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cryrst The garden of England 14 Oct 18 5.22pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 We should all do what we can as responsible people, it is our health and our planet. You don't have to give up meat just cut down. But looking at the 5 options there, eating less meat was not the big deal for those interviewed, but keeping warm definitely was. Extra jumpers etc. no thanks we want the heating on. There you go Eat meat and we can wear their skin to keep warm Happy days
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cryrst

The garden of England 14 Oct 18 5.22pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

We should all do what we can as responsible people, it is our health and our planet.

You don't have to give up meat just cut down.

But looking at the 5 options there, eating less meat was not the big deal for those interviewed, but keeping warm definitely was.

Extra jumpers etc. no thanks we want the heating on.

There you go
Eat meat and we can wear their skin to keep warm
Happy days

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 14 Oct 18 5.26pm
Originally posted by steeleye20 We should all do what we can as responsible people, it is our health and our planet. You don't have to give up meat just cut down. But looking at the 5 options there, eating less meat was not the big deal for those interviewed, but keeping warm definitely was. Extra jumpers etc. no thanks we want the heating on. But should the government tell you do do so? Or punish you if you don't?
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 14 Oct 18 5.26pm

Originally posted by steeleye20

We should all do what we can as responsible people, it is our health and our planet.

You don't have to give up meat just cut down.

But looking at the 5 options there, eating less meat was not the big deal for those interviewed, but keeping warm definitely was.

Extra jumpers etc. no thanks we want the heating on.

But should the government tell you do do so? Or punish you if you don't?

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Deleted11 15 Oct 18 11.37am
Originally posted by Penge Eagle But should the government tell you do do so? Or punish you if you don't? TBF, the gvnt already punishes you for carrying/supplying drugs of different categories as well as the obvious crimes of murder, stealing, etc. I look at the meat issue like the car issue. If you can have an electric car that does what a diesel car or petrol car does, then we move on. I do see the issue where we don't really have a decent enough alternative to meat at this moment in time though.
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Deleted11 15 Oct 18 11.37am

Originally posted by Penge Eagle

But should the government tell you do do so? Or punish you if you don't?

TBF, the gvnt already punishes you for carrying/supplying drugs of different categories as well as the obvious crimes of murder, stealing, etc. I look at the meat issue like the car issue. If you can have an electric car that does what a diesel car or petrol car does, then we move on. I do see the issue where we don't really have a decent enough alternative to meat at this moment in time though.

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 15 Oct 18 3.30pm
The market will always find a better solution to environment issues than political interference. Sainsbury's served veggie versions of burgers and hot dogs served outside the ground against Wolves last week and apparently nobody knew the difference... [Link]
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 15 Oct 18 3.30pm

The market will always find a better solution to environment issues than political interference. Sainsbury's served veggie versions of burgers and hot dogs served outside the ground against Wolves last week and apparently nobody knew the difference... [Link]

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becky over the moon 15 Oct 18 6.47pm
Originally posted by Penge Eagle The market will always find a better solution to environment issues than political interference. Sainsbury's served veggie versions of burgers and hot dogs served outside the ground against Wolves last week and apparently nobody knew the difference... [Link] ..not on the day maybe, but I bet they discovered the benefit of 'plant based' product the morning after......... A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers
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becky

over the moon 15 Oct 18 6.47pm

Originally posted by Penge Eagle

..not on the day maybe, but I bet they discovered the benefit of 'plant based' product the morning after.........

A stairway to Heaven and a Highway to Hell give some indication of expected traffic numbers

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 15 Oct 18 11.15pm
Capitalism through the ingenuity of entrepreneurs will always be a better solution than government to protect the environment. For example, the USB drive has saved millions of trees. The socialist idea would be to tax paper to reduce or stop us from using it! Edited by Penge Eagle (15 Oct 2018 11.17pm)
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 15 Oct 18 11.15pm

Capitalism through the ingenuity of entrepreneurs will always be a better solution than government to protect the environment. For example, the USB drive has saved millions of trees.

The socialist idea would be to tax paper to reduce or stop us from using it!

Edited by Penge Eagle (15 Oct 2018 11.17pm)

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BarEagle Monmouth 16 Oct 18 8.52am
Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger It is a bit difficult to take becoming 'green' seriously when you know that China and India will be excreting plastic,greenhouse gasses and whatnot by the kiloton for years to come. Any action that happens has to be global or it ain't worth spit. The only real way to approach this situation is to reduce demand, and the only way to do that is to reduce humans. This is probably your best ever post
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BarEagle

Monmouth 16 Oct 18 8.52am

Originally posted by Hrolf The Ganger

It is a bit difficult to take becoming 'green' seriously when you know that China and India will be excreting plastic,greenhouse gasses and whatnot by the kiloton for years to come. Any action that happens has to be global or it ain't worth spit.
The only real way to approach this situation is to reduce demand, and the only way to do that is to reduce humans.

