estimate is just a finger in the wind, it must be met. One person's cost is another's income. Employing people in green energy efforts is still employing people. We've got people who can't afford to heat, feed or clothe themselves in this country and others are in a far worse situation but this cost "must be met" in the under 30 years. Yes, it's an estimate - the final figure could be much higher. I'm not saying we shouldn't do all we can just questioning the practicalities.
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Teddy Eagle

10 Nov 22 8.46am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

There is no answer.

Who knows what the economic strength of the future world will be and who has what? Who knows what technological developments will create wealth?

All we know is that whatever the cost might be, and for sure the current estimate is just a finger in the wind, it must be met.

One person's cost is another's income. Employing people in green energy efforts is still employing people.

We've got people who can't afford to heat, feed or clothe themselves in this country and others are in a far worse situation but this cost "must be met" in the under 30 years. Yes, it's an estimate - the final figure could be much higher.
I'm not saying we shouldn't do all we can just questioning the practicalities.

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 8.54am
Originally posted by Teddy Eagle We've got people who can't afford to heat, feed or clothe themselves in this country and others are in a far worse situation but this cost "must be met" in the under 30 years. Yes, it's an estimate - the final figure could be much higher. I'm not saying we shouldn't do all we can just questioning the practicalities. We must do both. It's not a choice between them. Which is why the cost to those of us who can afford it is going to be so much higher. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 10 Nov 22 8.54am

Originally posted by Teddy Eagle

We must do both. It's not a choice between them.

Which is why the cost to those of us who can afford it is going to be so much higher.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Teddy Eagle 10 Nov 22 9.18am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle We must do both. It's not a choice between them. Which is why the cost to those of us who can afford it is going to be so much higher. But we can't afford it.
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Teddy Eagle

10 Nov 22 9.18am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

We must do both. It's not a choice between them.

Which is why the cost to those of us who can afford it is going to be so much higher.

But we can't afford it.

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cryrst The garden of England 10 Nov 22 10.10am
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle We must do both. It's not a choice between them. Which is why the cost to those of us who can afford it is going to be so much higher. So when those who can afford it are poorer what about their kin going forwards. Doesn’t that matter? Please don’t come back with the earth this and that if we don’t do anything as that is pure guesswork from all the people benefitting financially. As it stands people are freaked out enough after covid and now this. How much stress is fair?
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cryrst

The garden of England 10 Nov 22 10.10am

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

We must do both. It's not a choice between them.

Which is why the cost to those of us who can afford it is going to be so much higher.

So when those who can afford it are poorer what about their kin going forwards. Doesn’t that matter? Please don’t come back with the earth this and that if we don’t do anything as that is pure guesswork from all the people benefitting financially.
As it stands people are freaked out enough after covid and now this. How much stress is fair?

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Badger11 Beckenham 10 Nov 22 11.59am
Originally posted by cryrst So when those who can afford it are poorer what about their kin going forwards. Doesn’t that matter? Please don’t come back with the earth this and that if we don’t do anything as that is pure guesswork from all the people benefitting financially. As it stands people are freaked out enough after covid and now this. How much stress is fair? The UK public are very generous to overseas charities e.g. Boxing day Tsunami we raised more money than any other country I am not talking about taxpayer funds. I don't see why my taxpayers money should be spent outside of the UK. Those that can and want to can donate via charity the rest of us can choose how we spend our own money. Edited by Badger11 (10 Nov 2022 12.00pm) One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 10 Nov 22 11.59am

Originally posted by cryrst

The UK public are very generous to overseas charities e.g. Boxing day Tsunami we raised more money than any other country I am not talking about taxpayer funds.

I don't see why my taxpayers money should be spent outside of the UK. Those that can and want to can donate via charity the rest of us can choose how we spend our own money.

Edited by Badger11 (10 Nov 2022 12.00pm)

One more point

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Stirlingsays 10 Nov 22 1.28pm
WE's answer is just believe and do what the establishment tell you. Unless he disagrees with it of course. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

10 Nov 22 1.28pm

WE's answer is just believe and do what the establishment tell you.

Unless he disagrees with it of course.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 10 Nov 22 4.38pm
I'll always be on the right but Jess Gill makes a pointed observation here: [Tweet Link] 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

10 Nov 22 4.38pm

I'll always be on the right but Jess Gill makes a pointed observation here:

[Tweet Link]

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 10 Nov 22 5.42pm
Originally posted by Badger11 I'm am all in favour of new cleaner technologies as long as they work and make financial sense. I am not in favour of wearing a hair shirt whilst the rest of the world pays lip service and I am definitely not in favour of throwing money at poorer countries when we have major problems at home. Common sense. No place for you in our political parties I'm afraid. I wouldn't be surprised if being a hemp abusing vegan hadn't become an official requirement to enter parliament by the time I come to pick up my nonexistent pension. Edited by Stirlingsays (10 Nov 2022 5.46pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

10 Nov 22 5.42pm

Originally posted by Badger11

Common sense.

No place for you in our political parties I'm afraid. I wouldn't be surprised if being a hemp abusing vegan hadn't become an official requirement to enter parliament by the time I come to pick up my nonexistent pension.

Edited by Stirlingsays (10 Nov 2022 5.46pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 10 Nov 22 8.13pm
Shocked.....said no one with half a brain cell. [Tweet Link] 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

10 Nov 22 8.13pm

Shocked.....said no one with half a brain cell.

[Tweet Link]

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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