You very unskillfully avoided all my questions.

Anyway let me generally summarize this thread.

The lefties believe this is because of austerity and/or police cuts rather than because of people deciding it's OK to stick knives into each other or throw acid at each other (which wasn't even a "thing" until recently). This is despite the evidence that public spending is more than ever as so is the national debt. I would concede here that police numbers have fallen significantly and this is not helping but then again there is the fact that people going into the police these days have generally not even been in a pub fight and have their hands tied by political correctness, limits on stop and search and senior officers more focused on their own careers and our old friend "diversity".

The sane majority believe that may well be related to a net £250,000 coming into the country per year (the number of people now leaving the country may also be a clue) and a complete lack of personal responsibility in many "communities" plus any form of shared identify or social contract. It's not just their fault by the way (though it largely is). Our society has allowed and encouraged this. People like you.

And the answer to knife crime is to spend more of other peoples money?

Whilst not exclusively, these are in general problems created by the black community. This is not racist opinion. Its fact which stats back up.

You don't get these problems on the streets of East Grinstead, Guildford or Horsham.

You don't find large numbers of Indians, Jews, Irish or Poles stabbing each other.Just the black community.

You can blame the Tories or anyone else you like however its not them taking 3 inches of steel and shoving it in someones neck.

I'd argue it's perhaps more a class/poverty issue rather than simply all to do with race. I'm not saying culture doesn't play a role but even that of itself is born from poverty to some extent – 'imported culture' from Jamaica etc. – yes, from very poor areas. Jamaica is not exactly a symbol of wealth.

An interesting question is – 'How many murders in Glasgow were related to the Black community?'

I hadn't really thought about this until challenging my own preconceptions on this issue yesterday.

'A bad year in Glasgow, 2005, saw 40 murders’ with a population of 600,000, ‘making a Glaswegian in that year twice as likely to be killed as a black Londoner’.

Now I'm not saying that this is all right and every other point of view put forward on this thread is wrong, but I am saying that it's not as simple as it's all because of this'. Excuse the pun, but it's not as simple as 'black and white'. That much is clear.

I'd argue it's perhaps more a class/poverty issue rather than simply all to do with race. I'm not saying culture doesn't play a role but even that of itself is born from poverty to some extent – 'imported culture' from Jamaica etc. – yes, from very poor areas. Jamaica is not exactly a symbol of wealth.

An interesting question is – 'How many murders in Glasgow were related to the Black community?'

I hadn't really thought about this until challenging my own preconceptions on this issue yesterday.

'A bad year in Glasgow, 2005, saw 40 murders’ with a population of 600,000, ‘making a Glaswegian in that year twice as likely to be killed as a black Londoner’.

Now I'm not saying that this is all right and every other point of view put forward on this thread is wrong, but I am saying that it's not as simple as it's all because of this'. Excuse the pun, but it's not as simple as 'black and white'. That much is clear.

So why, back in 50's, when poverty was so much worse and class divide so much more prevalent were there far fewer stabbings amongst young people? (OK, you had the organised gangs who fought each other, but they were relatively contained). The answer, in my opinion, lies in discipline - sitting a 3 year old on the naughty step is fine, but using that and reasoning for a 15 year old, testosterone fueled youth, who knows that any redress will be little more than a slap on the wrist and a police 'warning' is no deterrent. Even 'life' often means back on the streets in 4 years.