Is it racist to....

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Petealiator 1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 4.56pm
Quote halfmanhalfslug at 28 Nov 2002 4:32pm Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 12:49pm ...of Saxon origin... Fckin' Saxon* w*nkers... hate 'em. Oh... sorry Pete... Yeah, Saxons are pasty-faced, loud-mouthed yobs! But having said that, I've got one or two saxon friends and they're alright they are! My Rocksteady band... [Link] [Link] IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!
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Petealiator

1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 4.56pm

Quote halfmanhalfslug at 28 Nov 2002 4:32pm

Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 12:49pm

...of Saxon origin...

F*ckin' Saxon w*nkers... hate 'em.

Oh... sorry Pete...

Yeah, Saxons are pasty-faced, loud-mouthed yobs! But having said that, I've got one or two saxon friends and they're alright they are!

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

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Petealiator 1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 5.07pm
Quote scout for example, an idiot wanted to shout abuse at Roy Keane, they would call him an 'Irish **'; whereas the same idiot would automatically refer to Ince by his skin colour, not the fact that he was English. That's how I define the difference between racial abuse and hatred, anyway. Well he'd look pretty silly as an Englishman shouting out 'You, you... English Ct!' If the target was Viera, I bet you a pound to a penny he'd shout 'You French C**t!' Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 5:16pm) My Rocksteady band... [Link] [Link] IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!
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Petealiator

1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 5.07pm

Quote scout
for example, an idiot wanted to shout abuse at Roy Keane, they would call him an 'Irish ****'; whereas the same idiot would automatically refer to Ince by his skin colour, not the fact that he was English. That's how I define the difference between racial abuse and hatred, anyway.

Well he'd look pretty silly as an Englishman shouting out 'You, you... English C**t!'
If the target was Viera, I bet you a pound to a penny he'd shout 'You French C**t!'

Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 5:16pm)

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

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Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 28 Nov 02 5.38pm
To distill it still further, what about calling someone a scouse, brummie, geordie or whatever kind of t**? Or the pejorative 'pikey'? It's not possible to legislate how people think; old attitudes die hard and society as a whole can only come to terms with what some people deem unacceptable over a period of time. This country, in fact, has a pretty good track record in assimilating immigrants such as the Hugenots, East European Jews, Italians, Poles etc. The difference nowadays is that much of the immigration is non-white and is therefore preceived to be more of a cultural threat. Some have argued that many actually don't want to integrate, be that because they feel persecuted unless they live in close proximity to each other or because they wish to preserve their own native culture as much as possible. In general, society's attitude towards non-white immigrants has improved immensely since the 1970's, when the 'send 'em back' brigade were assured of a far wider audience than they would be now. In 2002, such attitudes are far more likely to distance someone who holds such views from society at large. Times change, and attitudes change with them. Using the word 'racist' as glibly a it is used nowadays holds its own dangers, though. The MacPherson Report, commissioned after the Stephen Lawrence case, actually stated that if someone thinks you're a racist, then you are. How illogical is that? It seems to imply that any reference you make to someone based upon their ethnicity, good or bad, is somehow discriminatory. How stupid is that? It did, however, make the point that the Police are 'institutionally racist' which is pretty likely but I'd prefer to think of them as institutionally stupid, which I'm sure anyone who's had any dealings with them will testify. We're a long way from a perfect society, where race, colour and creed should be irrelevant in one's opinion of another but we have come on immensely over the last thirty years in terms of attitude and tolerance. Unfortunately, there will always be people who are stupid, there will always be moronic wnkers and I'm afraid they will always come in all colours. Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham
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Cucking Funt

Clapham on the Back 28 Nov 02 5.38pm

To distill it still further, what about calling someone a scouse, brummie, geordie or whatever kind of t***? Or the pejorative 'pikey'?

It's not possible to legislate how people think; old attitudes die hard and society as a whole can only come to terms with what some people deem unacceptable over a period of time. This country, in fact, has a pretty good track record in assimilating immigrants such as the Hugenots, East European Jews, Italians, Poles etc. The difference nowadays is that much of the immigration is non-white and is therefore preceived to be more of a cultural threat. Some have argued that many actually don't want to integrate, be that because they feel persecuted unless they live in close proximity to each other or because they wish to preserve their own native culture as much as possible. In general, society's attitude towards non-white immigrants has improved immensely since the 1970's, when the 'send 'em back' brigade were assured of a far wider audience than they would be now. In 2002, such attitudes are far more likely to distance someone who holds such views from society at large. Times change, and attitudes change with them.

Using the word 'racist' as glibly a it is used nowadays holds its own dangers, though. The MacPherson Report, commissioned after the Stephen Lawrence case, actually stated that if someone thinks you're a racist, then you are. How illogical is that? It seems to imply that any reference you make to someone based upon their ethnicity, good or bad, is somehow discriminatory. How stupid is that? It did, however, make the point that the Police are 'institutionally racist' which is pretty likely but I'd prefer to think of them as institutionally stupid, which I'm sure anyone who's had any dealings with them will testify.

