As Harold Macmillan was alleged to have said, when commenting on the unpredictability of politics and what caused them "Events, dear boy, events".

That is more true now than maybe ever before. Whatever we decided in 2016 and why we did can all now be cast aside. The world has already changed and unless we recognise that and are prepared to adjust our thinking accordingly we will make things worse than they already are going to be.

This is not a time for principled stands. About freedoms or previous decisions. This is a time to stand together and do what is most sensible in the situation we now face and not the one we didn't like in 2016, or even late 2019.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

The U.S will out live the EU. I give the EU 10 more years at most. They've done f all to help Spain and Italy over there outbreak of covid... Germany did take a few token patients....

I've read a fair amount of pomposity in my time as a member of HOL, but this trumps the lot!

In any case, it wouldn't surprise me if the EU is "cast aside" in the not-too-distant future as nationalism becomes the fashion across mainland Europe.

Note: I didn't vote 'Leave'.

Palace since 19 August 1972. Palace 1 (Tony Taylor) Liverpool 1 (Emlyn Hughes)

I am very surprised that you think I am being pompous and suspect that can only be because you are misunderstanding what I said. Maybe I wasn't clear enough so let me try to explain. When I said we can "cast aside" what we decided in 2016 this was not intended as any kind of comment on the vote itself, It was merely a reflection of the new reality.

Whatever our personal views were during the past 3 years we have left the EU. It's no longer a debate. We are now into the negotiation of the future trading relationship phase. However, the C19 crisis impacts everyone and everything, ourselves and the EU included. It's a mega big event and it changes things.

I have no more idea than anyone else, the EU included, whether the EU will survive this crisis and if it does what sort of shape it will be in. I do though look at the path that the USA under Trump are taking and get concerned that this is not the right time to be getting closer to them. Of course others will disagree and we all could be wrong.

I just don't know what's going to be best for us. There seem too many uncertainties at present to reach any kind of informed decision. Hence my suggestion that we just pause things for a while so we can make decisions when things become clearer. Maybe in 9 months time we will be dealing with a new US administration who themselves will see things differently. Despite claims to the contrary a detailed trade agreement is really unlikely to be concluded before then.

I really wasn't being controversial. I was just trying to be practical.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

No it wouldn't be any different because no-one yet knows how things will be in a few months, let alone a few years. Best to hold the line and review when things are clearer.

That said I suspect under Obama the USA would be taking a different line to Trump. More cautious and more science led on the C19 crisis and less "enthusiastic" on a trade deal than Trump, who doesn't like the EU and sees us as an opportunity to sell things that they now supply.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

Care to show me where i have believed in conspiracy theories before? Didnt think so...I talk as though nothing has changed? Really? My business relies on people coming from the UK, thats all stopped, We have had NO INCOME for 3 months, so dont tell me I think nothing has changed, maybe Ill just return to UK and become another burden on the state....seems to work for plenty of others!
I dont believe in conspiracy at all, I just believe that the government and previous governments and all MPs have lied to us, and are still lieing over this virus (and many other things).
They lie every day....100000 tests a day? Didnt happen! Everything is a lie to cover up their inadequacies
You are a great advocate of the EU, what have they done for poorer countries in this testing time? Sweet FA thats what, they are going down, hopefully sooner rather than later...and before you start, I live in the EU and it will affect me and my family big time if it collapses which is looking increasingly likely!
In the mean time, you carry on living in your cossetted Truro bubble and looking down on everyone else!!

Edited by the silurian (07 May 2020 7.44am)