Palace players for the Euros

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Palace players for the Euros

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dreamwaverider London 07 Jun 24 10.30am
Originally posted by Badger11 Grealish is an upmarket version of Ayew. He wins free kicks and can slow the game down, he dribbles but unfortunately his end product is nowhere need as good as it should be. Too many blind alleys. If someone like Pep can't train him to release the ball at the right time then I think he is too old to change. The guy who has replaced him in the City team is like a Duracell bunny he runs down the wing an delivers a cross. He may not be as skilful as Grealish but I bet Haaland prefers playing with him. Edited by Badger11 (07 Jun 2024 9.19am) I would call him a very expensive version of Ayew.....and not as good at the job. Ayew is the best diver in the Premier according to stats and cost £2m. Grealish £100m!!
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dreamwaverider

London 07 Jun 24 10.30am

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Originally posted by Badger11

Grealish is an upmarket version of Ayew. He wins free kicks and can slow the game down, he dribbles but unfortunately his end product is nowhere need as good as it should be. Too many blind alleys.

If someone like Pep can't train him to release the ball at the right time then I think he is too old to change.

The guy who has replaced him in the City team is like a Duracell bunny he runs down the wing an delivers a cross. He may not be as skilful as Grealish but I bet Haaland prefers playing with him.

Edited by Badger11 (07 Jun 2024 9.19am)

I would call him a very expensive version of Ayew.....and not as good at the job. Ayew is the best diver in the Premier according to stats and cost £2m. Grealish £100m!!

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dreamwaverider London 07 Jun 24 10.42am
Bit odd the way Maddison was released a day early? Im wondering if there was some disruption in the camp? Grealish departure in my view is a culmination of a poor season for him as a player and I dont think his role as lead celebrator helps him. Modern day football is all about mental and physical fitness. Players have to take their mind and bodies to a pinnacle to perform at their best. Gone are the days of a few pints on thursday night down the local then abstain from booze until after the game on Saturday. Nowadays footballers either create a platform for themselves to operate at their absolute maximum, or they get found out. There are so many obstacles in their careers, not least injuries , that hold them back, if they are not 100% focused on all fronts of mind and matter they may miss the cut.
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dreamwaverider

London 07 Jun 24 10.42am

Bit odd the way Maddison was released a day early?
Im wondering if there was some disruption in the camp?
Grealish departure in my view is a culmination of a poor season for him as a player and I dont think his role as lead celebrator helps him.
Modern day football is all about mental and physical fitness.
Players have to take their mind and bodies to a pinnacle to perform at their best.
Gone are the days of a few pints on thursday night down the local then abstain from booze until after the game on Saturday.
Nowadays footballers either create a platform for themselves to operate at their absolute maximum, or they get found out.
There are so many obstacles in their careers, not least injuries , that hold them back, if they are not 100% focused on all fronts of mind and matter they may miss the cut.

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MrRobbo Chaldon 07 Jun 24 11.01am
Originally posted by dreamwaverider Bit odd the way Maddison was released a day early? Im wondering if there was some disruption in the camp? Grealish departure in my view is a culmination of a poor season for him as a player and I dont think his role as lead celebrator helps him. Modern day football is all about mental and physical fitness. Players have to take their mind and bodies to a pinnacle to perform at their best. Gone are the days of a few pints on thursday night down the local then abstain from booze until after the game on Saturday. Nowadays footballers either create a platform for themselves to operate at their absolute maximum, or they get found out. There are so many obstacles in their careers, not least injuries , that hold them back, if they are not 100% focused on all fronts of mind and matter they may miss the cut. From a few of the press guys, the issue GS has was that the squad needed to be in at 11pm tonight. And with the game finishing at 10ish, he wouldn't have time to sit down with the dropped individuals. So felt that it was better to do it ahead of the game, especially as he wasn't intending on using any of those players. Sounds like the guys were told that they could go if they wanted, so they did. Sounds like Maddison was the first to be told.
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MrRobbo

Chaldon 07 Jun 24 11.01am

Originally posted by dreamwaverider

From a few of the press guys, the issue GS has was that the squad needed to be in at 11pm tonight. And with the game finishing at 10ish, he wouldn't have time to sit down with the dropped individuals.

So felt that it was better to do it ahead of the game, especially as he wasn't intending on using any of those players. Sounds like the guys were told that they could go if they wanted, so they did. Sounds like Maddison was the first to be told.

