Calais migrant trouble

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Calais migrant trouble

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 29 Jul 15 9.44pm
Quote fed up eagle at 29 Jul 2015 9.40pm Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 9.30pm Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 9.23pm Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 9.10pm Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.54pm Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 8.44pm Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.24pm Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 7.39pm What is the Labour Party for and who do they represent? They are supposed to represent the Labour movement, or ordinary workers, and give them a voice in Parliament. Organised labour still represents well over 4 million workers in this country through unions, as well as hundreds of thousands more in cooperatives. Obviously Blair decided that the biggest democratic movement in the country wasn't his cup of tea, scrapped clause 4 and instead decided taking cash for people who wanted government contracts/plushy positions in the Lords, but then he was a demon child spawned to bring pain and misery to mankind, so we can overlook him. That Corbyn's drawn support from most of the major unions and is now bookie's favourite shows the importance of ordinary workers to the Labour party even after St Tony's best efforts. If that is the case, why do they advocate unlimited immigration that takes existing workers' jobs or lowers their wages and makes housing more difficult? That reminds me of an interesting thing I read the other day about UKIP and the SNP. Someone said they're appeal is that any problem you name, they can blame it on one thing. So the SNP can go to the doorstep and listen to any political grievance and blame Westminster, while UKIP can blame the EU and migration. In this case, connecting worker's conditions with migration is actually very tenuous. I could write a really long post on this but instead here's a link to a great piece of literature that came through my door during the election: [Link] Note the fact that between 2005-08 when migration was flowing higher than it is now, employment of existing British workers rose by over 100 000. It's a pretty damning counter to the whole 'comin ova e're, taking OUR jobs' stuff. I'm sure you could write a very long post telling us how wonderful mass immigration is for us all. As it is such an unmitigated blessing, presumably you think we should encourage even more of it to accrue even more benefit. Of course an increase in employment of 100,000 over three years must clearly be a direct result of mass immigration! Edited by leggedstruggle (29 Jul 2015 9.10pm) Your complete disregard for facts which directly contradict your point is wonderful The truth is Niall, whatever facts you throw towards some posters, they still come back with the hackneyed old cliches about the left. I'm beginning to wonder if it's worth bothering. In fairness the left use that same old hackneyed phrases in arguments against anyone on the right that they're arguing against and to hell with the facts. The left aren't holier than thou are they? Being a leftie you look at people on the right in a certain way, you need to remember the people on the right view you lefties in exactly the same way. I'm not arguing against people per se, I'm arguing about policies and events. I'd imagine that ad hominem and straw man posts come more from those on the right if one were to go back and check.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 29 Jul 15 9.44pm

Quote fed up eagle at 29 Jul 2015 9.40pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 9.30pm

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 9.23pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 9.10pm

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.54pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 8.44pm

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.24pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 7.39pm

What is the Labour Party for and who do they represent?

They are supposed to represent the Labour movement, or ordinary workers, and give them a voice in Parliament. Organised labour still represents well over 4 million workers in this country through unions, as well as hundreds of thousands more in cooperatives.

Obviously Blair decided that the biggest democratic movement in the country wasn't his cup of tea, scrapped clause 4 and instead decided taking cash for people who wanted government contracts/plushy positions in the Lords, but then he was a demon child spawned to bring pain and misery to mankind, so we can overlook him. That Corbyn's drawn support from most of the major unions and is now bookie's favourite shows the importance of ordinary workers to the Labour party even after St Tony's best efforts.

If that is the case, why do they advocate unlimited immigration that takes existing workers' jobs or lowers their wages and makes housing more difficult?

That reminds me of an interesting thing I read the other day about UKIP and the SNP. Someone said they're appeal is that any problem you name, they can blame it on one thing. So the SNP can go to the doorstep and listen to any political grievance and blame Westminster, while UKIP can blame the EU and migration.

In this case, connecting worker's conditions with migration is actually very tenuous. I could write a really long post on this but instead here's a link to a great piece of literature that came through my door during the election: [Link]

Note the fact that between 2005-08 when migration was flowing higher than it is now, employment of existing British workers rose by over 100 000. It's a pretty damning counter to the whole 'comin ova e're, taking OUR jobs' stuff.

