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Badger11 Beckenham 14 Jan 20 10.51am
Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31. I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this. Those who care can donate. [Link] One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 14 Jan 20 10.51am

Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31.

I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this.

Those who care can donate.

[Link]

One more point

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Midlands Eagle 14 Jan 20 11.05am
Originally posted by Badger11 Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31. I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this. Who wants to listen to Big Ben when there are much more important things happening at exactly the same time and date such as the closing of the transfer window
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Midlands Eagle

14 Jan 20 11.05am

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Originally posted by Badger11

Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31.

I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this.

Who wants to listen to Big Ben when there are much more important things happening at exactly the same time and date such as the closing of the transfer window

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 14 Jan 20 12.28pm
Originally posted by Badger11 Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31. I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this. Those who care can donate. [Link] Typical Daily Mail nonsense. Spending half a million on something which actually does nothing at all is about par for their course. Mark Francois for me is for the Tories what Dennis Skinner used to be for Labour. A very poor example of an MP. If any bells ring out at 11 pm on the 31st I will regard them as a funeral toll for the death of common sense in my country. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 14 Jan 20 12.28pm

Originally posted by Badger11

Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31.

I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this.

Those who care can donate.

[Link]

Typical Daily Mail nonsense.

Spending half a million on something which actually does nothing at all is about par for their course.

Mark Francois for me is for the Tories what Dennis Skinner used to be for Labour. A very poor example of an MP.

If any bells ring out at 11 pm on the 31st I will regard them as a funeral toll for the death of common sense in my country.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Matov 14 Jan 20 12.30pm
Closer we get to the 31st the more I doubt the wisdom of making too much of a big show of our leaving. Purely because I doubt my own motivations. I want to rub the faces of every Remoaner retard into the reality that they f*ed up big time but what does that actually gain? We won. They lost. Not only once but time and time again when it truly mattered. The Euro elections and now the General Election. They should be enough because no matter how much I loathe them, we need to live together still. There has to be a healing or at least a lessening of the animosity. And let us not forget that we will still be in a transition period. Still subject to their s*ty rules and regulations until at least the end of the year. Yes January 31st will be a monumentous date and the war effectively bought to an end but we could still lose the peace. Come 11pm on the 31st I might raise a mug of tea and enjoy a moment of satisfaction but also be aware that nothing will be the same again. My wife is an EU national. My kids enjoy dual UK/EU nationality. My stance has had hugely hypocritical notions at the heart of it, with the consequences of my actions impacting on others far more than it does on me. Need to be honest about that and acknowledge that reality. Perhaps this is self-regarding nonsense but I think that the UK outside of the EU needs to accept that it is our nearest neighbour and a huge trading partner. And through NATO we are still mutually dependent for our national defence. And that for ardent Leavers such as myself, and who does not regret a single thing about how I cast my vote, the onus is perhaps now on us to be the magnanimous ones, no matter how riled up we have been by all the insults and attempts to subvert what is still the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken. Celebrate yes but perhaps exercise a modicum of self-restraint. And don't trust Johnson. He truly is as odious and self-serving as his biggest critics state. "The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.
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Matov

14 Jan 20 12.30pm

Closer we get to the 31st the more I doubt the wisdom of making too much of a big show of our leaving. Purely because I doubt my own motivations. I want to rub the faces of every Remoaner retard into the reality that they f***ed up big time but what does that actually gain?

We won. They lost. Not only once but time and time again when it truly mattered. The Euro elections and now the General Election. They should be enough because no matter how much I loathe them, we need to live together still. There has to be a healing or at least a lessening of the animosity.

And let us not forget that we will still be in a transition period. Still subject to their s***ty rules and regulations until at least the end of the year. Yes January 31st will be a monumentous date and the war effectively bought to an end but we could still lose the peace.

Come 11pm on the 31st I might raise a mug of tea and enjoy a moment of satisfaction but also be aware that nothing will be the same again.

