Isle of Man TT - A Deadly Fascination. - Crystal Palace FC Supporters' Website

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Isle of Man TT - A Deadly Fascination.

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Palace Old Geezer Midhurst 12 Jun 22 8.50am
Originally posted by YT You use words like "sickening", "tragic"(ally), "horrific", "unfortunate" etc, yet in your opening post you are all nostalgic about the demise of traditional racing, with the TT being the last of the line. I am a very keen follower of motor sport YT, have been since the 60s. Loved watching the cars at Crystal Palace and went to my first Grand Prix at Silverstone in 1963. I think the first motor racing event I saw was at Goodwood and I shall be there again in September for the Revival where I can watch cars from the period race again. Racing car design in the 50s and 60s saw the development of some beautiful machinery, but when you see them up close you get to realise the sheer guts it took to race them on circuits with none of the safety features we see at tracks today. I have always admired the technology, design and development of all forms of racing machines, not to mention the skill and bravery of the drivers. Accidents will always happen, and when a driver is seriously injured or killed doing something they enjoy it is certainly sickening to see and tragic for those around him. I think I would still use the word 'tragic' to describe an accident that does serious damage to a 60 year old Maserati worth millions of pounds, even if the driver is unharmed. No-one goes to watch motor racing in the hope of seeing a driver maimed or killed, it is the thrill of watching the demonstration of man and machinery competing at speed. Pete53 described this more succinctly than me, but events like the TT will always have an attraction. The purpose of my original post was to ask the question 'for how much longer will it be allowed to continue?' in today's over protective society. As a final point in a post much longer than I originally intended, remember the huge, collective sigh of relief when Romain Grosjean scrambled clear from his fireball crash a couple of years ago. It was horrific to watch. On YouTube if you haven't seen it. Dad and I watched games standing on the muddy slope of the Holmesdale Road end. He cheered and I rattled.
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Palace Old Geezer

Midhurst 12 Jun 22 8.50am

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Originally posted by YT

You use words like "sickening", "tragic"(ally), "horrific", "unfortunate" etc, yet in your opening post you are all nostalgic about the demise of traditional racing, with the TT being the last of the line.

I am a very keen follower of motor sport YT, have been since the 60s. Loved watching the cars at Crystal Palace and went to my first Grand Prix at Silverstone in 1963. I think the first motor racing event I saw was at Goodwood and I shall be there again in September for the Revival where I can watch cars from the period race again.

Racing car design in the 50s and 60s saw the development of some beautiful machinery, but when you see them up close you get to realise the sheer guts it took to race them on circuits with none of the safety features we see at tracks today.

I have always admired the technology, design and development of all forms of racing machines, not to mention the skill and bravery of the drivers. Accidents will always happen, and when a driver is seriously injured or killed doing something they enjoy it is certainly sickening to see and tragic for those around him. I think I would still use the word 'tragic' to describe an accident that does serious damage to a 60 year old Maserati worth millions of pounds, even if the driver is unharmed.

No-one goes to watch motor racing in the hope of seeing a driver maimed or killed, it is the thrill of watching the demonstration of man and machinery competing at speed.

Pete53 described this more succinctly than me, but events like the TT will always have an attraction. The purpose of my original post was to ask the question 'for how much longer will it be allowed to continue?' in today's over protective society.

As a final point in a post much longer than I originally intended, remember the huge, collective sigh of relief when Romain Grosjean scrambled clear from his fireball crash a couple of years ago. It was horrific to watch. On YouTube if you haven't seen it.

Dad and I watched games standing on the muddy slope of the Holmesdale Road end. He cheered and I rattled.

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Rudi Hedman Caterham 12 Jun 22 12.27pm
Originally posted by YT Good point. I just wonder where it used to (or still does in the case of the TT) cross the line into enjoying the carnage. Let's face it; "racing cars drive peacefully around a circuit with no problems" ain't going to sell any newspapers or draw any internet hits, but "driver and spectators killed in spectacular horror crash" certainly will. The very nature of motorcycle racing means it’s far more dangerous than car racing. The injuries at the TT aren’t really the attraction, but the challenge of the danger certainly is. A very important difference. It’s the speeds they’re doing through public roads and all kinds of corners and gradients that’s the attraction. Plus everyone gets to congregate and get drunk for a week with people and fanatics in their own tribe. The whole island is taken over but it’s well behaved everywhere. I know you’re talking about the press. It’s important to note that a Daily Mail reader is going to differ compared to a MCN Motorcycle News reader. That video shouldn’t be there. Simple as that. But MSM are right scum so I’m not surprised. COYP
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Rudi Hedman

Caterham 12 Jun 22 12.27pm

Originally posted by YT

Good point. I just wonder where it used to (or still does in the case of the TT) cross the line into enjoying the carnage. Let's face it; "racing cars drive peacefully around a circuit with no problems" ain't going to sell any newspapers or draw any internet hits, but "driver and spectators killed in spectacular horror crash" certainly will.

