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Pele - Most overrated footballer in history

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Casual Orpington 17 Nov 20 6.01pm
Originally posted by kingdowieonthewall change the record casual.. I could actually make a record about it
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Casual

Orpington 17 Nov 20 6.01pm

Originally posted by kingdowieonthewall

change the record casual..

I could actually make a record about it

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Lanzo-Ad Lanzarote 17 Nov 20 8.51pm
for my money ronaldo and maradona easily the best two players for me, closely followed by Vince Hilaire. “That’s a joke son, I say, that’s a joke.” “Nice boy, but he’s sharp as a throw pillow.” “He’s so dumb he thinks a Mexican border pays rent” “ “Son… I say, son, some people are so narrow minded they can look through a keyhole with both eyes.”__ Forhorn Leghorn
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Lanzo-Ad

Lanzarote 17 Nov 20 8.51pm

for my money ronaldo and maradona easily the best two players for me, closely followed by Vince Hilaire.

“That’s a joke son, I say, that’s a joke.” “Nice boy, but he’s sharp as a throw pillow.” “He’s so dumb he thinks a Mexican border pays rent” “ “Son… I say, son, some people are so narrow minded they can look through a keyhole with both eyes.”__ Forhorn Leghorn

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dreamwaverider London 18 Nov 20 1.48am
The one thing all these top players of the game have is supreme balance. When you watch them they glide everywhere. Add to that incredible ball control, vision, two footed and heading and that is what puts them in the top top place. Pele might not be the greatest but he was right up there. The guy was super special. On his day a joy to watch. Just like the others.
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dreamwaverider

London 18 Nov 20 1.48am

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The one thing all these top players of the game have is supreme balance. When you watch them they glide everywhere. Add to that incredible ball control, vision, two footed and heading and that is what puts them in the top top place. Pele might not be the greatest but he was right up there. The guy was super special. On his day a joy to watch. Just like the others.

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norwayeagle Trondheim 18 Nov 20 3.00am
Originally posted by Robert Heenan I don't know what folks think or rather...what they've been indoctrinated to believe by the media and the likes of Bob Charlton and co that Pele is the best footballer ever in the history of the game. There certainly has been this myth thats been created surrounding Pele - that he is the greatest ever footballer and that he is this wonderful beacon of humanity. The media lavish him like he's some sort of king and queen..bowing to him and bestowing as well as lapping him up all sorts of gratitude and praise. I remember growing up in the late 1970's and in the 1980's and the brainwashing us kids were installed into us regarding this Pele being the king of football. Funny thing is Pele actually really believes that he is the king of football I remember the 1987 the English football league vs rest of the world game which was live from wembley and the way the ITV presenter and studio were fawning over Pele...looking back at it was truly revolting Even today..every month or so there's some silly article in the Guardian lavishing praise on Pele. What really got me scrutinising Pele and his football career as well as other stuff during his Cosmos days and subsequent career as Blatters lapdog puppet poodle ambassador was when i was back at home in Cheshire at christmas of 1989 and i think it was Eurosport or Screensport..Pele was presenting this series of programmes on the "beautiful game" from a sunny Maracana pitch. I think most the programme was about Pele showing off and about his own grand importance in the game...The more i've scrutinised and looked into Pele's career..the more ive come to realise that he is the master of self-publicity and an ego maniac and that there is this whole mythical factory been built up around this so called footballing saint 😂😂😂😂
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norwayeagle

Trondheim 18 Nov 20 3.00am

Originally posted by Robert Heenan

I don't know what folks think or rather...what they've been indoctrinated to believe by the media and the likes of Bob Charlton and co that Pele is the best footballer ever in the history of the game.

There certainly has been this myth thats been created surrounding Pele - that he is the greatest ever footballer and that he is this wonderful beacon of humanity. The media lavish him like he's some sort of king and queen..bowing to him and bestowing as well as lapping him up all sorts of gratitude and praise.

I remember growing up in the late 1970's and in the 1980's and the brainwashing us kids were installed into us regarding this Pele being the king of football. Funny thing is Pele actually really believes that he is the king of football

I remember the 1987 the English football league vs rest of the world game which was live from wembley and the way the ITV presenter and studio were fawning over Pele...looking back at it was truly revolting

Even today..every month or so there's some silly article in the Guardian lavishing praise on Pele.

