It’s not pointless at all. What people are charging Roy with is not integrating the academy. I’m merely pointing out that this is not based on facts. He bled 3 academy players in the Premier League in 4 years. Considering he took over a team rooted to the foot of the Premier League table, that is by all accounts.. well.. excellent. Dyche has given Premier League debuts to McNeil and Max Thompson during that time.

Belittling Roy’s achievements with the academy after what he’s done with Aaron Wan-Bissaka and Tyrick Mitchell is just vitriolic.

We're the Arthur over ere!

I do not Think anyone is belittling his acheivements, far from it, but you can only compare him to 4 other managers in the PL - all in different scenarios, with differing academies and differing priorities. There are another 15 clubs in the PL who cannot be judged based on academy players introduced 'during the same period Roy was manager', because there current managers haven't been.

What people see is opportunities for academy prospects to be given game time completely overlooked as RH put on the same old faces in games that really didn't have much riding on them.

In that respect, regardless of what has happened in the past and whether those he has bled have been successful or not, he seemingly could have done a lot more than he did.

"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"

This is an excellent post that pretty much sums up and complete my post.
I've read, also on replies to my post, the logic that if Favre is given the right players for his game, he will thrive.
Well, no surprise... it would be fun reading the same old nicknames saying that the new manager is better than the old one with a team of young and speedy talents at his disposal... shame the previous manager didn't have this luck...
The point eventually is, is this new manager, NOT given the players he needs, good enough as the previous one? And how would he play?

The best footie management game: [Link]

What caught my eye was this quote from the Inside Dortmund documentary:

"Everyone says mental strength is very important. But to have mental strength on the pitch, you need players who, before all else, are able to run.
"Because saying: 'He has a super mentality, but he can't run back and forth' - that's no use. And if you have a player on the team who does nothing defensively, you don't have a team."

So we might not be the oldest in the Prem if running is his thing.

As far as the Academy and Roy, my issue was he never gave players a taste or even last few minutes to learn the game (as MANY teams do). If we had any, Roy would just sit them on the bench.
He only made a change when pressed, AWB when Ward went down and Mitchell when PVA went down. Then realized, hey they can play better than the expensive starters.
There seemed to be no way for youngsters to play their way into the line up from training.

It seems like Dortmund have a fantastic scouting dept for young players, so maybe that helps any manager uncover gems. But I'd like to think they also are great at finding managers that play their counter attacking style, which also gives me hope.

That same quote struck me too. Another thing I saw said Favre went from a high pressing game to a quick counter attacking one in his time at dortmund - both need great mobility across the side.

I simply cannot see us becoming a more mobile side without major surgery. We know our defence is painfully slow due to age, and whilst the pundits talk of our pace on the break, that's just lazy journalism - Benteke has long lost any serious pace he might have once had, as I fear has Wilf, who will always check back and retain the ball when he has a chance to knock it past the defender and race him, so much so I wondered if he was carrying a hamstring injury for large parts of last season. Townsend has never been quick, and whilst Eze carries the ball beautifully I'm not sure he's much of a sprinter. As for getting that lot to press effectively from the front, well, let's just say Favre would have his work cut out.

Regarding the youngsters I can only repeat the point I and others have made for some time - the careers (including loan spells) of the players Roy didn't give game time to have hardly cast doubt on his decisions. We are all hoping that the u18s are a higher standard than the u23s (certainly the club seem to think they are, hence references to promoting youth being one of the new managers apparent priorities) but even if that happens we can only say Roy was wrong if Favre gets Premier league performances out of youth players that Roy ignored.

Edited by TheBigToePunt (24 Jun 2021 8.05pm)

Has he signed yet?

I had a chat with my friend Helmut from Dusseldorf this evening. He’s a massive Foals Fan and has nothing but praise for their old coach, Lucien Favre. LF was at Borussia MG for about four seasons; apparently he’s keen on bringing up youth from the academy but is also prepared to work individually with experienced players to improve specific skills and develop their game. I get the impression that his style is (or was) as a proper football coach rather than a media-savvy manager.

I think he’ll be good for us, but no plaudits to the despicable Roy Out brigade, you rotters.