I'm sure you could write a very long post telling us how wonderful mass immigration is for us all. As it is such an unmitigated blessing, presumably you think we should encourage even more of it to accrue even more benefit. Of course an increase in employment of 100,000 over three years must clearly be a direct result of mass immigration!

Edited by leggedstruggle (29 Jul 2015 9.10pm)

Your complete disregard for facts which directly contradict your point is wonderful

The truth is Niall, whatever facts you throw towards some posters, they still come back with the hackneyed old cliches about the left.
I'm beginning to wonder if it's worth bothering.

In fairness the left use that same old hackneyed phrases in arguments against anyone on the right that they're arguing against and to hell with the facts. The left aren't holier than thou are they? Being a leftie you look at people on the right in a certain way, you need to remember the people on the right view you lefties in exactly the same way.

I'm not arguing against people per se, I'm arguing about policies and events. I'd imagine that ad hominem and straw man posts come more from those on the right if one were to go back and check.

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Catfish Burgess Hill 29 Jul 15 10.01pm
Not sure that is true. Most arguments against conservative policies tend to end up with references to Nazis - very lazy. Someone coined name for it but my memory has turned to mush. Any reference to greater police powers is automatically labelled Orwellian. All these slogans and labels are very dull. Edited by Catfish (29 Jul 2015 10.04pm) Yes, I am an agent of Satan but my duties are largely ceremonial
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Catfish

Burgess Hill 29 Jul 15 10.01pm

Not sure that is true. Most arguments against conservative policies tend to end up with references to Nazis - very lazy. Someone coined name for it but my memory has turned to mush. Any reference to greater police powers is automatically labelled Orwellian. All these slogans and labels are very dull.

Edited by Catfish (29 Jul 2015 10.04pm)

Yes, I am an agent of Satan but my duties are largely ceremonial

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legaleagle 29 Jul 15 10.36pm
I accept that (generalising) at times critiques of "the right" can degenerate into simplistic analogies;few of us are immune from ever having done it. Equally, critiques of anyone expressing a "left of centre" view can degenerate into similar simplistic purported comparisons with say N Korea or the USSR... Both can fall into a trap of "the left" being a single entity for which anyone remotely of that ilk must answer for the sins of the far extreme,and the same applying to individuals of "the right". That's not to say such comparisions can never ever be valid,by definition. In terms of Owellian, there is genuinely often a legitimate (ie an opinion someone could reasonably hold even if you strongly disagree with it)take on things like police powers that concern potential erosion of the civil liberties of us all in a manner not unreasonable to describe as "Orwellian". Equally,someone with an opposing view might reasonably think security/policing trump this. But they can be two sides of a legitimate debate as opposed to,for example,equating Jeremy Corbyn to someone of Stalin's views or a UKIP supporter as automatically thus being a racist or closet Nazi.
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legaleagle

29 Jul 15 10.36pm

I accept that (generalising) at times critiques of "the right" can degenerate into simplistic analogies;few of us are immune from ever having done it.

Equally, critiques of anyone expressing a "left of centre" view can degenerate into similar simplistic purported comparisons with say N Korea or the USSR...

Both can fall into a trap of "the left" being a single entity for which anyone remotely of that ilk must answer for the sins of the far extreme,and the same applying to individuals of "the right".

That's not to say such comparisions can never ever be valid,by definition.

In terms of Owellian, there is genuinely often a legitimate (ie an opinion someone could reasonably hold even if you strongly disagree with it)take on things like police powers that concern potential erosion of the civil liberties of us all in a manner not unreasonable to describe as "Orwellian".

Equally,someone with an opposing view might reasonably think security/policing trump this.

But they can be two sides of a legitimate debate as opposed to,for example,equating Jeremy Corbyn to someone of Stalin's views or a UKIP supporter as automatically thus being a racist or closet Nazi.

