Stadium Redevelopment

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Stadium Redevelopment

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SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 13 Nov 20 3.12pm
Originally posted by TheBigToePunt I think perhaps your knowledge is lagging a little behind your emotions, and to be frank it doesn't seem like you'd have to get very emotional for that to happen. If you can point me towards an available, affordable brownfield site in South London big enough to house a 40,000 seater stadium and the requisite transport links then I'll be happy to amend my view. If you can top that by explaining how a new-build stadium would somehow be exempt from the type of planning contributions in the current S106 agreement then I might even give some credence to the rest of what you say. For those not in the know, a brownfield site is one within the urban area which has been developed before in some way (so not a park or a field etc). If you are beginning to think such a huge plot might be hard to find and/or hideously expensive (particularly compared to land we already own and which has a football ground on it), congratulations: You are living in the real world. Zing. Finally some sense Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.
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SW19 CPFC

Addiscombe West 13 Nov 20 3.12pm

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

I think perhaps your knowledge is lagging a little behind your emotions, and to be frank it doesn't seem like you'd have to get very emotional for that to happen.

If you can point me towards an available, affordable brownfield site in South London big enough to house a 40,000 seater stadium and the requisite transport links then I'll be happy to amend my view. If you can top that by explaining how a new-build stadium would somehow be exempt from the type of planning contributions in the current S106 agreement then I might even give some credence to the rest of what you say.

For those not in the know, a brownfield site is one within the urban area which has been developed before in some way (so not a park or a field etc). If you are beginning to think such a huge plot might be hard to find and/or hideously expensive (particularly compared to land we already own and which has a football ground on it), congratulations: You are living in the real world.

Zing. Finally some sense

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

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Painter Croydon 13 Nov 20 8.34pm
Originally posted by SW19 CPFC Planning and development is one of the departments that is deemed an 'essential' service, so won't be subject to spending restrictions. Not sure if that also means it will be exempt from cuts, but we shall see A mate of mine is employed by Croydon Council, he told me a few weeks ago, they are cutting jobs left right and centre, as they were bankrupt. That nice shinny new council office will be less than half filled.
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Painter

Croydon 13 Nov 20 8.34pm

Originally posted by SW19 CPFC

Planning and development is one of the departments that is deemed an 'essential' service, so won't be subject to spending restrictions. Not sure if that also means it will be exempt from cuts, but we shall see

A mate of mine is employed by Croydon Council, he told me a few weeks ago, they are cutting jobs left right and centre, as they were bankrupt. That nice shinny new council office will be less than half filled.

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SW19 CPFC Addiscombe West 13 Nov 20 11.02pm
Originally posted by Painter A mate of mine is employed by Croydon Council, he told me a few weeks ago, they are cutting jobs left right and centre, as they were bankrupt. That nice shinny new council office will be less than half filled. They’re going to have to sell a lot of assets. Cuts had already been underway before this all started, and ultimately you can only make so many staff redundant. Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.
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SW19 CPFC

Addiscombe West 13 Nov 20 11.02pm

Originally posted by Painter

They’re going to have to sell a lot of assets. Cuts had already been underway before this all started, and ultimately you can only make so many staff redundant.

Did you know? 98.0000001% of people are morons.

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Eaglecoops CR3 14 Nov 20 10.34am
Originally posted by dreamwaverider I bet Parish had little idea what he was getting involved in when he decided for Place to stay at Selhurst and try and build a new stand. Since our last stand, the Homesdale' was built the PC requirements surrounding planning have run away with themselves. I bet some of you 'experts' posting on here are public sector planning officers. If you are you should be ashamed at how the public sector has seized up the massive demand for housing in this country. Conservative estimates show we are now over one million residential dwelling short as a country. Planning, run by local authorities must be one of the slowest processes in this country. It will be at least 5 years from initiating the Selhurst dream before the project gets underway, probably longer. For 'impatient' developers and fans like myself, Parish would have been far better advised to have found a brown field site in the region which would have been a far easier option. Having had years of frustration dealing with government funded bureaucrats in councils and the NHS I am appalled at the attitude of these types. Most of them take great pleasure in seeing developers squirm and go out of their way to frustrate much needed growth. If they smell money, as was mentioned above re premier league wealth re the 106 well then they will gobble you up for breakfast. Maybe thats what created brown paper bags. What a foul world this has become. With regard to building houses I have one phrase which sums it up, ‘Sustainable development’ What do you think happens if you give free rein for widespread development? You need supporting infrastructure, schools, sewage, roads etc. You don’t see developers crying out to go and build the background infrastructure necessary to support hundreds of homes quite simply because it vastly reduces their profit margins. Yes, the planning system is slow, it always has been, however there are perfectly valid reasons behind it being so. Local Authorities have very little money to put into major schemes and neither the Highways or Schools or Health Authorities as their budgets have been decimated over the years, therefore the only way to put suitable infrastructure in place is to seek financial assistance from developers as part of an overall scheme. It is not a case of ripping anyone off, it’s about creating an overall sustainable development that is able to support itself and not just line developers pockets. Going back to Palace and our situation, I too have a dream of a large out of town stadium perhaps adjoining an outlet Mall with bars and restaurants that becomes a great place to visit even when there are no events at the stadium. However there are no suitable brown field sites in our area therefore it would have to be a green field site near the M25 and that requires political will not just at a local level, but a national level to make happen which is just not there.
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Eaglecoops