What really got me scrutinising Pele and his football career as well as other stuff during his Cosmos days and subsequent career as Blatters lapdog puppet poodle ambassador was when i was back at home in Cheshire at christmas of 1989 and i think it was Eurosport or Screensport..Pele was presenting this series of programmes on the "beautiful game" from a sunny Maracana pitch. I think most the programme was about Pele showing off and about his own grand importance in the game...The more i've scrutinised and looked into Pele's career..the more ive come to realise that he is the master of self-publicity and an ego maniac and that there is this whole mythical factory been built up around this so called footballing saint

😂😂😂😂

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Robert Heenan East Cheshire 18 Nov 20 12.36pm
Originally posted by mezzer Could not agree more with you Robert. Thanks for starting this thread. For years mine has been a lone voice in the wilderness on this. Pele is THE most overrated sportsman ever. Take his supposed 1,000 goals. Nonsense. If I counted all the goals I'd scored as a kid playing three and in I'd be nudging that sort of total, but I wouldn't claim it as fact. If you think about it, to have scored 1,000 professional goals as he claims then he'd have had to score over 60 goals a season every season for 17 years. He didn't. When I ask people who wax lyrical about the bloke what their three most memorable moments are from his career, they usually come up with the same ones. The Gordon Banks save. Yep, he missed. The shot from his own half against Czechoslavakia. Yep. he missed. Oh, and that dummy he sold the keeper where he let the ball go one side of him and he went the other to be left in front of an open goal. Genius. And what happened? He missed. But it didn't end there during his career. They gave him the chequered flag to wave at the Brazilian Grand Prix. And what happened there? He missed the end because he was talking to someone. At least he eventually was recognised commercially for all his failures to score. He was last seen advertising a potion for erectile disfunction. And the only thing that appears to have come close to the number of "actual" signed "worn by Pele" shirts auctioned for charity are the "actual" splinters from the Cross squirreled away in Catholic churches across the globe. Thank you for your reply. I don't think your voice is the lone voice in the wilderness as you put it. More and more people see Pele as a fraudulent overhyped ego maniac publicity machine. The thing about Pele's career goals was that many of these goals were against farmers, carpenters and factory workers on their shift breaks. Also included in his career goals are friendly matches and for all i know they could be goals scored on copacabana beach As for him winning three world cups...lets be honest here...it's like Frank LeBoeuf and Stephane Guivarch winning the world cup or Djimi Traore winning the Champions league against Maldini...doesn't mean anything Pele did well in 1958 world cup...similar to Norman Whiteside when he had just turned 17 and destroying Arsenal in the FA Cup semi-finals and twisting Alan Hansen inside out and scoring spectacular goal in a cup final at Wembley...but whereas Whiteside did it at 17 against O'Leary, Hansen and other star defenders....Pele scored against dreadful appalling opposition.think Accrington STanley defenders would have done far better than the cumbersome lumberjack Swedish defenders..even in that 1958 tournament...the standout players were Didi, Vava and Garrincha but because Pele was the youngest..he got all the media attention, adoration and love.... In 1962 World Cup...I think Pele only played in the group stages. In 1966 world cup..pele was appalling and found out. In 1970...now thats the biggest myth....Pele played with far better players...players that were so humble and respectful. It's like Andy Cole playing with Keane, Beckham, Giggs, Scholes, Cantona during the 1990's or Heskey playing in that trble winning Liverpool team of 2001. Even then Pele missed absolute sitters in that tournament. Now after his playing career ended for Brazil and his time at Cosmos and the things he has indulged in especially as Blatter/FIFA's lapdog puppet poodle ambassador as well as his arrogance....he definately is not holier than thou...he's not a nice person..definately not the goody two shoes the media would have you believe
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Robert Heenan

East Cheshire 18 Nov 20 12.36pm

Originally posted by mezzer

Could not agree more with you Robert. Thanks for starting this thread. For years mine has been a lone voice in the wilderness on this. Pele is THE most overrated sportsman ever.

Take his supposed 1,000 goals. Nonsense. If I counted all the goals I'd scored as a kid playing three and in I'd be nudging that sort of total, but I wouldn't claim it as fact. If you think about it, to have scored 1,000 professional goals as he claims then he'd have had to score over 60 goals a season every season for 17 years. He didn't.

When I ask people who wax lyrical about the bloke what their three most memorable moments are from his career, they usually come up with the same ones. The Gordon Banks save. Yep, he missed. The shot from his own half against Czechoslavakia. Yep. he missed. Oh, and that dummy he sold the keeper where he let the ball go one side of him and he went the other to be left in front of an open goal. Genius. And what happened? He missed.