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 29 Jul 15 10.38pm
The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 29 Jul 15 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

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Stirlingsays 29 Jul 15 10.42pm
Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais. Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that. Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

29 Jul 15 10.42pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that.

Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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fed up eagle Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 29 Jul 15 10.48pm
Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 9.44pm Quote fed up eagle at 29 Jul 2015 9.40pm Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 9.30pm Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 9.23pm Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 9.10pm Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.54pm Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 8.44pm Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.24pm Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 7.39pm What is the Labour Party for and who do they represent? They are supposed to represent the Labour movement, or ordinary workers, and give them a voice in Parliament. Organised labour still represents well over 4 million workers in this country through unions, as well as hundreds of thousands more in cooperatives. Obviously Blair decided that the biggest democratic movement in the country wasn't his cup of tea, scrapped clause 4 and instead decided taking cash for people who wanted government contracts/plushy positions in the Lords, but then he was a demon child spawned to bring pain and misery to mankind, so we can overlook him. That Corbyn's drawn support from most of the major unions and is now bookie's favourite shows the importance of ordinary workers to the Labour party even after St Tony's best efforts. If that is the case, why do they advocate unlimited immigration that takes existing workers' jobs or lowers their wages and makes housing more difficult? That reminds me of an interesting thing I read the other day about UKIP and the SNP. Someone said they're appeal is that any problem you name, they can blame it on one thing. So the SNP can go to the doorstep and listen to any political grievance and blame Westminster, while UKIP can blame the EU and migration. In this case, connecting worker's conditions with migration is actually very tenuous. I could write a really long post on this but instead here's a link to a great piece of literature that came through my door during the election: [Link] Note the fact that between 2005-08 when migration was flowing higher than it is now, employment of existing British workers rose by over 100 000. It's a pretty damning counter to the whole 'comin ova e're, taking OUR jobs' stuff. I'm sure you could write a very long post telling us how wonderful mass immigration is for us all. As it is such an unmitigated blessing, presumably you think we should encourage even more of it to accrue even more benefit. Of course an increase in employment of 100,000 over three years must clearly be a direct result of mass immigration! Edited by leggedstruggle (29 Jul 2015 9.10pm) Your complete disregard for facts which directly contradict your point is wonderful The truth is Niall, whatever facts you throw towards some posters, they still come back with the hackneyed old cliches about the left. I'm beginning to wonder if it's worth bothering. In fairness the left use that same old hackneyed phrases in arguments against anyone on the right that they're arguing against and to hell with the facts. The left aren't holier than thou are they? Being a leftie you look at people on the right in a certain way, you need to remember the people on the right view you lefties in exactly the same way. I'm not arguing against people per se, I'm arguing about policies and events. I'd imagine that ad hominem and straw man posts come more from those on the right if one were to go back and check. I do read your posts and in fairness to you you do make some good arguments and evidently you do do your research. I guess some people feel that because they have different political view points they need to get personal-I'm not including you in that by the way. I have my reasons for not agreeing with left wing policies, and I'm sure you have your reasons for not agreeing with right wing view points. I agree with you that structured argument is much better than name calling. Either way, there is one thing we do have in common, our love for Palace, which goes to show how sport can bring people together.
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fed up eagle

Between Horley, Surrey and Preston... 29 Jul 15 10.48pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 9.44pm

Quote fed up eagle at 29 Jul 2015 9.40pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 9.30pm

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 9.23pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 9.10pm

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.54pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 8.44pm

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.24pm

Quote leggedstruggle at 29 Jul 2015 7.39pm

What is the Labour Party for and who do they represent?

If that is the case, why do they advocate unlimited immigration that takes existing workers' jobs or lowers their wages and makes housing more difficult?

Edited by leggedstruggle (29 Jul 2015 9.10pm)

Your complete disregard for facts which directly contradict your point is wonderful

The truth is Niall, whatever facts you throw towards some posters, they still come back with the hackneyed old cliches about the left.
I'm beginning to wonder if it's worth bothering.