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Nicholas91 The Democratic Republic of Kent 07 Jun 24 11.17am
Originally posted by taylors lovechild One thing I hope the Grealish situation shows is that City is not the place for mavericks like Eze to go if they want to thrive and enjoy their football. I thought GS would still take Grealish as there's a lot of new faces in the squad, but Eze earned his place on merit, as did Gordon. I do also wonder if Grealish is perhaps a bit of a Jack the lad and that possibly doesn't play well with Southgate? Just imagine if it's Palace players who play a big role in finally winning a major tournament for England again. You would hope that is a well understood scenario. City are a well oiled machine where an individual player would essentially have to abandon any inclination toward flair to work within the system. Grealish was class for Villa and looked a slightly different and arguably better version of Zaha (for us). At City, he has learned to merely contribute toward the team retaining possession as a bit part player and not much beyond that. He sacrificed his footballing identity, and local team, for money and silverware. That's not a criticism of him either, he may well have accepted that early doors. A player like Eze would essentially have to accept that everything he did previously was no longer welcome and he'd have to learn a new way to play. You'd think that is a pretty strong put off for someone like him though there is certainly plenty of reason he would make such a move. I think us being the most represented club in the England squad, a real spring board for C'ship talent and playing exciting football under Glasner bodes very well for the future. Very well indeed. Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!
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Nicholas91

The Democratic Republic of Kent 07 Jun 24 11.17am

Originally posted by taylors lovechild

One thing I hope the Grealish situation shows is that City is not the place for mavericks like Eze to go if they want to thrive and enjoy their football. I thought GS would still take Grealish as there's a lot of new faces in the squad, but Eze earned his place on merit, as did Gordon. I do also wonder if Grealish is perhaps a bit of a Jack the lad and that possibly doesn't play well with Southgate?

Just imagine if it's Palace players who play a big role in finally winning a major tournament for England again.

You would hope that is a well understood scenario.

City are a well oiled machine where an individual player would essentially have to abandon any inclination toward flair to work within the system. Grealish was class for Villa and looked a slightly different and arguably better version of Zaha (for us). At City, he has learned to merely contribute toward the team retaining possession as a bit part player and not much beyond that. He sacrificed his footballing identity, and local team, for money and silverware. That's not a criticism of him either, he may well have accepted that early doors.

A player like Eze would essentially have to accept that everything he did previously was no longer welcome and he'd have to learn a new way to play. You'd think that is a pretty strong put off for someone like him though there is certainly plenty of reason he would make such a move.

I think us being the most represented club in the England squad, a real spring board for C'ship talent and playing exciting football under Glasner bodes very well for the future. Very well indeed.

Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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CrazyBadger Ware 07 Jun 24 11.52am
Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow I think that's really harsh - at Villa he was a goalscorer and a creator, if anything Pep has coached that out of him in favour or ball retention and making 'safer' decisions with the ball. 10 goals, 8 assists in 19/20 season 6 goals, 10 assists in 20/21. He came on and immediately made a goal the other night. He's clearly had a bad season, and I really hope he gets out of City and goes somewhere he's allowed to express himself again - I think he's one of the most exciting players in the country when he's given the freedom to show it - I actually think his playing style is far closer to Eze than it is to Ayew. I think he can feel pretty hard done by - Gordon and Bowen are good players but I would certainly much rather have Grealish as an option to change a game. 100% this. He's the one player in our squad that, is able to change the intensity of a match - as shown by his 'assist' the other night. It was the introduction of him and Kane that changed the game on Monday night. As a starter, hes useless and doesn't do enough, but as a 60min sub, we've got noone like him. Yes, his main skill appears to be try to go past someone then fall over.. which we need when chasing a game; Against tiring legs he's the guy to bring on. We're going to miss that option. "It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"
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CrazyBadger

Ware 07 Jun 24 11.52am

Originally posted by EverybodyDannsNow

I think that's really harsh - at Villa he was a goalscorer and a creator, if anything Pep has coached that out of him in favour or ball retention and making 'safer' decisions with the ball.

10 goals, 8 assists in 19/20 season
6 goals, 10 assists in 20/21.

He came on and immediately made a goal the other night.

He's clearly had a bad season, and I really hope he gets out of City and goes somewhere he's allowed to express himself again - I think he's one of the most exciting players in the country when he's given the freedom to show it - I actually think his playing style is far closer to Eze than it is to Ayew.