We're a long way from a perfect society, where race, colour and creed should be irrelevant in one's opinion of another but we have come on immensely over the last thirty years in terms of attitude and tolerance. Unfortunately, there will always be people who are stupid, there will always be moronic w*nkers and I'm afraid they will always come in all colours.

Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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scout East Dorset 28 Nov 02 5.47pm
Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 5:07pm Quote scout for example, an idiot wanted to shout abuse at Roy Keane, they would call him an 'Irish **'; whereas the same idiot would automatically refer to Ince by his skin colour, not the fact that he was English. That's how I define the difference between racial abuse and hatred, anyway. Well he'd look pretty silly as an Englishman shouting out 'You, you... English Ct!' If the target was Viera, I bet you a pound to a penny he'd shout 'You French C**t!' Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 5:16pm) Thanks Pete. That's assuming I was referring to an English idiot.
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scout

East Dorset 28 Nov 02 5.47pm

Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 5:07pm

Well he'd look pretty silly as an Englishman shouting out 'You, you... English C**t!'
If the target was Viera, I bet you a pound to a penny he'd shout 'You French C**t!'

Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 5:16pm)

Thanks Pete. That's assuming I was referring to an English idiot.

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Petealiator 1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 5.53pm
Quote Cucking Funt at 28 Nov 2002 5:38pm To distill it still further, what about calling someone a scouse, brummie, geordie or whatever kind of t**? Or the pejorative 'pikey'? It's not possible to legislate how people think; old attitudes die hard and society as a whole can only come to terms with what some people deem unacceptable over a period of time. This country, in fact, has a pretty good track record in assimilating immigrants such as the Hugenots, East European Jews, Italians, Poles etc. The difference nowadays is that much of the immigration is non-white and is therefore preceived to be more of a cultural threat. Some have argued that many actually don't want to integrate, be that because they feel persecuted unless they live in close proximity to each other or because they wish to preserve their own native culture as much as possible. In general, society's attitude towards non-white immigrants has improved immensely since the 1970's, when the 'send 'em back' brigade were assured of a far wider audience than they would be now. In 2002, such attitudes are far more likely to distance someone who holds such views from society at large. Times change, and attitudes change with them. Using the word 'racist' as glibly a it is used nowadays holds its own dangers, though. The MacPherson Report, commissioned after the Stephen Lawrence case, actually stated that if someone thinks you're a racist, then you are. How illogical is that? It seems to imply that any reference you make to someone based upon their ethnicity, good or bad, is somehow discriminatory. How stupid is that? It did, however, make the point that the Police are 'institutionally racist' which is pretty likely but I'd prefer to think of them as institutionally stupid, which I'm sure anyone who's had any dealings with them will testify. We're a long way from a perfect society, where race, colour and creed should be irrelevant in one's opinion of another but we have come on immensely over the last thirty years in terms of attitude and tolerance. Unfortunately, there will always be people who are stupid, there will always be moronic wnkers and I'm afraid they will always come in all colours. Extremely good post, Although I don't see race and creed as being irrelevant at all, I don't want to be part of a coffee-coloured world of similar thinking automatons, I want to live in a world were different races and cultures thrive and enrich the world we live in. My Rocksteady band... [Link] [Link] IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!
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Petealiator

1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 5.53pm

Quote Cucking Funt at 28 Nov 2002 5:38pm

To distill it still further, what about calling someone a scouse, brummie, geordie or whatever kind of t***? Or the pejorative 'pikey'?

Extremely good post, Although I don't see race and creed as being irrelevant at all, I don't want to be part of a coffee-coloured world of similar thinking automatons, I want to live in a world were different races and cultures thrive and enrich the world we live in.

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

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Petealiator 1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 5.59pm
Quote scout at 28 Nov 2002 5:47pm Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 5:07pm Quote scout for example, an idiot wanted to shout abuse at Roy Keane, they would call him an 'Irish **'; whereas the same idiot would automatically refer to Ince by his skin colour, not the fact that he was English. That's how I define the difference between racial abuse and hatred, anyway. Well he'd look pretty silly as an Englishman shouting out 'You, you... English Ct!' If the target was Viera, I bet you a pound to a penny he'd shout 'You French C**t!' Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 5:16pm) Thanks Pete. That's assuming I was referring to an English idiot. You were scout me ole mucker, you were talking about Paul Ince, who's English, and an idiot. Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 6:01pm) My Rocksteady band... [Link] [Link] IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!
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Petealiator

1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 5.59pm

Quote scout at 28 Nov 2002 5:47pm

Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 5:07pm

Well he'd look pretty silly as an Englishman shouting out 'You, you... English C**t!'
If the target was Viera, I bet you a pound to a penny he'd shout 'You French C**t!'

Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 5:16pm)

Thanks Pete. That's assuming I was referring to an English idiot.

You were scout me ole mucker, you were talking about Paul Ince, who's English, and an idiot.

