General Election 2017

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General Election 2017

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Kermit8 Hevon 20 Apr 17 1.47pm
Originally posted by Mr_Gristle Genuine - not sarcastic - question......really, is this true? I thought most out voters wanted immigration to stop or (at the very least) reduce to a trickle. How happy will they be once the Brexited UK government decides that it still wants hundreds of thousands of cheap human resources a year? One old-ish and honest man-in-the-street Brexit voter when asked by a reporter 'why people were voting Leave?' said 'it's about the muslims' and after seeing Farage and that long line of refugees poster and all the nonsense talk about Turkey I make him right for many. I think if some on here were more honest like him they would agree with him too rather than 'debate' other areas as if they were the main reason for their stance. Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 20 Apr 17 1.47pm

Originally posted by Mr_Gristle

Genuine - not sarcastic - question......really, is this true?

I thought most out voters wanted immigration to stop or (at the very least) reduce to a trickle. How happy will they be once the Brexited UK government decides that it still wants hundreds of thousands of cheap human resources a year?

One old-ish and honest man-in-the-street Brexit voter when asked by a reporter 'why people were voting Leave?' said 'it's about the muslims' and after seeing Farage and that long line of refugees poster and all the nonsense talk about Turkey I make him right for many.

I think if some on here were more honest like him they would agree with him too rather than 'debate' other areas as if they were the main reason for their stance.

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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rob1969 Banstead Surrey 20 Apr 17 1.52pm
Many out voters almost certainly wanted/expected immigration stopped or least radically reduced. However a lot of people voted for all aspects of our lives - including control of immigration - to be decided by the UK parliament and overseen by the UK judicial system. To me UK independence and 'democracy' were the major issues, transcending all other concerns.
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rob1969

Banstead Surrey 20 Apr 17 1.52pm

Many out voters almost certainly wanted/expected immigration stopped or least radically reduced. However a lot of people voted for all aspects of our lives - including control of immigration - to be decided by the UK parliament and overseen by the UK judicial system. To me UK independence and 'democracy' were the major issues, transcending all other concerns.

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Hrolf The Ganger 20 Apr 17 1.56pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 One old-ish and honest man-in-the-street Brexit voter when asked by a reporter 'why people were voting Leave?' said 'it's about the muslims' and after seeing Farage and that long line of refugees poster and all the nonsense talk about Turkey I make him right for many. I think if some on here were more honest like him they would agree with him too rather than 'debate' other areas as if they were the main reason for their stance. If you are suggesting that some people have simplistic reasoning for their voting behaviour, then considering the complexity of the issues involved, to a greater or lesser extent that includes almost everybody, including those on the Left. In some cases it might be instinctive. In other words, there is an inherent non academic sense of what is good for them. This should not be dismissed purely as ignorance or xenophobia in the case of Brexiters because there are a raft of very good logical reasons why their instincts might be right.
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Hrolf The Ganger

20 Apr 17 1.56pm

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Originally posted by Kermit8

I think if some on here were more honest like him they would agree with him too rather than 'debate' other areas as if they were the main reason for their stance.

If you are suggesting that some people have simplistic reasoning for their voting behaviour, then considering the complexity of the issues involved, to a greater or lesser extent that includes almost everybody, including those on the Left.
In some cases it might be instinctive. In other words, there is an inherent non academic sense of what is good for them. This should not be dismissed purely as ignorance or xenophobia in the case of Brexiters because there are a raft of very good logical reasons why their instincts might be right.

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Rudi Hedman Caterham 20 Apr 17 1.59pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 One old-ish and honest man-in-the-street Brexit voter when asked by a reporter 'why people were voting Leave?' said 'it's about the muslims' and after seeing Farage and that long line of refugees poster and all the nonsense talk about Turkey I make him right for many. I think if some on here were more honest like him they would agree with him too rather than 'debate' other areas as if they were the main reason for their stance. They could be a reason in time. EU citizenship after a few years in Germany, children, more children, their children. Of course there are cohesion issues if you live in highly populated Muslim areas but to many it's a case of who, what, when and why, and actually to have some sort of say or control, rather than a few votes amongst hundreds that mean actually nothing. One day the young of today and tomorrow might see it's been of benefit, and possibly some paper filling to do that short term casual job abroad or long term opportunity they're qualified for. Or we could stay in and encourage the best post graduate talent from Italy and Spain and see how their careers go then. The Tory voters of tomorrow. Young Tory without a heart, old liberal without brain. COYP
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Rudi Hedman

Caterham 20 Apr 17 1.59pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

I think if some on here were more honest like him they would agree with him too rather than 'debate' other areas as if they were the main reason for their stance.