I think he can feel pretty hard done by - Gordon and Bowen are good players but I would certainly much rather have Grealish as an option to change a game.

100% this.

He's the one player in our squad that, is able to change the intensity of a match - as shown by his 'assist' the other night. It was the introduction of him and Kane that changed the game on Monday night. As a starter, hes useless and doesn't do enough, but as a 60min sub, we've got noone like him.
Yes, his main skill appears to be try to go past someone then fall over.. which we need when chasing a game; Against tiring legs he's the guy to bring on. We're going to miss that option.

"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"

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CrazyBadger Ware 07 Jun 24 12.06pm
Originally posted by Nicholas91 Originally posted by taylors lovechild One thing I hope the Grealish situation shows is that City is not the place for mavericks like Eze to go if they want to thrive and enjoy their football. I thought GS would still take Grealish as there's a lot of new faces in the squad, but Eze earned his place on merit, as did Gordon. I do also wonder if Grealish is perhaps a bit of a Jack the lad and that possibly doesn't play well with Southgate? Just imagine if it's Palace players who play a big role in finally winning a major tournament for England again. You would hope that is a well understood scenario. City are a well oiled machine where an individual player would essentially have to abandon any inclination toward flair to work within the system. Grealish was class for Villa and looked a slightly different and arguably better version of Zaha (for us). At City, he has learned to merely contribute toward the team retaining possession as a bit part player and not much beyond that. He sacrificed his footballing identity, and local team, for money and silverware. That's not a criticism of him either, he may well have accepted that early doors. A player like Eze would essentially have to accept that everything he did previously was no longer welcome and he'd have to learn a new way to play. You'd think that is a pretty strong put off for someone like him though there is certainly plenty of reason he would make such a move. I think us being the most represented club in the England squad, a real spring board for C'ship talent and playing exciting football under Glasner bodes very well for the future. Very well indeed. I find this idea hard to swallow. there's been plenty of Maverick Talent in the City team, past and present. Silva(Bernado and prevously David), Mahrez, even KdB and Foden are encouraged to play how they like to play, and create something. And just look at Doku, regularly taking on players, rather than 'passing backwards'. Granted rule 1 is to pass around and find an opening, but sometimes to find the opening you have to include a maverick bit of talent. that's where ManC excel. Grealish has no doubt gone backwards at City, but to level that Pep has coached it out of him, I just don't think so. More likely that he simply don't fit into the system. He's not a Big Fish in a little pond anymore. "It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"
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CrazyBadger

Ware 07 Jun 24 12.06pm

Originally posted by Nicholas91

Originally posted by taylors lovechild

One thing I hope the Grealish situation shows is that City is not the place for mavericks like Eze to go if they want to thrive and enjoy their football. I thought GS would still take Grealish as there's a lot of new faces in the squad, but Eze earned his place on merit, as did Gordon. I do also wonder if Grealish is perhaps a bit of a Jack the lad and that possibly doesn't play well with Southgate?

Just imagine if it's Palace players who play a big role in finally winning a major tournament for England again.

You would hope that is a well understood scenario.

I think us being the most represented club in the England squad, a real spring board for C'ship talent and playing exciting football under Glasner bodes very well for the future. Very well indeed.

I find this idea hard to swallow. there's been plenty of Maverick Talent in the City team, past and present. Silva(Bernado and prevously David), Mahrez, even KdB and Foden are encouraged to play how they like to play, and create something. And just look at Doku, regularly taking on players, rather than 'passing backwards'.
Granted rule 1 is to pass around and find an opening, but sometimes to find the opening you have to include a maverick bit of talent. that's where ManC excel.
Grealish has no doubt gone backwards at City, but to level that Pep has coached it out of him, I just don't think so. More likely that he simply don't fit into the system. He's not a Big Fish in a little pond anymore.