CR3 14 Nov 20 10.34am

Originally posted by dreamwaverider

I bet Parish had little idea what he was getting involved in when he decided for Place to stay at Selhurst and try and build a new stand.
Since our last stand, the Homesdale' was built the PC requirements surrounding planning have run away with themselves.
I bet some of you 'experts' posting on here are public sector planning officers. If you are you should be ashamed at how the public sector has seized up the massive demand for housing in this country. Conservative estimates show we are now over one million residential dwelling short as a country.
Planning, run by local authorities must be one of the slowest processes in this country. It will be at least 5 years from initiating the Selhurst dream before the project gets underway, probably longer.
For 'impatient' developers and fans like myself, Parish would have been far better advised to have found a brown field site in the region which would have been a far easier option.
Having had years of frustration dealing with government funded bureaucrats in councils and the NHS I am appalled at the attitude of these types. Most of them take great pleasure in seeing developers squirm and go out of their way to frustrate much needed growth. If they smell money, as was mentioned above re premier league wealth re the 106 well then they will gobble you up for breakfast.
Maybe thats what created brown paper bags.
What a foul world this has become.

With regard to building houses I have one phrase which sums it up, ‘Sustainable development’

What do you think happens if you give free rein for widespread development? You need supporting infrastructure, schools, sewage, roads etc. You don’t see developers crying out to go and build the background infrastructure necessary to support hundreds of homes quite simply because it vastly reduces their profit margins.

Yes, the planning system is slow, it always has been, however there are perfectly valid reasons behind it being so. Local Authorities have very little money to put into major schemes and neither the Highways or Schools or Health Authorities as their budgets have been decimated over the years, therefore the only way to put suitable infrastructure in place is to seek financial assistance from developers as part of an overall scheme.

It is not a case of ripping anyone off, it’s about creating an overall sustainable development that is able to support itself and not just line developers pockets.

Going back to Palace and our situation, I too have a dream of a large out of town stadium perhaps adjoining an outlet Mall with bars and restaurants that becomes a great place to visit even when there are no events at the stadium. However there are no suitable brown field sites in our area therefore it would have to be a green field site near the M25 and that requires political will not just at a local level, but a national level to make happen which is just not there.

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jeeagles 14 Nov 20 10.48am
Originally posted by TheBigToePunt I think perhaps your knowledge is lagging a little behind your emotions, and to be frank it doesn't seem like you'd have to get very emotional for that to happen. If you can point me towards an available, affordable brownfield site in South London big enough to house a 40,000 seater stadium and the requisite transport links then I'll be happy to amend my view. If you can top that by explaining how a new-build stadium would somehow be exempt from the type of planning contributions in the current S106 agreement then I might even give some credence to the rest of what you say. For those not in the know, a brownfield site is one within the urban area which has been developed before in some way (so not a park or a field etc). If you are beginning to think such a huge plot might be hard to find and/or hideously expensive (particularly compared to land we already own and which has a football ground on it), congratulations: You are living in the real world. Brownfield doesn't necessarily have to be in an urban area. It is a site that has been used as something such as a factory, power station, petrol station or dump where the land is contaminated. It can be bought fairly cheaply if you take on the responsibility of remediation, but you'd have to pay and wait for the contaminated land remediation in any brown field site. Selhust is probably built on contaminated land, which will drop its land value through the floor.
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jeeagles

14 Nov 20 10.48am

Originally posted by TheBigToePunt

I think perhaps your knowledge is lagging a little behind your emotions, and to be frank it doesn't seem like you'd have to get very emotional for that to happen.

Brownfield doesn't necessarily have to be in an urban area. It is a site that has been used as something such as a factory, power station, petrol station or dump where the land is contaminated.

It can be bought fairly cheaply if you take on the responsibility of remediation, but you'd have to pay and wait for the contaminated land remediation in any brown field site.

Selhust is probably built on contaminated land, which will drop its land value through the floor.

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imashed surrey 14 Nov 20 12.43pm
Why don't we try buying out Croydon fc and spin the ground round and nick a bit of the sewage farm as well as diverting the tram etc . Transport is good straight from east Croydon non stop with 6 carriage trams to a new built tram stop for the ground .
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imashed

surrey 14 Nov 20 12.43pm

Why don't we try buying out Croydon fc and spin the ground round and nick a bit of the sewage farm as well as diverting the tram etc .
Transport is good straight from east Croydon non stop with 6 carriage trams to a new built tram stop for the ground .