But it didn't end there during his career. They gave him the chequered flag to wave at the Brazilian Grand Prix. And what happened there? He missed the end because he was talking to someone.

At least he eventually was recognised commercially for all his failures to score. He was last seen advertising a potion for erectile disfunction.

And the only thing that appears to have come close to the number of "actual" signed "worn by Pele" shirts auctioned for charity are the "actual" splinters from the Cross squirreled away in Catholic churches across the globe.

Thank you for your reply. I don't think your voice is the lone voice in the wilderness as you put it. More and more people see Pele as a fraudulent overhyped ego maniac publicity machine.

The thing about Pele's career goals was that many of these goals were against farmers, carpenters and factory workers on their shift breaks. Also included in his career goals are friendly matches and for all i know they could be goals scored on copacabana beach

As for him winning three world cups...lets be honest here...it's like Frank LeBoeuf and Stephane Guivarch winning the world cup or Djimi Traore winning the Champions league against Maldini...doesn't mean anything

Pele did well in 1958 world cup...similar to Norman Whiteside when he had just turned 17 and destroying Arsenal in the FA Cup semi-finals and twisting Alan Hansen inside out and scoring spectacular goal in a cup final at Wembley...but whereas Whiteside did it at 17 against O'Leary, Hansen and other star defenders....Pele scored against dreadful appalling opposition.think Accrington STanley defenders would have done far better than the cumbersome lumberjack Swedish defenders..even in that 1958 tournament...the standout players were Didi, Vava and Garrincha but because Pele was the youngest..he got all the media attention, adoration and love.... In 1962 World Cup...I think Pele only played in the group stages. In 1966 world cup..pele was appalling and found out. In 1970...now thats the biggest myth....Pele played with far better players...players that were so humble and respectful. It's like Andy Cole playing with Keane, Beckham, Giggs, Scholes, Cantona during the 1990's or Heskey playing in that trble winning Liverpool team of 2001. Even then Pele missed absolute sitters in that tournament.

Now after his playing career ended for Brazil and his time at Cosmos and the things he has indulged in especially as Blatter/FIFA's lapdog puppet poodle ambassador as well as his arrogance....he definately is not holier than thou...he's not a nice person..definately not the goody two shoes the media would have you believe

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mezzer Main Stand, Block F, Row 20 seat 1... 18 Nov 20 2.37pm
Originally posted by Robert Heenan Thank you for your reply. I don't think your voice is the lone voice in the wilderness as you put it. More and more people see Pele as a fraudulent overhyped ego maniac publicity machine. The thing about Pele's career goals was that many of these goals were against farmers, carpenters and factory workers on their shift breaks. Also included in his career goals are friendly matches and for all i know they could be goals scored on copacabana beach As for him winning three world cups...lets be honest here...it's like Frank LeBoeuf and Stephane Guivarch winning the world cup or Djimi Traore winning the Champions league against Maldini...doesn't mean anything Pele did well in 1958 world cup...similar to Norman Whiteside when he had just turned 17 and destroying Arsenal in the FA Cup semi-finals and twisting Alan Hansen inside out and scoring spectacular goal in a cup final at Wembley...but whereas Whiteside did it at 17 against O'Leary, Hansen and other star defenders....Pele scored against dreadful appalling opposition.think Accrington STanley defenders would have done far better than the cumbersome lumberjack Swedish defenders..even in that 1958 tournament...the standout players were Didi, Vava and Garrincha but because Pele was the youngest..he got all the media attention, adoration and love.... In 1962 World Cup...I think Pele only played in the group stages. In 1966 world cup..pele was appalling and found out. In 1970...now thats the biggest myth....Pele played with far better players...players that were so humble and respectful. It's like Andy Cole playing with Keane, Beckham, Giggs, Scholes, Cantona during the 1990's or Heskey playing in that trble winning Liverpool team of 2001. Even then Pele missed absolute sitters in that tournament. Now after his playing career ended for Brazil and his time at Cosmos and the things he has indulged in especially as Blatter/FIFA's lapdog puppet poodle ambassador as well as his arrogance....he definately is not holier than thou...he's not a nice person..definately not the goody two shoes the media would have you believe No doubt Pele will claim Hector's House was his idea based on those three as well. Living down here does have some advantages. At least you can see them cry.
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mezzer

Main Stand, Block F, Row 20 seat 1... 18 Nov 20 2.37pm

Originally posted by Robert Heenan

Thank you for your reply. I don't think your voice is the lone voice in the wilderness as you put it. More and more people see Pele as a fraudulent overhyped ego maniac publicity machine.