My wife is an EU national. My kids enjoy dual UK/EU nationality. My stance has had hugely hypocritical notions at the heart of it, with the consequences of my actions impacting on others far more than it does on me. Need to be honest about that and acknowledge that reality.

Perhaps this is self-regarding nonsense but I think that the UK outside of the EU needs to accept that it is our nearest neighbour and a huge trading partner. And through NATO we are still mutually dependent for our national defence.

And that for ardent Leavers such as myself, and who does not regret a single thing about how I cast my vote, the onus is perhaps now on us to be the magnanimous ones, no matter how riled up we have been by all the insults and attempts to subvert what is still the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken.

Celebrate yes but perhaps exercise a modicum of self-restraint. And don't trust Johnson. He truly is as odious and self-serving as his biggest critics state.

"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell.

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Stirlingsays 14 Jan 20 1.41pm
Originally posted by Matov Closer we get to the 31st the more I doubt the wisdom of making too much of a big show of our leaving. Purely because I doubt my own motivations. I want to rub the faces of every Remoaner retard into the reality that they f*ed up big time but what does that actually gain? We won. They lost. Not only once but time and time again when it truly mattered. The Euro elections and now the General Election. They should be enough because no matter how much I loathe them, we need to live together still. There has to be a healing or at least a lessening of the animosity. And let us not forget that we will still be in a transition period. Still subject to their s*ty rules and regulations until at least the end of the year. Yes January 31st will be a monumentous date and the war effectively bought to an end but we could still lose the peace. Come 11pm on the 31st I might raise a mug of tea and enjoy a moment of satisfaction but also be aware that nothing will be the same again. My wife is an EU national. My kids enjoy dual UK/EU nationality. My stance has had hugely hypocritical notions at the heart of it, with the consequences of my actions impacting on others far more than it does on me. Need to be honest about that and acknowledge that reality. Perhaps this is self-regarding nonsense but I think that the UK outside of the EU needs to accept that it is our nearest neighbour and a huge trading partner. And through NATO we are still mutually dependent for our national defence. And that for ardent Leavers such as myself, and who does not regret a single thing about how I cast my vote, the onus is perhaps now on us to be the magnanimous ones, no matter how riled up we have been by all the insults and attempts to subvert what is still the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken. Celebrate yes but perhaps exercise a modicum of self-restraint. And don't trust Johnson. He truly is as odious and self-serving as his biggest critics state. Blimey your testosterone levels are dropping quicker than a Kardashian can drop their knickers. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Jan 20 1.41pm

Originally posted by Matov

Come 11pm on the 31st I might raise a mug of tea and enjoy a moment of satisfaction but also be aware that nothing will be the same again.

Celebrate yes but perhaps exercise a modicum of self-restraint. And don't trust Johnson. He truly is as odious and self-serving as his biggest critics state.

Blimey your testosterone levels are dropping quicker than a Kardashian can drop their knickers.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Stirlingsays 14 Jan 20 1.42pm
Originally posted by Badger11 Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31. I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this. Those who care can donate. [Link] Half a million? That's a con. 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Jan 20 1.42pm

Originally posted by Badger11

Boris is suggesting we crowd fund the cost for ringing Big Ben on Jan 31.

I could point out that the government had no problem spending millions on telling us to vote remain but in the interest of harmony I will let that slide I don't have a problem with this.

Those who care can donate.

[Link]

Half a million? That's a con.