The very nature of motorcycle racing means it’s far more dangerous than car racing. The injuries at the TT aren’t really the attraction, but the challenge of the danger certainly is. A very important difference. It’s the speeds they’re doing through public roads and all kinds of corners and gradients that’s the attraction. Plus everyone gets to congregate and get drunk for a week with people and fanatics in their own tribe. The whole island is taken over but it’s well behaved everywhere.

I know you’re talking about the press. It’s important to note that a Daily Mail reader is going to differ compared to a MCN Motorcycle News reader. That video shouldn’t be there. Simple as that. But MSM are right scum so I’m not surprised.

COYP

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Pete53 Hassocks 12 Jun 22 1.07pm
Originally posted by YT Good point. I just wonder where it used to (or still does in the case of the TT) cross the line into enjoying the carnage. Let's face it; "racing cars drive peacefully around a circuit with no problems" ain't going to sell any newspapers or draw any internet hits, but "driver and spectators killed in spectacular horror crash" certainly will. I don't think true fans ever enjoyed the carnage. There may have been the casual watcher who attended in the hope of seeing a pile-up but I'm not sure even they wanted to see anyone badly hurt. However, there is a morbid fascination amongst some who will be drawn to unpleasant scenes and accidents.
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Pete53

Hassocks 12 Jun 22 1.07pm

Originally posted by YT

I don't think true fans ever enjoyed the carnage. There may have been the casual watcher who attended in the hope of seeing a pile-up but I'm not sure even they wanted to see anyone badly hurt.

However, there is a morbid fascination amongst some who will be drawn to unpleasant scenes and accidents.

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Elpis In a pub 12 Jun 22 8.10pm
Originally posted by Rudi Hedman There may come a time when you have to pay for hospital treatment for injuries from dangerous pursuits. Anyone that ends up in A&E has to some degree been involved in a dangerous pursuit . What your saying will result in ALL emergency treatment coming with your card getting swiped while your laying on the trolly
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Elpis

In a pub 12 Jun 22 8.10pm

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

There may come a time when you have to pay for hospital treatment for injuries from dangerous pursuits.

Anyone that ends up in A&E has to some degree been involved in a dangerous pursuit .
What your saying will result in ALL emergency treatment coming with your card getting swiped while your laying on the trolly

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Rudi Hedman Caterham 12 Jun 22 11.17pm
Originally posted by Elpis Anyone that ends up in A&E has to some degree been involved in a dangerous pursuit . What your saying will result in ALL emergency treatment coming with your card getting swiped while your laying on the trolly Not true at all. You can inure yourself going about daily tasks. The country’s hospitals aren’t full of people taking part in dangerous sports. As as an aside, too many use A&E instead of the local GP. This can be the fault of the patient or the GP/state of the system and overcrowding in areas like Purleynistan south of Croydon: COYP
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Rudi Hedman

Caterham 12 Jun 22 11.17pm

Originally posted by Elpis

Not true at all. You can inure yourself going about daily tasks. The country’s hospitals aren’t full of people taking part in dangerous sports. As as an aside, too many use A&E instead of the local GP. This can be the fault of the patient or the GP/state of the system and overcrowding in areas like Purleynistan south of Croydon:

COYP

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BlueJay UK 12 Jun 22 11.26pm
It sounds like the speed has just shot up over the decades, so it's bound at add additional elements of danger. I have to admit being shocked at the number of deaths, but if you banned every sport or event where deaths had taken place there wouldn't be a lot going on. Perhaps some changes can be made to increase safety, but making sure people know about the dangers of what they're getting into should be the main push. That way, if people opt in it's a risk they are willing to take.
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BlueJay

UK 12 Jun 22 11.26pm

It sounds like the speed has just shot up over the decades, so it's bound at add additional elements of danger. I have to admit being shocked at the number of deaths, but if you banned every sport or event where deaths had taken place there wouldn't be a lot going on. Perhaps some changes can be made to increase safety, but making sure people know about the dangers of what they're getting into should be the main push. That way, if people opt in it's a risk they are willing to take.

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Rudi Hedman Caterham 12 Jun 22 11.57pm
Originally posted by BlueJay It sounds like the speed has just shot up over the decades, so it's bound at add additional elements of danger. I have to admit being shocked at the number of deaths, but if you banned every sport or event where deaths had taken place there wouldn't be a lot going on. Perhaps some changes can be made to increase safety, but making sure people know about the dangers of what they're getting into should be the main push. That way, if people opt in it's a risk they are willing to take. It’s not exactly hidden that you can die riding in the TT. You’re passing walls a few feet away and going round corners on the mountain section well over 100 mph. To make it safer, all they can do is wind back horsepower to several or many years ago and never allow the bikes to go quicker or lap times to be broken. That will partly and slowly devalue the event. I’m afraid motorcycle racing is high risk. Everyone knows it taking part, watching it and riding a sports motorbike. Anyway, it’s a brilliant week away. Mental stuff happens at night and there’s no trouble. COYP
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Rudi Hedman

Caterham 12 Jun 22 11.57pm

Originally posted by BlueJay

It’s not exactly hidden that you can die riding in the TT. You’re passing walls a few feet away and going round corners on the mountain section well over 100 mph. To make it safer, all they can do is wind back horsepower to several or many years ago and never allow the bikes to go quicker or lap times to be broken. That will partly and slowly devalue the event. I’m afraid motorcycle racing is high risk. Everyone knows it taking part, watching it and riding a sports motorbike.