"It was a Team effort, I guess it took all players working together to lose this one"

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dreamwaverider London 07 Jun 24 12.33pm
Originally posted by CrazyBadger I find this idea hard to swallow. there's been plenty of Maverick Talent in the City team, past and present. Silva(Bernado and prevously David), Mahrez, even KdB and Foden are encouraged to play how they like to play, and create something. And just look at Doku, regularly taking on players, rather than 'passing backwards'. Granted rule 1 is to pass around and find an opening, but sometimes to find the opening you have to include a maverick bit of talent. that's where ManC excel. Grealish has no doubt gone backwards at City, but to level that Pep has coached it out of him, I just don't think so. More likely that he simply don't fit into the system. He's not a Big Fish in a little pond anymore. Grealish has also changed shape since joining City. He has significantly more muscle which appears to have slowed his acceleration. He rarely takes anyone on and even more rarely gets past them. His body change may well be genetic, but Im sure City have physicians who could help him adjust his shape back to more like Villa days giving him the type of pace Doku benefits from. Edited by dreamwaverider (07 Jun 2024 12.34pm)
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dreamwaverider

London 07 Jun 24 12.33pm

Originally posted by CrazyBadger

Grealish has also changed shape since joining City. He has significantly more muscle which appears to have slowed his acceleration. He rarely takes anyone on and even more rarely gets past them. His body change may well be genetic, but Im sure City have physicians who could help him adjust his shape back to more like Villa days giving him the type of pace Doku benefits from.

Edited by dreamwaverider (07 Jun 2024 12.34pm)

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Nicholas91 The Democratic Republic of Kent 07 Jun 24 1.40pm
Originally posted by CrazyBadger I find this idea hard to swallow. there's been plenty of Maverick Talent in the City team, past and present. Silva(Bernado and prevously David), Mahrez, even KdB and Foden are encouraged to play how they like to play, and create something. And just look at Doku, regularly taking on players, rather than 'passing backwards'. Granted rule 1 is to pass around and find an opening, but sometimes to find the opening you have to include a maverick bit of talent. that's where ManC excel. Grealish has no doubt gone backwards at City, but to level that Pep has coached it out of him, I just don't think so. More likely that he simply don't fit into the system. He's not a Big Fish in a little pond anymore. That is essentially my point CB, more specifically players like Grealish and Eze. Mahrez was a world class winger without having much pace, KdB too is perhaps one of the most technically gifted and intelligent footballers in the world, similar things could be said about the Silvas and Foden to a lesser extent (currently). They 'fit the mould' quite nicely. The likes of Doku and Walker have blistering pace but perhaps not quite world class tactical awareness/footballing intelligence. Pep can coach a level of conformity into them without it affecting their athleticism. The likes of Grealish, our very own Zaha and now Eze, almost rely on 'breaking the rules' through their maverick style. I'm not sure they would fit into City beyond being a bit of a wildcard option should they want that. In essence, I don't think we were ever going to see the likes of Grealish play regularly for them, or Eze hypothetically, and certainly not without them sacrificing or abandoning much of which has made them great players. JG is almost unrecognisable from his Villa days and I don't think we'd see the same Eze we know and love now at City, were he to go there. They may well be big fish for little ponds, but that situation would reverse where the team and tactical system is prioritised far above their unique talents. I'd suggest JG is now a relatively small fish in City's massive pond and that's why he's not being selected for Int'l duty but Eze, at little ol' Crystal Palace, is. I could probably have communicated that a bit more briefly... Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!
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Nicholas91

The Democratic Republic of Kent 07 Jun 24 1.40pm

Originally posted by CrazyBadger

I find this idea hard to swallow. there's been plenty of Maverick Talent in the City team, past and present. Silva(Bernado and prevously David), Mahrez, even KdB and Foden are encouraged to play how they like to play, and create something. And just look at Doku, regularly taking on players, rather than 'passing backwards'.
Granted rule 1 is to pass around and find an opening, but sometimes to find the opening you have to include a maverick bit of talent. that's where ManC excel.
Grealish has no doubt gone backwards at City, but to level that Pep has coached it out of him, I just don't think so. More likely that he simply don't fit into the system. He's not a Big Fish in a little pond anymore.

That is essentially my point CB, more specifically players like Grealish and Eze.

Mahrez was a world class winger without having much pace, KdB too is perhaps one of the most technically gifted and intelligent footballers in the world, similar things could be said about the Silvas and Foden to a lesser extent (currently). They 'fit the mould' quite nicely. The likes of Doku and Walker have blistering pace but perhaps not quite world class tactical awareness/footballing intelligence. Pep can coach a level of conformity into them without it affecting their athleticism.