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 14 Jan 20 1.54pm
Originally posted by Matov Closer we get to the 31st the more I doubt the wisdom of making too much of a big show of our leaving. Purely because I doubt my own motivations. I want to rub the faces of every Remoaner retard into the reality that they f*ed up big time but what does that actually gain? We won. They lost. Not only once but time and time again when it truly mattered. The Euro elections and now the General Election. They should be enough because no matter how much I loathe them, we need to live together still. There has to be a healing or at least a lessening of the animosity. And let us not forget that we will still be in a transition period. Still subject to their s*ty rules and regulations until at least the end of the year. Yes January 31st will be a monumentous date and the war effectively bought to an end but we could still lose the peace. Come 11pm on the 31st I might raise a mug of tea and enjoy a moment of satisfaction but also be aware that nothing will be the same again. My wife is an EU national. My kids enjoy dual UK/EU nationality. My stance has had hugely hypocritical notions at the heart of it, with the consequences of my actions impacting on others far more than it does on me. Need to be honest about that and acknowledge that reality. Perhaps this is self-regarding nonsense but I think that the UK outside of the EU needs to accept that it is our nearest neighbour and a huge trading partner. And through NATO we are still mutually dependent for our national defence. And that for ardent Leavers such as myself, and who does not regret a single thing about how I cast my vote, the onus is perhaps now on us to be the magnanimous ones, no matter how riled up we have been by all the insults and attempts to subvert what is still the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken. Celebrate yes but perhaps exercise a modicum of self-restraint. And don't trust Johnson. He truly is as odious and self-serving as his biggest critics state. As someone who wanted us to remain, and argued that Parliament needed to take control after the flawed referendum failed to settle the argument, I don't have any desire to "rub the faces" of those who disagree with me in anything. I feel sad it is happening and sadder at the triumphalist mood among some of those who disagreed. Quite frankly I find that attitude, and language such as "Remoaner retard", rather juvenile. People disagreed. Get over it. It doesn't make them retards any more than it makes every leave voter stupid. There will be no more healing of the animosity until that kind of attitude disappears and everyone accepts that those who disagree with you do so for honourable reasons which won't change and which will continue to be campaigned for until we rejoin. As you identify some of the reasons for that yourself so you cannot really be surprised that, as you seem to acknowledge, that the "war" is far from over. The fundamental difference between us is this idea that the 2016 referendum was "the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken." I think that is just wrong. You already know why I believe that. No referendum constitutes any part of our democratic system. The 2016 event was a cynical attempt by the Tories to sideline Farage and UKIP and quell the Eurosceptics within their own party. It has NOTHING to do with our democracy. It was ALL to do with party politics. Until that is understood and accepted the arguments won't just be about rejoining. They will also be about the illegitimacy of the whole process. Edited by Wisbech Eagle (14 Jan 2020 1.56pm) For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 14 Jan 20 1.54pm

Originally posted by Matov

Come 11pm on the 31st I might raise a mug of tea and enjoy a moment of satisfaction but also be aware that nothing will be the same again.

Celebrate yes but perhaps exercise a modicum of self-restraint. And don't trust Johnson. He truly is as odious and self-serving as his biggest critics state.

As someone who wanted us to remain, and argued that Parliament needed to take control after the flawed referendum failed to settle the argument, I don't have any desire to "rub the faces" of those who disagree with me in anything. I feel sad it is happening and sadder at the triumphalist mood among some of those who disagreed. Quite frankly I find that attitude, and language such as "Remoaner retard", rather juvenile. People disagreed. Get over it. It doesn't make them retards any more than it makes every leave voter stupid. There will be no more healing of the animosity until that kind of attitude disappears and everyone accepts that those who disagree with you do so for honourable reasons which won't change and which will continue to be campaigned for until we rejoin.

As you identify some of the reasons for that yourself so you cannot really be surprised that, as you seem to acknowledge, that the "war" is far from over.

The fundamental difference between us is this idea that the 2016 referendum was "the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken." I think that is just wrong. You already know why I believe that. No referendum constitutes any part of our democratic system. The 2016 event was a cynical attempt by the Tories to sideline Farage and UKIP and quell the Eurosceptics within their own party. It has NOTHING to do with our democracy. It was ALL to do with party politics.

Until that is understood and accepted the arguments won't just be about rejoining. They will also be about the illegitimacy of the whole process.