This is probably your best ever post

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Deleted11 16 Oct 18 9.46am
Originally posted by Penge Eagle Capitalism through the ingenuity of entrepreneurs will always be a better solution than government to protect the environment. For example, the USB drive has saved millions of trees. The socialist idea would be to tax paper to reduce or stop us from using it! Edited by Penge Eagle (15 Oct 2018 11.17pm) I agree that entrepreneurship will be always beat anything politicians can do, but, the problem isn't capitalism or socialism, it's political will. Why can't you have a fairer society that is not so disproportionately divided in regards to wealth? You could argue that the entrepreneur takes the risk, which is true at the moment, but let's just say that the political will was there for a fairer way of doing business; Tax payer money has funded things like GPS as well as various features that are used in mobile phones. What if the gvnt have a patent on all potential uses of these things? The entrepreneur could talk to the gvnt about the potential use for some of these things and the gvnt could fund it and give the entrepreneur £1 for every 'phone' sold, or even go 50/50 in business with them. This could happen across the board and you could then lower the corp tax rate to 0 like that. That could also mean that the guy that found a use for all these things to make a cool phone could try and invent something else, rather than giving us an update every year which we don't need. So, I'm not saying we don't need entrepreneurs but we need a better way of dealing with all this than what we have, which is corrupted gvnts or authoritarian leaders, milking the system, i.e. Bush/Obama/Clinton/Blair/Cameron getting paid the best part of £500k to give talks to BANKS that were bailed out. Edited by Jway89 (16 Oct 2018 9.48am)
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Deleted11 16 Oct 18 9.46am

Originally posted by Penge Eagle

Capitalism through the ingenuity of entrepreneurs will always be a better solution than government to protect the environment. For example, the USB drive has saved millions of trees.

The socialist idea would be to tax paper to reduce or stop us from using it!

Edited by Penge Eagle (15 Oct 2018 11.17pm)

I agree that entrepreneurship will be always beat anything politicians can do, but, the problem isn't capitalism or socialism, it's political will. Why can't you have a fairer society that is not so disproportionately divided in regards to wealth? You could argue that the entrepreneur takes the risk, which is true at the moment, but let's just say that the political will was there for a fairer way of doing business;
Tax payer money has funded things like GPS as well as various features that are used in mobile phones. What if the gvnt have a patent on all potential uses of these things? The entrepreneur could talk to the gvnt about the potential use for some of these things and the gvnt could fund it and give the entrepreneur £1 for every 'phone' sold, or even go 50/50 in business with them.
This could happen across the board and you could then lower the corp tax rate to 0 like that. That could also mean that the guy that found a use for all these things to make a cool phone could try and invent something else, rather than giving us an update every year which we don't need.
So, I'm not saying we don't need entrepreneurs but we need a better way of dealing with all this than what we have, which is corrupted gvnts or authoritarian leaders, milking the system, i.e. Bush/Obama/Clinton/Blair/Cameron getting paid the best part of £500k to give talks to BANKS that were bailed out.

Edited by Jway89 (16 Oct 2018 9.48am)

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Badger11 Beckenham 16 Oct 18 11.20am
Originally posted by Penge Eagle Capitalism through the ingenuity of entrepreneurs will always be a better solution than government to protect the environment. For example, the USB drive has saved millions of trees. The socialist idea would be to tax paper to reduce or stop us from using it! Edited by Penge Eagle (15 Oct 2018 11.17pm) Capitalism needs a push from the politicians and public opinion. At the moment plastic is a hot button topic with the public and especially packaging in supermarkets. Up until now the shops and manufacturers have been stonewalling, watch over the next 5 years as they come up with ingenious ways to reduce it. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 16 Oct 18 11.20am

Originally posted by Penge Eagle

Capitalism through the ingenuity of entrepreneurs will always be a better solution than government to protect the environment. For example, the USB drive has saved millions of trees.

The socialist idea would be to tax paper to reduce or stop us from using it!

Edited by Penge Eagle (15 Oct 2018 11.17pm)

Capitalism needs a push from the politicians and public opinion. At the moment plastic is a hot button topic with the public and especially packaging in supermarkets. Up until now the shops and manufacturers have been stonewalling, watch over the next 5 years as they come up with ingenious ways to reduce it.