They could be a reason in time. EU citizenship after a few years in Germany, children, more children, their children.

Of course there are cohesion issues if you live in highly populated Muslim areas but to many it's a case of who, what, when and why, and actually to have some sort of say or control, rather than a few votes amongst hundreds that mean actually nothing.

One day the young of today and tomorrow might see it's been of benefit, and possibly some paper filling to do that short term casual job abroad or long term opportunity they're qualified for.

Or we could stay in and encourage the best post graduate talent from Italy and Spain and see how their careers go then. The Tory voters of tomorrow. Young Tory without a heart, old liberal without brain.

COYP

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CambridgeEagle Sydenham 20 Apr 17 2.00pm
[Link] This article, while about the US, applies to the UK. It offers an interesting insight into loss of jobs in traditional industries and the conclusion is bang on. The accusations could very well be levelled at successive governments in the UK and certainly at the current one.
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CambridgeEagle

Sydenham 20 Apr 17 2.00pm

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[Link]

This article, while about the US, applies to the UK. It offers an interesting insight into loss of jobs in traditional industries and the conclusion is bang on. The accusations could very well be levelled at successive governments in the UK and certainly at the current one.

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matt_himself Matataland 20 Apr 17 2.08pm
Originally posted by CambridgeEagle Just because someone isn't gay doesn't mean equality is irrelevant. That's such a myopic view, the like of which lead to poorer outcomes for society as a whole. More equal and cohesive societies are more productive and happier places for everyone not just those who would be worse off under a less equal system. And before anyone thinks it I'm in no way promoting communism! For anyone who's interested I'd recommend reading anything by Stiglitz or Paul Krugman. It's good to see that there is interest in politics and economics and lively discussion among the Palace faithful! I didn't say that. You are using this to dodge what I put to you. The fact is that housing affects 100% of the population, gay rights circa 5%. Sure, you don't have to be gay to want equality for gays. However, if you are straight, gay rights are meaningless to your life. It's just like you can want ramps installed for disabled person access in public buildings, because that's the right thing to do, but if you don't have mobility issues it doesn't matter whether the ramps are there or not. "That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02
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matt_himself

Matataland 20 Apr 17 2.08pm

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

Just because someone isn't gay doesn't mean equality is irrelevant. That's such a myopic view, the like of which lead to poorer outcomes for society as a whole. More equal and cohesive societies are more productive and happier places for everyone not just those who would be worse off under a less equal system.

And before anyone thinks it I'm in no way promoting communism!

For anyone who's interested I'd recommend reading anything by Stiglitz or Paul Krugman. It's good to see that there is interest in politics and economics and lively discussion among the Palace faithful!

I didn't say that.

You are using this to dodge what I put to you.

The fact is that housing affects 100% of the population, gay rights circa 5%.

Sure, you don't have to be gay to want equality for gays. However, if you are straight, gay rights are meaningless to your life. It's just like you can want ramps installed for disabled person access in public buildings, because that's the right thing to do, but if you don't have mobility issues it doesn't matter whether the ramps are there or not.

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 20 Apr 17 2.11pm
Originally posted by matt_himself I didn't say that. You are using this to dodge what I put to you. The fact is that housing affects 100% of the population, gay rights circa 5%. Sure, you don't have to be gay to want equality for gays. However, if you are straight, gay rights are meaningless to your life. It's just like you can want ramps installed for disabled person access in public buildings, because that's the right thing to do, but if you don't have mobility issues it doesn't matter whether the ramps are there or not. If you are straight,gay rights are meaningless to your life! What crap.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 20 Apr 17 2.11pm

Originally posted by matt_himself

I didn't say that.

You are using this to dodge what I put to you.

The fact is that housing affects 100% of the population, gay rights circa 5%.

If you are straight,gay rights are meaningless to your life! What crap.

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Kermit8 Hevon 20 Apr 17 2.17pm
Originally posted by matt_himself I didn't say that. You are using this to dodge what I put to you. The fact is that housing affects 100% of the population, gay rights circa 5%. Sure, you don't have to be gay to want equality for gays. However, if you are straight, gay rights are meaningless to your life. It's just like you can want ramps installed for disabled person access in public buildings, because that's the right thing to do, but if you don't have mobility issues it doesn't matter whether the ramps are there or not. That is a bit silly. Family and friends will be impacted if someone they care about is having a bad time of it. Big chest and massive boobs [Link]
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Kermit8

Hevon 20 Apr 17 2.17pm

Originally posted by matt_himself

I didn't say that.

