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footythoughts Beckenham 01 Apr 23 10.49am | |
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Originally posted by cryrst
AND up to 60% regret it within 15 years and up to 25% top themselves because of the regret. ( rough figures) Imo these people do need to try to be talked out of it but that is now frowned upon for some strange reason. Bodies are really the sum of your desire but hey who cares; it’s not you !
This really is the crux of the matter. 'If' the number is very low or low, it implies that significant regret could also be in 'not' viewing it as at least an option, and so the focus on the suicide risk of that should factor in. To my mind a sane midway point should be sought, where politics isn't central. That would mean individuals should be given room to consider their identity over time, not either automatically identified as something by advocates intent on validating an outcome, or dehumanised and told their feeling are entirely invalid by people who know nothing about their experience. Having gender dysphoria must be a really tought spot. The desire of some to cobble together anything to make trans people look depraved is ludicrous, being that a significant number of them are clearly unable to change how they feel. It's just another issue where the political weight of something leads far away from the nuances of who people are, and sensible treatment of them.
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cryrst The garden of England 01 Apr 23 12.39pm | |
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Originally posted by footythoughts
This really is the crux of the matter. 'If' the number is very low or low, it implies that significant regret could also be in 'not' viewing it as at least an option, and so the focus on the suicide risk of that should factor in. To my mind a sane midway point should be sought, where politics isn't central. That would mean individuals should be given room to consider their identity over time, not either automatically identified as something by advocates intent on validating an outcome, or dehumanised and told their feeling are entirely invalid by people who know nothing about their experience. Having gender dysphoria must be a really tought spot. The desire of some to cobble together anything to make trans people look depraved is ludicrous, being that a significant number of them are clearly unable to change how they feel. It's just another issue where the political weight of something leads far away from the nuances of who people are, and sensible treatment of them. I did forget to add that this was after a period of 15 years or more. Maybe put that filter on and the results could be a little different.
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berlinpalace berlin 01 Apr 23 1.48pm | |
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Originally posted by cryrst
I did forget to add that this was after a period of 15 years or more. Maybe put that filter on and the results could be a little different.
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Teddy Eagle 01 Apr 23 3.18pm | |
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Originally posted by berlinpalace
Maybe there weren't as many people going through the process. Like the number who might regret getting neck tattoos or having three inch earlobes.
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Hrolf The Ganger 01 Apr 23 6.03pm | |
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Originally posted by berlinpalace
Hi Hrolf, you’re confused, I know it’s not easy when people keep using these terms interchangeably and expect you to keep up with modern usage. Here’s a very short video from Encyclopaedia Britannica that I hope will clarify things to your satisfaction. Give over. You are dancing around the obvious. We all know what a man or woman is, irrespective of terminology. You haven't answered my question. Do you believe that there are more than two sexes? If you think that cutting off your dick and taking a few hormones makes you a woman, then you have been brainwashed by people who are bonkers.
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cryrst The garden of England 01 Apr 23 9.17pm | |
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Originally posted by berlinpalace
So how many is a good sample. 300 from a recent survey wasn’t enough iyo.
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berlinpalace berlin 02 Apr 23 12.25am | |
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Originally posted by cryrst
So how many is a good sample. 300 from a recent survey wasn’t enough iyo. You want to believe that the one tiny little study that backs up what you already believe is the one we should all believe. Unfortunately for you science doesn’t work like that, others have posted links to bigger studies and, as with so many other things, size matters. Plus, it’s from twenty f***ing years ago, everything has moved on apart from your prejudice!
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Teddy Eagle 02 Apr 23 12.42am | |
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Originally posted by berlinpalace
You want to believe that the one tiny little study that backs up what you already believe is the one we should all believe. Unfortunately for you science doesn’t work like that, others have posted links to bigger studies and, as with so many other things, size matters. Plus, it’s from twenty f***ing years ago, everything has moved on apart from your prejudice! Why does it have to be prejudice? Can't it just be lack of interest? Other people's gender might be the core of their own existence but why should it matter to anyone else?
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cryrst The garden of England 02 Apr 23 6.39am | |
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Originally posted by berlinpalace
You want to believe that the one tiny little study that backs up what you already believe is the one we should all believe. Unfortunately for you science doesn’t work like that, others have posted links to bigger studies and, as with so many other things, size matters. Plus, it’s from twenty f***ing years ago, everything has moved on apart from your prejudice! All I’m saying and referencing is that the suicide rate amongst (physically)transitioned humans is higher than in non transitioned humans if you want it to be PC!!!
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berlinpalace berlin 02 Apr 23 9.41am | |
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Originally posted by cryrst
All I’m saying and referencing is that the suicide rate amongst (physically)transitioned humans is higher than in non transitioned humans if you want it to be PC!!!
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Nicholas91 The Democratic Republic of Kent 05 Apr 23 12.14pm | |
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Not sure what to make of this in terms of progress but it does seem like yet more backtracking to reach something that must surely constitute common sense which was previously superseded by a desire to align to social and political movements with complete disregard to logic and wider implications.
Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!! |
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footythoughts Beckenham 05 Apr 23 1.57pm | |
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Originally posted by Nicholas91
Not sure what to make of this in terms of progress but it does seem like yet more backtracking to reach something that must surely constitute common sense which was previously superseded by a desire to align to social and political movements with complete disregard to logic and wider implications. The sports change certainly made sense, as biological men in womens sport provably puts women at distinct disadvantage, no matter if testosterone levels and the like were now reduced. The knock on effect on records, physical safety and the like is clear. The bathroom issue has become near hysterical from all sides, clearly almost all trans women (as with all women, and indeed men) go to the toilet to actually use it. If someone is nuts enough to want to sexually violate others, they can do so without impersonating a woman, so it doesn't in any way reflect on a group as a whole. The other side is that it's fair in a womens space for those present to.. well actually be considered to be women. I'd say the changing room issue is more difficult in that people are more exposed. There are aspects of that to any use of changing rooms though and to my mind places that just have individual cubicles have the right idea. Maybe that should be a law with new facilities goes forward, it would seem to be a sensible idea. A 'careful what you wish for' with this proposed change is that if we base use of these facilities on biological sex, trans men (those who are visually male but are biologically female) are then forced to use womens spaces, and is that the most rational place for them to be? Doesn't that defeat the object (and question the logic) of bringing in such a single sex measures? As with anything newly hyper political, the realities and more nuanced than the lurches.
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