Edited by Petealiator (28 Nov 2002 6:01pm)

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

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scout East Dorset 28 Nov 02 6.16pm
Pete, if you read my post again, I was referring to the idiot throwing the abuse, not Ince.
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scout

East Dorset 28 Nov 02 6.16pm

Pete, if you read my post again, I was referring to the idiot throwing the abuse, not Ince.

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Petealiator 1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 6.34pm
Quote scout at 28 Nov 2002 6:16pm Pete, if you read my post again, I was referring to the idiot throwing the abuse, not Ince. Yeah I know Scout, I was jesting. I get your point though, I did initially jump to the wrong conclusion. My Rocksteady band... [Link] [Link] IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!
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Petealiator

1066 Country! 28 Nov 02 6.34pm

Quote scout at 28 Nov 2002 6:16pm

Pete, if you read my post again, I was referring to the idiot throwing the abuse, not Ince.

Yeah I know Scout, I was jesting. I get your point though, I did initially jump to the wrong conclusion.

My Rocksteady band...
[Link]
[Link]
IT'S NOT SKA, IT'S ROCKSTEADY!

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Meerkat 2 1957 28 Nov 02 6.35pm
Quote Cucking Funt at 28 Nov 2002 5:38pm We're a long way from a perfect society, where race, colour and creed should be irrelevant in one's opinion of another but we have come on immensely over the last thirty years in terms of attitude and tolerance. The 'perfect society' will never ever happen, it's not in our nature as a species to all get along. By 'attitude and tolerance having come on immensely' I assume you are referring to the fact that due to political correctness being thrust upon us by the media over the last 30 years those opinions aren't voiced publicly any more. I don't believe that peoples attitudes have changed at all since the 70s, it's been suppressed but it's still there and currently growing due to the immigration system.
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Meerkat 2

1957 28 Nov 02 6.35pm

Quote Cucking Funt at 28 Nov 2002 5:38pm

The 'perfect society' will never ever happen, it's not in our nature as a species to all get along.

By 'attitude and tolerance having come on immensely' I assume you are referring to the fact that due to political correctness being thrust upon us by the media over the last 30 years those opinions aren't voiced publicly any more. I don't believe that peoples attitudes have changed at all since the 70s, it's been suppressed but it's still there and currently growing due to the immigration system.

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scout East Dorset 28 Nov 02 6.43pm
Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 6:34pm Quote scout at 28 Nov 2002 6:16pm Pete, if you read my post again, I was referring to the idiot throwing the abuse, not Ince. Yeah I know Scout, I was jesting. I get your point though, I did initially jump to the wrong conclusion. Tut!
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scout

East Dorset 28 Nov 02 6.43pm

Quote Petealiator at 28 Nov 2002 6:34pm

Quote scout at 28 Nov 2002 6:16pm

Pete, if you read my post again, I was referring to the idiot throwing the abuse, not Ince.

Yeah I know Scout, I was jesting. I get your point though, I did initially jump to the wrong conclusion.

Tut!

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Crazy_Eagle South London 28 Nov 02 7.01pm
end of the day, i i called you an f***ing stupid aussie, that would be racist. if not it would still be offending to another so that is just as bad. R.I.P. DJ Hardline CPFC2010
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Crazy_Eagle

South London 28 Nov 02 7.01pm

end of the day, i i called you an f***ing stupid aussie, that would be racist. if not it would still be offending to another so that is just as bad.

R.I.P. DJ Hardline

CPFC2010

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Hazzacpfc London 28 Nov 02 9.28pm
Mostly very good points here. The main thing that sticks in my mind is that if someone abused a white player it would be about his country, or if he's English it would be "you northern/southern/etc", yet if someone shouted abuse at a black player it would be about his colour. That's more ignorant than anything. I've never shouted at a black player and said "you black this or you black that", but I did call Mr Diving Roberts a Welsh twt a few times, which is just as bad. I also have a dislike for the French and the Germans, on the grounds that they're all arrogant asholes; which isn't true. It's just the vast majority . Does that make me a racist? It all depends on your point of view. The term racism at the moment covers everything from frothing at the mouth insanity, to HMHS's little old lady, to friendly football banter (or unfriendly in the case of Roberts). The situation is just ridiculous.
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Hazzacpfc

London 28 Nov 02 9.28pm

Mostly very good points here.

The main thing that sticks in my mind is that if someone abused a white player it would be about his country, or if he's English it would be "you northern/southern/etc", yet if someone shouted abuse at a black player it would be about his colour. That's more ignorant than anything.

I've never shouted at a black player and said "you black this or you black that", but I did call Mr Diving Roberts a Welsh tw*t a few times, which is just as bad.

I also have a dislike for the French and the Germans, on the grounds that they're all arrogant a*sholes; which isn't true. It's just the vast majority . Does that make me a racist? It all depends on your point of view.

The term racism at the moment covers everything from frothing at the mouth insanity, to HMHS's little old lady, to friendly football banter (or unfriendly in the case of Roberts). The situation is just ridiculous.

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