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (14 Jan 2020 1.56pm)

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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Midlands Eagle 14 Jan 20 2.25pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle No referendum constitutes any part of our democratic system. The 2016 event was a cynical attempt by the Tories to sideline Farage and UKIP and quell the Eurosceptics within their own party. It has NOTHING to do with our democracy. It was ALL to do with party politics. It matters not the reasons why Cameron decided on a referendum as the fact that he did shows that it is a part of our democracy system
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Midlands Eagle

14 Jan 20 2.25pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

No referendum constitutes any part of our democratic system. The 2016 event was a cynical attempt by the Tories to sideline Farage and UKIP and quell the Eurosceptics within their own party. It has NOTHING to do with our democracy. It was ALL to do with party politics.

It matters not the reasons why Cameron decided on a referendum as the fact that he did shows that it is a part of our democracy system

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Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 14 Jan 20 2.40pm
Originally posted by Midlands Eagle It matters not the reasons why Cameron decided on a referendum as the fact that he did shows that it is a part of our democracy system It matters hugely. If any PM can subvert our democracy in this way then it's not working properly and something needs to be done about it. No individual ought to be able to use the national political system for their own, or their group's, benefit. Whether that is Cameron calling a referendum, or any PM deciding when it's best to call an election, is tantamount to corruption. We enacted the fixed term Parliaments Act as a recognition of this but now Johnson proposes to repeal it as spite for the Supreme Court defeat. It isn't good. For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.
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Wisbech Eagle

Truro Cornwall 14 Jan 20 2.40pm

Originally posted by Midlands Eagle

It matters not the reasons why Cameron decided on a referendum as the fact that he did shows that it is a part of our democracy system

It matters hugely. If any PM can subvert our democracy in this way then it's not working properly and something needs to be done about it.

No individual ought to be able to use the national political system for their own, or their group's, benefit. Whether that is Cameron calling a referendum, or any PM deciding when it's best to call an election, is tantamount to corruption.

We enacted the fixed term Parliaments Act as a recognition of this but now Johnson proposes to repeal it as spite for the Supreme Court defeat. It isn't good.

For the avoidance of doubt any comments in response to a previous post are directed to its ideas and not at any, or all, posters personally.

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the silurian The garden of England.(not really) 14 Jan 20 2.46pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle It matters hugely. If any PM can subvert our democracy in this way then it's not working properly and something needs to be done about it. No individual ought to be able to use the national political system for their own, or their group's, benefit. Whether that is Cameron calling a referendum, or any PM deciding when it's best to call an election, is tantamount to corruption. We enacted the fixed term Parliaments Act as a recognition of this but now Johnson proposes to repeal it as spite for the Supreme Court defeat. It isn't good. Ohh someones upset that they LOST!!
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the silurian

The garden of England.(not really) 14 Jan 20 2.46pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

It matters hugely. If any PM can subvert our democracy in this way then it's not working properly and something needs to be done about it.

We enacted the fixed term Parliaments Act as a recognition of this but now Johnson proposes to repeal it as spite for the Supreme Court defeat. It isn't good.

Ohh someones upset that they LOST!!

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Stirlingsays 14 Jan 20 2.59pm
Apparently you can say that there were leavers who were stupid and racist but if someone says, 'Remoaner retard'.....Woah, woah...'steady on there sailor'. It seems that this 'healing' thing only goes one way with some people. The 'healing' line of patter is a load of bollocks anyway. People will do whatever they want to do, same as it ever was. Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Jan 2020 3.03pm) 'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)
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Stirlingsays

14 Jan 20 2.59pm

Apparently you can say that there were leavers who were stupid and racist but if someone says, 'Remoaner retard'.....Woah, woah...'steady on there sailor'.

It seems that this 'healing' thing only goes one way with some people.

The 'healing' line of patter is a load of bollocks anyway. People will do whatever they want to do, same as it ever was.