You are using this to dodge what I put to you.

The fact is that housing affects 100% of the population, gay rights circa 5%.

Sure, you don't have to be gay to want equality for gays. However, if you are straight, gay rights are meaningless to your life. It's just like you can want ramps installed for disabled person access in public buildings, because that's the right thing to do, but if you don't have mobility issues it doesn't matter whether the ramps are there or not.

That is a bit silly. Family and friends will be impacted if someone they care about is having a bad time of it.

Big chest and massive boobs

[Link]

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Cucking Funt Clapham on the Back 20 Apr 17 2.19pm
Originally posted by nickgusset If you are straight,gay rights are meaningless to your life! What crap. So what meaning should "gay rights" have for someone who isn't gay? Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham
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Cucking Funt

Clapham on the Back 20 Apr 17 2.19pm

Originally posted by nickgusset

If you are straight,gay rights are meaningless to your life! What crap.

So what meaning should "gay rights" have for someone who isn't gay?

Wife beating may be socially acceptable in Sheffield, but it is a different matter in Cheltenham

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matt_himself Matataland 20 Apr 17 2.20pm
Originally posted by Kermit8 That is a bit silly. Family and friends will be impacted if someone they care about is having a bad time of it. Maybe but it doesn't stop you functioning as an individual. And, being quite frank, does government influence society on matters like rights or does society influence government? "That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02
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matt_himself

Matataland 20 Apr 17 2.20pm

Originally posted by Kermit8

That is a bit silly. Family and friends will be impacted if someone they care about is having a bad time of it.

Maybe but it doesn't stop you functioning as an individual.

And, being quite frank, does government influence society on matters like rights or does society influence government?

"That was fun and to round off the day, I am off to steal a charity collection box and then desecrate a place of worship.” - Smokey, The Selhurst Arms, 26/02/02

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Hrolf The Ganger 20 Apr 17 2.22pm
Originally posted by CambridgeEagle [Link] This article, while about the US, applies to the UK. It offers an interesting insight into loss of jobs in traditional industries and the conclusion is bang on. The accusations could very well be levelled at successive governments in the UK and certainly at the current one. So this about 'race' again? This demonstrates that reductionism is alive and well everywhere. Industry is about profit. It has to recognise changing markets and new technology to achieve that goal. Sadly, the any particular work force is secondary to that end in the private sector. Am I teaching your granny to suck eggs here? It seems like it's necessary in your case. Industry has to serve society, but forcing it to become less efficient and or profitable has negative consequences. I'm all for protecting jobs or even nationalisation if the benefits to the majority can be shown to outweigh the disadvantages and not just serve a minority but we have seen that these types of arrangements are very costly to the taxpayer. If these were simple issues then they would have simple solutions. They clearly don't.
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Hrolf The Ganger

20 Apr 17 2.22pm

Originally posted by CambridgeEagle

[Link]

So this about 'race' again?

This demonstrates that reductionism is alive and well everywhere.

Industry is about profit. It has to recognise changing markets and new technology to achieve that goal. Sadly, the any particular work force is secondary to that end in the private sector. Am I teaching your granny to suck eggs here? It seems like it's necessary in your case.
Industry has to serve society, but forcing it to become less efficient and or profitable has negative consequences. I'm all for protecting jobs or even nationalisation if the benefits to the majority can be shown to outweigh the disadvantages and not just serve a minority but we have seen that these types of arrangements are very costly to the taxpayer.
If these were simple issues then they would have simple solutions. They clearly don't.

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nickgusset Shizzlehurst 20 Apr 17 2.23pm
Originally posted by Cucking Funt So what meaning should "gay rights" have for someone who isn't gay? That people from whatever walk of society should be treated equally. If you have friends or family that are gay (which I do) you'd like then to not be discriminated against.
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nickgusset

Shizzlehurst 20 Apr 17 2.23pm

Originally posted by Cucking Funt

So what meaning should "gay rights" have for someone who isn't gay?

That people from whatever walk of society should be treated equally.
If you have friends or family that are gay (which I do) you'd like then to not be discriminated against.

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