No doubt Pele will claim Hector's House was his idea based on those three as well.

Living down here does have some advantages. At least you can see them cry.

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Pete53 Hassocks 18 Nov 20 4.57pm
How many people making these comments about Pele being overrated have actually seen him play that much? Most of our sightings of him are from the World Cup. He was 17 year old winner in 1958 scoring 6 goals, but missed a large chunk of the 1962 Chile tournament through injury. In 1966 contrary to one posters assertion that he "was found out", he was actually pretty well kicked out of the tournament. In the first match against Bulgaria he was cynically fouled and kicked by the Bulgarians. He missed the 2nd game due to injuries suffered in the first game, but returned for the final group game against Portugal, but was clearly not fit. So he was not "found out". Then in Mexico 1970 he was a major part of the winning team scoring 4 goals in a team where 7 different players scored. Apart from World Cups I don't think any of us have seen enough of Pele to discredit him. He played most of his career playing in Brazil for Santos.He scored 504 goals in 496 appearances. Now I don't know what the standard of the Brazilian league was in the 50s/60s but back then most Brazilian players, including the stars, would have played in their domestic league, so I would guess it was pretty competitive. He also scored 72 goals for Brazil in 92 appearances. I wouldn't claim that Pele is the greatest footballer ever, but I'd be reluctant to give that accolade to any player as I don't think you can make fair comparisons across the decades, but he was very very good and one of the best of his era and doesn't deserve to have his reputation as a player trashed by the ill-informed. Edited by Pete53 (18 Nov 2020 4.58pm)
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Pete53

Hassocks 18 Nov 20 4.57pm

How many people making these comments about Pele being overrated have actually seen him play that much?

Most of our sightings of him are from the World Cup. He was 17 year old winner in 1958 scoring 6 goals, but missed a large chunk of the 1962 Chile tournament through injury.

In 1966 contrary to one posters assertion that he "was found out", he was actually pretty well kicked out of the tournament. In the first match against Bulgaria he was cynically fouled and kicked by the Bulgarians. He missed the 2nd game due to injuries suffered in the first game, but returned for the final group game against Portugal, but was clearly not fit. So he was not "found out".

Then in Mexico 1970 he was a major part of the winning team scoring 4 goals in a team where 7 different players scored.

Apart from World Cups I don't think any of us have seen enough of Pele to discredit him. He played most of his career playing in Brazil for Santos.He scored 504 goals in 496 appearances. Now I don't know what the standard of the Brazilian league was in the 50s/60s but back then most Brazilian players, including the stars, would have played in their domestic league, so I would guess it was pretty competitive. He also scored 72 goals for Brazil in 92 appearances.

I wouldn't claim that Pele is the greatest footballer ever, but I'd be reluctant to give that accolade to any player as I don't think you can make fair comparisons across the decades, but he was very very good and one of the best of his era and doesn't deserve to have his reputation as a player trashed by the ill-informed.

Edited by Pete53 (18 Nov 2020 4.58pm)

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Eaglecoops CR3 19 Nov 20 11.43am
I thought Pele was superb however this thread got me thinking about the best home nations player of all time. These are my selections: England- Gascoigne, highly debatable I know but the most talented I’ve ever seen in an England shirt. Wales- tough one this, toss up between Rush, Bale and Giggs Scotland- Dalglish Ireland- toss up between Liam Brady and Pat Jennings N. Ireland- Best I suppose you then think were any as good as Pele, and you probably have to say George Best.
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Eaglecoops

CR3 19 Nov 20 11.43am

I thought Pele was superb however this thread got me thinking about the best home nations player of all time. These are my selections:

England- Gascoigne, highly debatable I know but the most talented I’ve ever seen in an England shirt.
Wales- tough one this, toss up between Rush, Bale and Giggs
Scotland- Dalglish
Ireland- toss up between Liam Brady and Pat Jennings
N. Ireland- Best

I suppose you then think were any as good as Pele, and you probably have to say George Best.