One more point

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Penge Eagle Beckenham 16 Oct 18 11.56am
Originally posted by Jway89 I agree that entrepreneurship will be always beat anything politicians can do, but, the problem isn't capitalism or socialism, it's political will. Why can't you have a fairer society that is not so disproportionately divided in regards to wealth? You could argue that the entrepreneur takes the risk, which is true at the moment, but let's just say that the political will was there for a fairer way of doing business; Tax payer money has funded things like GPS as well as various features that are used in mobile phones. What if the gvnt have a patent on all potential uses of these things? The entrepreneur could talk to the gvnt about the potential use for some of these things and the gvnt could fund it and give the entrepreneur £1 for every 'phone' sold, or even go 50/50 in business with them. This could happen across the board and you could then lower the corp tax rate to 0 like that. That could also mean that the guy that found a use for all these things to make a cool phone could try and invent something else, rather than giving us an update every year which we don't need. So, I'm not saying we don't need entrepreneurs but we need a better way of dealing with all this than what we have, which is corrupted gvnts or authoritarian leaders, milking the system, i.e. Bush/Obama/Clinton/Blair/Cameron getting paid the best part of £500k to give talks to BANKS that were bailed out. Edited by Jway89 (16 Oct 2018 9.48am) Agree that government needs to help the entrepreneurs by cutting regulation and offering tax breaks. James Dyson is one of Britain's finest engineers and produces excellent, energy-efficient goods. Among the best in the world. He has previously criticised the UK government for its lack of support for entrepreneurs and engineers. [Link] He's also had to fight the ridiculous bureaucracy of the EU too [Link] Big government is not the answer to our problems.
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Penge Eagle

Beckenham 16 Oct 18 11.56am

Originally posted by Jway89

Edited by Jway89 (16 Oct 2018 9.48am)

Agree that government needs to help the entrepreneurs by cutting regulation and offering tax breaks.

James Dyson is one of Britain's finest engineers and produces excellent, energy-efficient goods. Among the best in the world.

He has previously criticised the UK government for its lack of support for entrepreneurs and engineers. [Link]

He's also had to fight the ridiculous bureaucracy of the EU too [Link]

Big government is not the answer to our problems.

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steeleye20 Croydon 16 Oct 18 12.01pm
'the USB drive has saved millions of trees'. Really how..... Hardly a day goes by without some company going under as a result of data leakage theft malware security loss through usb devices. Apart from the security problems you can easily see, the firmware, the code that recognises them as usb, is re-programmable and can become a variety of other devices infected with malware. Hopefully you are ok buying a good brand with its own security but it is never a good idea to have any sensitive information on a usb stick. Music files, photos, provided the stick is scanned before use, I don't recall having any problems really except in identifying the stick as a usb device.
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steeleye20

Croydon 16 Oct 18 12.01pm

'the USB drive has saved millions of trees'.

Really how.....

Hardly a day goes by without some company going under as a result of data leakage theft malware security loss through usb devices.

Apart from the security problems you can easily see, the firmware, the code that recognises them as usb, is re-programmable and can become a variety of other devices infected with malware.

Hopefully you are ok buying a good brand with its own security but it is never a good idea to have any sensitive information on a usb stick.

Music files, photos, provided the stick is scanned before use, I don't recall having any problems really except in identifying the stick as a usb device.

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steeleye20 Croydon 16 Oct 18 12.45pm
Originally posted by Penge Eagle Agree that government needs to help the entrepreneurs by cutting regulation and offering tax breaks. James Dyson is one of Britain's finest engineers and produces excellent, energy-efficient goods. Among the best in the world. He has previously criticised the UK government for its lack of support for entrepreneurs and engineers. [Link] He's also had to fight the ridiculous bureaucracy of the EU too [Link] Big government is not the answer to our problems. 'James Dyson is one of Britain's finest engineers and produces excellent, energy-efficient goods. Among the best in the world.' Expensive inefficient products that are routinely replaced by even more expensive inefficient products. Try locating a Dyson that is 2 years old they usually die at the end of the guarantee period. 'Mutton dressed as lamb'. People who use vacuum cleaners heavily in hotels etc. you will never find a Dyson there. A water vole has more life expectation than his crumby tat.
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steeleye20

Croydon 16 Oct 18 12.45pm

Originally posted by Penge Eagle

Agree that government needs to help the entrepreneurs by cutting regulation and offering tax breaks.

James Dyson is one of Britain's finest engineers and produces excellent, energy-efficient goods. Among the best in the world.

He has previously criticised the UK government for its lack of support for entrepreneurs and engineers. [Link]

He's also had to fight the ridiculous bureaucracy of the EU too [Link]

Big government is not the answer to our problems.

'James Dyson is one of Britain's finest engineers and produces excellent, energy-efficient goods. Among the best in the world.'

Expensive inefficient products that are routinely replaced by even more expensive inefficient products.

Try locating a Dyson that is 2 years old they usually die at the end of the guarantee period.

'Mutton dressed as lamb'.

People who use vacuum cleaners heavily in hotels etc. you will never find a Dyson there.

A water vole has more life expectation than his crumby tat.

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