I'm not arguing against people per se, I'm arguing about policies and events. I'd imagine that ad hominem and straw man posts come more from those on the right if one were to go back and check.

I do read your posts and in fairness to you you do make some good arguments and evidently you do do your research. I guess some people feel that because they have different political view points they need to get personal-I'm not including you in that by the way. I have my reasons for not agreeing with left wing policies, and I'm sure you have your reasons for not agreeing with right wing view points. I agree with you that structured argument is much better than name calling. Either way, there is one thing we do have in common, our love for Palace, which goes to show how sport can bring people together.

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legaleagle 29 Jul 15 10.52pm
Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais. You make a fair point about the scandal of unoccupied homes. In 2014,it was estimated that there were 700,000 unoccupied homes in the UK but 2 million in France.In terms of the present situation in France, there are legitimate questions as to why the French government has seemingly been not unhappy to let large numbers live in squalor near Calais rather than taking steps to deal with aspects of that. It would seem many are "economic migrants" as opposed to asylum seekers".We have pretty strong immigration policies in place re anyone who is not an EU national (or closely related) seeking to enter and I would suggest pretty strong "border control" (not least because we are an island) compared to many EU countries. In relation to the humanitarian crisis arising from many travelling from outside the EU into the EU,I can see the force of the argument for humanitarian resettlement being evenly spread (according to population etc) around the EU,including the UK.It is difficult to suggest we are or are likely to be worse off than say Greece or Italy in terms of any present/up to now "burden". In terms of anyone wishing to seek asylum,I am a strong supporter of the UN convention regulating asylum and refugees and from my work (admittedly 30 years ago) advising asylum applicants precisely how so many are not economic migrants/after claiming benefits but people escaping hellish persecution/discrimination.But there would seem to be some logic to anyone claiming asylum needing to do first it either in the first "safe" place they reach after leaving where they live or (for example with Yugoslavs already abroad when the wars broke out there in the 1990's) the country someone is in when the situation arises at home making it inappropriate for them to have to return. Edited by legaleagle (29 Jul 2015 11.10pm)
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legaleagle

29 Jul 15 10.52pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

You make a fair point about the scandal of unoccupied homes.

In 2014,it was estimated that there were 700,000 unoccupied homes in the UK but 2 million in France.In terms of the present situation in France, there are legitimate questions as to why the French government has seemingly been not unhappy to let large numbers live in squalor near Calais rather than taking steps to deal with aspects of that.

It would seem many are "economic migrants" as opposed to asylum seekers".We have pretty strong immigration policies in place re anyone who is not an EU national (or closely related) seeking to enter and I would suggest pretty strong "border control" (not least because we are an island) compared to many EU countries.

In relation to the humanitarian crisis arising from many travelling from outside the EU into the EU,I can see the force of the argument for humanitarian resettlement being evenly spread (according to population etc) around the EU,including the UK.It is difficult to suggest we are or are likely to be worse off than say Greece or Italy in terms of any present/up to now "burden".

In terms of anyone wishing to seek asylum,I am a strong supporter of the UN convention regulating asylum and refugees and from my work (admittedly 30 years ago) advising asylum applicants precisely how so many are not economic migrants/after claiming benefits but people escaping hellish persecution/discrimination.But there would seem to be some logic to anyone claiming asylum needing to do first it either in the first "safe" place they reach after leaving where they live or (for example with Yugoslavs already abroad when the wars broke out there in the 1990's) the country someone is in when the situation arises at home making it inappropriate for them to have to return.

Edited by legaleagle (29 Jul 2015 11.10pm)

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 30 Jul 15 12.46am
Quote Stirlingsays at 29 Jul 2015 10.42pm Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais. Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that. Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg. Compulsory purchase them. Having empty houses and homeless people is a sad sad indictment of the times we live in. People harp on about a socialist utopia. We ain't living in a capitalist utopia are we!
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 30 Jul 15 12.46am

Quote Stirlingsays at 29 Jul 2015 10.42pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that.

Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg.

Compulsory purchase them. Having empty houses and homeless people is a sad sad indictment of the times we live in.