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Joe Bloggs Nr Norwich 19 Nov 20 1.07pm
Originally posted by Pete53 How many people making these comments about Pele being overrated have actually seen him play that much? Most of our sightings of him are from the World Cup. He was 17 year old winner in 1958 scoring 6 goals, but missed a large chunk of the 1962 Chile tournament through injury. In 1966 contrary to one posters assertion that he "was found out", he was actually pretty well kicked out of the tournament. In the first match against Bulgaria he was cynically fouled and kicked by the Bulgarians. He missed the 2nd game due to injuries suffered in the first game, but returned for the final group game against Portugal, but was clearly not fit. So he was not "found out". Then in Mexico 1970 he was a major part of the winning team scoring 4 goals in a team where 7 different players scored. Apart from World Cups I don't think any of us have seen enough of Pele to discredit him. He played most of his career playing in Brazil for Santos.He scored 504 goals in 496 appearances. Now I don't know what the standard of the Brazilian league was in the 50s/60s but back then most Brazilian players, including the stars, would have played in their domestic league, so I would guess it was pretty competitive. He also scored 72 goals for Brazil in 92 appearances. I wouldn't claim that Pele is the greatest footballer ever, but I'd be reluctant to give that accolade to any player as I don't think you can make fair comparisons across the decades, but he was very very good and one of the best of his era and doesn't deserve to have his reputation as a player trashed by the ill-informed. Edited by Pete53 (18 Nov 2020 4.58pm) Sensible and correct, totally agree with your view. Pele came along at a time when so many people thought the English game was "tops", The Hungarians showed us a different game with Ferenc Puskas and changed the opinions of many followers. Pele was fantastic and was treated as an icon Football never stands still and I suspect in one hundred years time Pele, Stefano Cruyff, Maradona, Best etc will hardly rate a mention. Pele was not over rated he was just of his time. Bing Crosby was considered the best until Sinatra came along!
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Joe Bloggs

Nr Norwich 19 Nov 20 1.07pm

Originally posted by Pete53

How many people making these comments about Pele being overrated have actually seen him play that much?

Most of our sightings of him are from the World Cup. He was 17 year old winner in 1958 scoring 6 goals, but missed a large chunk of the 1962 Chile tournament through injury.

Then in Mexico 1970 he was a major part of the winning team scoring 4 goals in a team where 7 different players scored.

Edited by Pete53 (18 Nov 2020 4.58pm)

Sensible and correct, totally agree with your view.

Pele came along at a time when so many people thought the English game was "tops", The Hungarians showed us a different game with Ferenc Puskas and changed the opinions of many followers. Pele was fantastic and was treated as an icon

Football never stands still and I suspect in one hundred years time Pele, Stefano Cruyff, Maradona, Best etc will hardly rate a mention.

Pele was not over rated he was just of his time.

Bing Crosby was considered the best until Sinatra came along!

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ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 20 Nov 20 8.23pm
Why does everyone forget Alan Lee? Red and Blue Army!
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ASCPFC

Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 20 Nov 20 8.23pm

Why does everyone forget Alan Lee?

Red and Blue Army!

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Teddy Eagle 20 Nov 20 8.34pm
Originally posted by Eaglecoops I thought Pele was superb however this thread got me thinking about the best home nations player of all time. These are my selections: England- Gascoigne, highly debatable I know but the most talented I’ve ever seen in an England shirt. Wales- tough one this, toss up between Rush, Bale and Giggs Scotland- Dalglish Ireland- toss up between Liam Brady and Pat Jennings N. Ireland- Best I suppose you then think were any as good as Pele, and you probably have to say George Best. For Wales I’d nominate John Charles.
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Teddy Eagle

20 Nov 20 8.34pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

I thought Pele was superb however this thread got me thinking about the best home nations player of all time. These are my selections:

I suppose you then think were any as good as Pele, and you probably have to say George Best.

For Wales I’d nominate John Charles.

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Tom-the-eagle Croydon 20 Nov 20 9.27pm
Originally posted by Eaglecoops I thought Pele was superb however this thread got me thinking about the best home nations player of all time. These are my selections: England- Gascoigne, highly debatable I know but the most talented I’ve ever seen in an England shirt. Wales- tough one this, toss up between Rush, Bale and Giggs Scotland- Dalglish Ireland- toss up between Liam Brady and Pat Jennings N. Ireland- Best I suppose you then think were any as good as Pele, and you probably have to say George Best. Agree with all however Jennings was NI "It feels much better than it ever did, much more sensitive." John Wayne Bobbit
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Tom-the-eagle

Croydon 20 Nov 20 9.27pm

Originally posted by Eaglecoops

I thought Pele was superb however this thread got me thinking about the best home nations player of all time. These are my selections:

I suppose you then think were any as good as Pele, and you probably have to say George Best.

Agree with all however Jennings was NI

"It feels much better than it ever did, much more sensitive." John Wayne Bobbit

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