Anyway, it’s a brilliant week away. Mental stuff happens at night and there’s no trouble.

COYP

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Badger11 Beckenham 13 Jun 22 6.43am
A neighbour who mainly lives in the IOM told me the locals don't seem bothered about the accidents it's more the media and activists. I doubt it will change anytime soon. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 13 Jun 22 6.43am

A neighbour who mainly lives in the IOM told me the locals don't seem bothered about the accidents it's more the media and activists. I doubt it will change anytime soon.

One more point

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YT Oxford 13 Jun 22 11.43am
Thanks Palace Old Geezer, Pete53 and Rudi for taking the time to reply with your very interesting and insightful posts. Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)
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Oxford 13 Jun 22 11.43am

Thanks Palace Old Geezer, Pete53 and Rudi for taking the time to reply with your very interesting and insightful posts.

Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

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Pete53 Hassocks 13 Jun 22 1.22pm
Originally posted by Rudi Hedman It’s not exactly hidden that you can die riding in the TT. You’re passing walls a few feet away and going round corners on the mountain section well over 100 mph. To make it safer, all they can do is wind back horsepower to several or many years ago and never allow the bikes to go quicker or lap times to be broken. That will partly and slowly devalue the event. I’m afraid motorcycle racing is high risk. Everyone knows it taking part, watching it and riding a sports motorbike. Anyway, it’s a brilliant week away. Mental stuff happens at night and there’s no trouble. I think another danger factor for newcomers to the IoM course is its length - over 37 miles. Permanent race circuits are rarely much over 3 miles , and many under that distance. Consequently, a rider can, in a fairly short space of time, get to learn the circuit and what the limits are on the various bends or corners. This is not the case with the IoM and errors of judgement are much more likely to happen. Edited by Pete53 (13 Jun 2022 1.33pm)
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Pete53

Hassocks 13 Jun 22 1.22pm

Originally posted by Rudi Hedman

Anyway, it’s a brilliant week away. Mental stuff happens at night and there’s no trouble.

I think another danger factor for newcomers to the IoM course is its length - over 37 miles. Permanent race circuits are rarely much over 3 miles , and many under that distance. Consequently, a rider can, in a fairly short space of time, get to learn the circuit and what the limits are on the various bends or corners. This is not the case with the IoM and errors of judgement are much more likely to happen.

Edited by Pete53 (13 Jun 2022 1.33pm)

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Palace Old Geezer Midhurst 13 Jun 22 2.02pm
Originally posted by YT Thanks Palace Old Geezer, Pete53 and Rudi for taking the time to reply with your very interesting and insightful posts. You're very welcome YT Dad and I watched games standing on the muddy slope of the Holmesdale Road end. He cheered and I rattled.
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Palace Old Geezer

Midhurst 13 Jun 22 2.02pm

Originally posted by YT

Thanks Palace Old Geezer, Pete53 and Rudi for taking the time to reply with your very interesting and insightful posts.

You're very welcome YT

Dad and I watched games standing on the muddy slope of the Holmesdale Road end. He cheered and I rattled.

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Forest Hillbilly in a hidey-hole 13 Jun 22 8.05pm
As an ex-biker, the adrenaline surge from going fast is an absolutely massive hit. It is addictive. Got many points on my licence, and a few stints in hospital too. I'm in my 50's now and haven't ridden a bike for over 20years. I would love to ride the Isle of Man before it's too late. I mean to ride the circuit on a road bike, in normal traffic, perhaps just occasionally going a tad over the speed limit. Magic,...wouldn't it ? I'm not the only oldy biker to feel that way. IF I was younger on some of the bikes I used to own, I'd be a much bigger risk on the IoM. 0 to 60mph in 3 seconds. top speed around 170mph. I hear the IoM current lap times are a tad over 120mph (average speed). That would scare the cr@p out of me. I disengage, I turn the page.
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Forest Hillbilly

in a hidey-hole 13 Jun 22 8.05pm

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As an ex-biker, the adrenaline surge from going fast is an absolutely massive hit. It is addictive. Got many points on my licence, and a few stints in hospital too.
I'm in my 50's now and haven't ridden a bike for over 20years. I would love to ride the Isle of Man before it's too late. I mean to ride the circuit on a road bike, in normal traffic, perhaps just occasionally going a tad over the speed limit.
Magic,...wouldn't it ?

I'm not the only oldy biker to feel that way. IF I was younger on some of the bikes I used to own, I'd be a much bigger risk on the IoM. 0 to 60mph in 3 seconds. top speed around 170mph.

I hear the IoM current lap times are a tad over 120mph (average speed). That would scare the cr@p out of me.

I disengage, I turn the page.

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