People harp on about a socialist utopia. We ain't living in a capitalist utopia are we!

Alert a moderator to this post

Stirlingsays 30 Jul 15 3.29am
Quote nickgusset at 30 Jul 2015 12.46am Quote Stirlingsays at 29 Jul 2015 10.42pm Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais. Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that. Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg. Compulsory purchase them. Having empty houses and homeless people is a sad sad indictment of the times we live in. People harp on about a socialist utopia. We ain't living in a capitalist utopia are we! Breaking legal contracts goes a long way to moving investment out of the country. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

30 Jul 15 3.29am

Quote nickgusset at 30 Jul 2015 12.46am

Quote Stirlingsays at 29 Jul 2015 10.42pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that.

Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg.

Compulsory purchase them. Having empty houses and homeless people is a sad sad indictment of the times we live in.

People harp on about a socialist utopia. We ain't living in a capitalist utopia are we!

Breaking legal contracts goes a long way to moving investment out of the country.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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leggedstruggle Croydon 30 Jul 15 7.40am
Quote nickgusset at 30 Jul 2015 12.46am Quote Stirlingsays at 29 Jul 2015 10.42pm Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais. Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that. Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg. Compulsory purchase them. Having empty houses and homeless people is a sad sad indictment of the times we live in. People harp on about a socialist utopia. We ain't living in a capitalist utopia are we! Is this your immigration policy? Take other peoples' property and give it to unlimited numbers of immigrants? mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler
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leggedstruggle

Croydon 30 Jul 15 7.40am

Quote nickgusset at 30 Jul 2015 12.46am

Quote Stirlingsays at 29 Jul 2015 10.42pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

Empty isn't the same as unowned though is it.....I don't think even Corbyn could do much about that.

Also.....Even that number Nick is the tip of the iceberg.

Compulsory purchase them. Having empty houses and homeless people is a sad sad indictment of the times we live in.

People harp on about a socialist utopia. We ain't living in a capitalist utopia are we!

Is this your immigration policy? Take other peoples' property and give it to unlimited numbers of immigrants?

mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler

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leggedstruggle Croydon 30 Jul 15 7.46am
Quote legaleagle at 29 Jul 2015 10.52pm Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months. This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais. You make a fair point about the scandal of unoccupied homes. In 2014,it was estimated that there were 700,000 unoccupied homes in the UK but 2 million in France.In terms of the present situation in France, there are legitimate questions as to why the French government has seemingly been not unhappy to let large numbers live in squalor near Calais rather than taking steps to deal with aspects of that. It would seem many are "economic migrants" as opposed to asylum seekers".We have pretty strong immigration policies in place re anyone who is not an EU national (or closely related) seeking to enter and I would suggest pretty strong "border control" (not least because we are an island) compared to many EU countries. In relation to the humanitarian crisis arising from many travelling from outside the EU into the EU,I can see the force of the argument for humanitarian resettlement being evenly spread (according to population etc) around the EU,including the UK.It is difficult to suggest we are or are likely to be worse off than say Greece or Italy in terms of any present/up to now "burden". In terms of anyone wishing to seek asylum,I am a strong supporter of the UN convention regulating asylum and refugees and from my work (admittedly 30 years ago) advising asylum applicants precisely how so many are not economic migrants/after claiming benefits but people escaping hellish persecution/discrimination.But there would seem to be some logic to anyone claiming asylum needing to do first it either in the first "safe" place they reach after leaving where they live or (for example with Yugoslavs already abroad when the wars broke out there in the 1990's) the country someone is in when the situation arises at home making it inappropriate for them to have to return. Edited by legaleagle (29 Jul 2015 11.10pm) LOL, you do make one laugh. Why don't these "people escaping hellish persecution/discrimination" flee to nearer countries, say Rumania, Bulgaria - do you think it just possible that the lure of housing, benefit handouts and the prospect of irresponsible fools like you supporting them might come into it? Edited by leggedstruggle (30 Jul 2015 7.46am) mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler
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leggedstruggle

Croydon 30 Jul 15 7.46am

Quote legaleagle at 29 Jul 2015 10.52pm

Quote nickgusset at 29 Jul 2015 10.38pm

The Institute for Policy Research says that there are 635,000 empty homes in England alone and of those, 216,000 homes (or just over one-third) have been unoccupied for longer than six months.