The likes of Grealish, our very own Zaha and now Eze, almost rely on 'breaking the rules' through their maverick style. I'm not sure they would fit into City beyond being a bit of a wildcard option should they want that. In essence, I don't think we were ever going to see the likes of Grealish play regularly for them, or Eze hypothetically, and certainly not without them sacrificing or abandoning much of which has made them great players. JG is almost unrecognisable from his Villa days and I don't think we'd see the same Eze we know and love now at City, were he to go there. They may well be big fish for little ponds, but that situation would reverse where the team and tactical system is prioritised far above their unique talents. I'd suggest JG is now a relatively small fish in City's massive pond and that's why he's not being selected for Int'l duty but Eze, at little ol' Crystal Palace, is.

I could probably have communicated that a bit more briefly...

Now Zaha's got a bit of green grass ahead of him here... and finds Ambrose... not a bad effort!!!!

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taylors lovechild 07 Jun 24 2.21pm
...I would add that I think many of my beliefs are built around delusion! If I believe Palace is the best place for the likes of Eze and Olise then maybe they'll think that too. Bringing the topic back on track, I see the media are trying to stir up drama around Eze getting picked ahead of Grealish. [Link] I was surprised with the decision, but anyone who has watched the two of them this season could clearly see one was on the up and one was on the down.
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taylors lovechild

07 Jun 24 2.21pm

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...I would add that I think many of my beliefs are built around delusion! If I believe Palace is the best place for the likes of Eze and Olise then maybe they'll think that too.

Bringing the topic back on track, I see the media are trying to stir up drama around Eze getting picked ahead of Grealish. [Link] I was surprised with the decision, but anyone who has watched the two of them this season could clearly see one was on the up and one was on the down.

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MrRobbo Chaldon 07 Jun 24 3.01pm
Originally posted by CrazyBadger 100% this. He's the one player in our squad that, is able to change the intensity of a match - as shown by his 'assist' the other night. It was the introduction of him and Kane that changed the game on Monday night. As a starter, hes useless and doesn't do enough, but as a 60min sub, we've got noone like him. Yes, his main skill appears to be try to go past someone then fall over.. which we need when chasing a game; Against tiring legs he's the guy to bring on. We're going to miss that option. Personally I wouldn't agree with that. I thought Kane was a clear upgrade on Watkins, and that Warton was much more key to the tempo. Without that assist Grealish added nothing IMO, whenever a stepover didnt trick the full back, he slowed it all down and passed it on. as many other have said Grealish used to be very, very exciting, but he doesn't play like that any more. Eze and Palmer will play the 'we need something different' role in this tournament.
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MrRobbo

Chaldon 07 Jun 24 3.01pm

Originally posted by CrazyBadger

100% this.

Personally I wouldn't agree with that. I thought Kane was a clear upgrade on Watkins, and that Warton was much more key to the tempo.

Without that assist Grealish added nothing IMO, whenever a stepover didnt trick the full back, he slowed it all down and passed it on.

as many other have said Grealish used to be very, very exciting, but he doesn't play like that any more.

Eze and Palmer will play the 'we need something different' role in this tournament.

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doombear Too far from Selhurst Park 07 Jun 24 3.22pm
Originally posted by MrRobbo Personally I wouldn't agree with that. I thought Kane was a clear upgrade on Watkins, and that Warton was much more key to the tempo. Without that assist Grealish added nothing IMO, whenever a stepover didnt trick the full back, he slowed it all down and passed it on. as many other have said Grealish used to be very, very exciting, but he doesn't play like that any more. Eze and Palmer will play the 'we need something different' role in this tournament. If my memory serves ne right, it was Wharton's quick pass to Grealish that provided him with the space to get his cross in for TAA's goal. As you say, Wharton's arrival resulted in an upping of the tempo of the game, I would add that that arose by reason of his quick (often one touch) and firm passing creating space for the forward players to attack with more momentum.
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doombear

Too far from Selhurst Park 07 Jun 24 3.22pm

Originally posted by MrRobbo

Personally I wouldn't agree with that. I thought Kane was a clear upgrade on Watkins, and that Warton was much more key to the tempo.

Without that assist Grealish added nothing IMO, whenever a stepover didnt trick the full back, he slowed it all down and passed it on.

as many other have said Grealish used to be very, very exciting, but he doesn't play like that any more.

Eze and Palmer will play the 'we need something different' role in this tournament.

If my memory serves ne right, it was Wharton's quick pass to Grealish that provided him with the space to get his cross in for TAA's goal.

As you say, Wharton's arrival resulted in an upping of the tempo of the game, I would add that that arose by reason of his quick (often one touch) and firm passing creating space for the forward players to attack with more momentum.

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