Edited by Stirlingsays (14 Jan 2020 3.03pm)

'Who are you and how did you get in here? I'm a locksmith. And, I'm a locksmith.' (Leslie Nielsen)

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the silurian The garden of England.(not really) 14 Jan 20 3.18pm
Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle As someone who wanted us to remain, and argued that Parliament needed to take control after the flawed referendum failed to settle the argument, I don't have any desire to "rub the faces" of those who disagree with me in anything. I feel sad it is happening and sadder at the triumphalist mood among some of those who disagreed. Quite frankly I find that attitude, and language such as "Remoaner retard", rather juvenile. People disagreed. Get over it. It doesn't make them retards any more than it makes every leave voter stupid. There will be no more healing of the animosity until that kind of attitude disappears and everyone accepts that those who disagree with you do so for honourable reasons which won't change and which will continue to be campaigned for until we rejoin. As you identify some of the reasons for that yourself so you cannot really be surprised that, as you seem to acknowledge, that the "war" is far from over. The fundamental difference between us is this idea that the 2016 referendum was "the single biggest exercise in democracy this country has ever undertaken." I think that is just wrong. You already know why I believe that. No referendum constitutes any part of our democratic system. The 2016 event was a cynical attempt by the Tories to sideline Farage and UKIP and quell the Eurosceptics within their own party. It has NOTHING to do with our democracy. It was ALL to do with party politics. Until that is understood and accepted the arguments won't just be about rejoining. They will also be about the illegitimacy of the whole process. Edited by Wisbech Eagle (14 Jan 2020 1.56pm) are you suggesting that the remainers wouldnt have displayed the very same triumphalist mood, had they prevailed? Calling leavers racist and stupid is one of your strong points!! You seem to think that its just a matter of time til we rejoin? How would this happen? A referendum perhaps, or would our 'masters' just decide to take us back in?. Who knows, by that time there may not even be an EU to rejoin, maybe just maybe it will start to collapse....already there are too many 'takers' and not enough 'payers'....the Germans aint happy, the French aint happy, the Greeks never were happy......just allow yourself to believe that possibly Brexit will be a great success and then others will also want to leave...it may just happen, then I guess that you'll be back here claiming some sort of credit for it!!
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the silurian

The garden of England.(not really) 14 Jan 20 3.18pm

Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle

As someone who wanted us to remain, and argued that Parliament needed to take control after the flawed referendum failed to settle the argument, I don't have any desire to "rub the faces" of those who disagree with me in anything. I feel sad it is happening and sadder at the triumphalist mood among some of those who disagreed. Quite frankly I find that attitude, and language such as "Remoaner retard", rather juvenile. People disagreed. Get over it. It doesn't make them retards any more than it makes every leave voter stupid. There will be no more healing of the animosity until that kind of attitude disappears and everyone accepts that those who disagree with you do so for honourable reasons which won't change and which will continue to be campaigned for until we rejoin.

As you identify some of the reasons for that yourself so you cannot really be surprised that, as you seem to acknowledge, that the "war" is far from over.

Until that is understood and accepted the arguments won't just be about rejoining. They will also be about the illegitimacy of the whole process.

Edited by Wisbech Eagle (14 Jan 2020 1.56pm)

are you suggesting that the remainers wouldnt have displayed the very same triumphalist mood, had they prevailed?

Calling leavers racist and stupid is one of your strong points!!

You seem to think that its just a matter of time til we rejoin? How would this happen? A referendum perhaps, or would our 'masters' just decide to take us back in?. Who knows, by that time there may not even be an EU to rejoin, maybe just maybe it will start to collapse....already there are too many 'takers' and not enough 'payers'....the Germans aint happy, the French aint happy, the Greeks never were happy......just allow yourself to believe that possibly Brexit will be a great success and then others will also want to leave...it may just happen, then I guess that you'll be back here claiming some sort of credit for it!!

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