This would go some way to not only addressing the problem of homelessness and overcrowding in the UK but also alleviating the humanitarian crisis affecting the unfortunate people in Calais.

You make a fair point about the scandal of unoccupied homes.

It would seem many are "economic migrants" as opposed to asylum seekers".We have pretty strong immigration policies in place re anyone who is not an EU national (or closely related) seeking to enter and I would suggest pretty strong "border control" (not least because we are an island) compared to many EU countries.

Edited by legaleagle (29 Jul 2015 11.10pm)

LOL, you do make one laugh.

Why don't these "people escaping hellish persecution/discrimination" flee to nearer countries, say Rumania, Bulgaria - do you think it just possible that the lure of housing, benefit handouts and the prospect of irresponsible fools like you supporting them might come into it?

Edited by leggedstruggle (30 Jul 2015 7.46am)

mother-in-law is an anagram of woman hitler

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dannyh wherever I lay my hat....... 30 Jul 15 8.32am
Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.25pm Quote Tom-the-eagle at 29 Jul 2015 7.08pm Quote serial thriller at 26 Jul 2015 11.43am Quote Tom-the-eagle at 26 Jul 2015 10.21am Serial Thriller - so what are you suggesting is done then about the migrants in Calais then? House them and stop causing the international tensions which result in so many fleeing their country of origin. I have a question for those on the right who have no sympathy with these poor folk: how bad would things have to get in Britain for you to leave? Would you leave if war broke out? If bombings were frequent? Jeremy Corbyn became PM? Sorry - just had to bump this - still makes me laugh at how out of touch most of the lefties are on here.. Yeah, housing 4000 people is completely pie in the sky isn't it And what makes you think they deserve housing more so than the tens of thousands of homeless BRITISH people living on our streets ? As for Corbyn, I'd love him to be the next labour nail in the coffin....sorry I meant leader. He is nuttier than a squirrel sh1t and lives in some outdated socialist utopia where everyone reads animal farm on the workers transport tractor taking them to work at the cabbage farm every morning. Serial I know you can be a bit left of centre, but housing illegal immigrants........are you actually smoking crack ? Edited by dannyh (30 Jul 2015 8.34am) "It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"
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dannyh

wherever I lay my hat....... 30 Jul 15 8.32am

Quote serial thriller at 29 Jul 2015 8.25pm

Quote Tom-the-eagle at 29 Jul 2015 7.08pm

Quote serial thriller at 26 Jul 2015 11.43am

Quote Tom-the-eagle at 26 Jul 2015 10.21am

Serial Thriller - so what are you suggesting is done then about the migrants in Calais then?

House them and stop causing the international tensions which result in so many fleeing their country of origin.

I have a question for those on the right who have no sympathy with these poor folk: how bad would things have to get in Britain for you to leave? Would you leave if war broke out? If bombings were frequent? Jeremy Corbyn became PM?

Sorry - just had to bump this - still makes me laugh at how out of touch most of the lefties are on here..

Yeah, housing 4000 people is completely pie in the sky isn't it

And what makes you think they deserve housing more so than the tens of thousands of homeless BRITISH people living on our streets ?

As for Corbyn, I'd love him to be the next labour nail in the coffin....sorry I meant leader. He is nuttier than a squirrel sh1t and lives in some outdated socialist utopia where everyone reads animal farm on the workers transport tractor taking them to work at the cabbage farm every morning.

Serial I know you can be a bit left of centre, but housing illegal immigrants........are you actually smoking crack ?

Edited by dannyh (30 Jul 2015 8.34am)

"It's not the bullet that's got my name on it that concerns me; it's all them other ones flyin' around marked 'To Whom It May Concern.'"

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