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Palace in the Blood 14 Nov 20 12.58pm
There are arguements both ways . If (and it is a big if) a brown field site could be found then planning would be off set gainst the potential of converting Selhurst Park into a site for Housing in a Similar way to Brentfords new ground with Griffin Park now destined for housing. This would make getting planning permission slightly easier as no house would need demolishing and tenants moved. However there would still be infra structure projects such as transport links, parking , traffic and noise issues that would be linked and certainly prove part of the planning approval
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Palace in the Blood

14 Nov 20 12.58pm

Send a Private Message to Palace in the Blood

There are arguements both ways . If (and it is a big if) a brown field site could be found then planning would be off set gainst the potential of converting Selhurst Park into a site for Housing in a Similar way to Brentfords new ground with Griffin Park now destined for housing.

This would make getting planning permission slightly easier as no house would need demolishing and tenants moved.

However there would still be infra structure projects such as transport links, parking , traffic and noise issues that would be linked and certainly prove part of the planning approval

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pax3908 14 Nov 20 1.06pm
Originally posted by Palace in the Blood There are arguements both ways . If (and it is a big if) a brown field site could be found then planning would be off set gainst the potential of converting Selhurst Park into a site for Housing in a Similar way to Brentfords new ground with Griffin Park now destined for housing. This would make getting planning permission slightly easier as no house would need demolishing and tenants moved. However there would still be infra structure projects such as transport links, parking , traffic and noise issues that would be linked and certainly prove part of the planning approval What was the reason we didn't move up o the Crystal palace sports arena?
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pax3908

14 Nov 20 1.06pm

Originally posted by Palace in the Blood

This would make getting planning permission slightly easier as no house would need demolishing and tenants moved.

However there would still be infra structure projects such as transport links, parking , traffic and noise issues that would be linked and certainly prove part of the planning approval

What was the reason we didn't move up o the Crystal palace sports arena?

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Palace in the Blood 14 Nov 20 1.26pm
Originally posted by pax3908 What was the reason we didn't move up o the Crystal palace sports arena? It is listed, Park is Green Space, in London Borough of Bromley and residents concerns.Plus Bromley London Borough Council (Crystal Palace) Act 1990, which limits development on the site. All make planning more difficult and expensive to obtain. Unlike a Brown field in Croydon and new homes on Selhurst Park which the council will see as a gain Edited by Palace in the Blood (14 Nov 2020 1.30pm)
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Palace in the Blood

14 Nov 20 1.26pm

Originally posted by pax3908

What was the reason we didn't move up o the Crystal palace sports arena?

It is listed, Park is Green Space, in London Borough of Bromley and residents concerns.Plus Bromley London Borough Council (Crystal Palace) Act 1990, which limits development on the site. All make planning more difficult and expensive to obtain. Unlike a Brown field in Croydon and new homes on Selhurst Park which the council will see as a gain

Edited by Palace in the Blood (14 Nov 2020 1.30pm)

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Badger11 Beckenham 14 Nov 20 1.41pm
Originally posted by Palace in the Blood It is listed, Park is Green Space, in London Borough of Bromley and residents concerns.Plus Bromley London Borough Council (Crystal Palace) Act 1990, which limits development on the site. All make planning more difficult and expensive to obtain. Unlike a Brown field in Croydon and new homes on Selhurst Park which the council will see as a gain Edited by Palace in the Blood (14 Nov 2020 1.30pm) It would only happen if Khan / government offered us a sweetheart deal e.g. they built it we rented it. Even then as others has posted it would be a battle with the neighbours for years. One more point
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Badger11

Beckenham 14 Nov 20 1.41pm

Originally posted by Palace in the Blood

Edited by Palace in the Blood (14 Nov 2020 1.30pm)

It would only happen if Khan / government offered us a sweetheart deal e.g. they built it we rented it. Even then as others has posted it would be a battle with the neighbours for years.

One more point

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ASCPFC Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 14 Nov 20 4.30pm
Gaudi's cathedral will be completed quicker than our one stand at this rate. Red and Blue Army!
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ASCPFC

Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 14 Nov 20 4.30pm

Gaudi's cathedral will be completed quicker than our one stand at this rate.

Red and Blue Army!

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est1905 14 Nov 20 5.45pm
Originally posted by imashed Why don't we try buying out Croydon fc and spin the ground round and nick a bit of the sewage farm as well as diverting the tram etc . Transport is good straight from east Croydon non stop with 6 carriage trams to a new built tram stop for the ground . Because if we buy their ground they will have to ground share with us or they will need to find somewhere else (which they wont be able to (dont suggest Selhurst, its simply not suitable for a low league club in maintenance costs alone. The only other option would be to merge with them. Rules say with a merger the 'new' club has to start again in the position the lower placed of the two clubs currently sit. Wanna go non league just to get your hands on Croydon's piece of crap stadium?
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est1905

14 Nov 20 5.45pm

Originally posted by imashed

Because if we buy their ground they will have to ground share with us or they will need to find somewhere else (which they wont be able to (dont suggest Selhurst, its simply not suitable for a low league club in maintenance costs alone. The only other option would be to merge with them. Rules say with a merger the 'new' club has to start again in the position the lower placed of the two clubs currently sit.
Wanna go non league just to get your hands on Croydon's piece of crap stadium?

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