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The Brexit Thread (LOCKED)
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 ASCPFC  Pro-Cathedral/caravan park 26 Sep 19 11.01pm |
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Originally posted by jeeagles
Did anyone else see the irony in an MP hysterically screaming at the PM to mind his language whilst citing the murder of another MP when trying to make a point about toning down language using in the commons. "No deal brexit" is also provocative language. They should say, leaving the EU trade agreements and signing up to WTO terms, but that doesn't sound sexy. "Project Fear" was also provocative language, but that was referring to a negative remain campaign that has failed to materialise, at least to the extent predicted. Sure, the pound is low and my skiing holiday is now f***ing expensive, but stocks are up, house prices and immigration are slowing, unemployment is down, wages are rising, the national debt is shrinking, the balance of payments has improved. It was good parliament has a debate on language today and Jo Cox's husband was critical of both sides. Anyone on HoL see a solution to parliaments complete gridlock? Boris is either hoping that another nation will veto our request for an extension, in which case, all of these obstructions would be pointless. I've been told by political aides that we are permitted to pay another member state to veto an extension on our behalf. Or, as parliament is now not able to function, it is likely that leave lawyers are hunting through the history books to find a case that can be used as a precedent to trigger a general election. I believe it is within the Queen's power to call an election if Parliament cannot come to any agreement. That may be made more complicated by the Law Lords' decision though.
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.TUX.  26 Sep 19 11.09pm |
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Originally posted by jeeagles
Did anyone else see the irony in an MP hysterically screaming at the PM to mind his language whilst citing the murder of another MP when trying to make a point about toning down language using in the commons. "No deal brexit" is also provocative language. They should say, leaving the EU trade agreements and signing up to WTO terms, but that doesn't sound sexy. "Project Fear" was also provocative language, but that was referring to a negative remain campaign that has failed to materialise, at least to the extent predicted. Sure, the pound is low and my skiing holiday is now f***ing expensive, but stocks are up, house prices and immigration are slowing, unemployment is down, wages are rising, the national debt is shrinking, the balance of payments has improved. It was good parliament has a debate on language today and Jo Cox's husband was critical of both sides. Anyone on HoL see a solution to parliaments complete gridlock? Boris is either hoping that another nation will veto our request for an extension, in which case, all of these obstructions would be pointless. I've been told by political aides that we are permitted to pay another member state to veto an extension on our behalf. Or, as parliament is now not able to function, it is likely that leave lawyers are hunting through the history books to find a case that can be used as a precedent to trigger a general election. 5th November Mk2?
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jeeagles  26 Sep 19 11.10pm |
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Originally posted by ASCPFC
I believe it is within the Queen's power to call an election if Parliament cannot come to any agreement. That may be made more complicated by the Law Lords' decision though. If there was a hung parliament after an election, and the parties couldn't come to an agreement, then there would be another election. Because the collision has lost power through a term, there would generally be another election, but the parties have prevented one. Surely, this is something the fixed term parliament act didn't envisage, and the law is now preventing something it that is not intended to?
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 26 Sep 19 11.36pm |
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Originally posted by cpfc_chap
So what happens when a majority leave wins the next ge namely brexit and Tories combined surely they'll just revoke taking no deal off the table? If they have a majority and their MPs all stay in line then they will either try to get a deal done within the time limit which will then exist or leave without one. That's the way our democracy works. Via Parliament.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 26 Sep 19 11.43pm |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
The theory of the wisdom of crowds suggests that with 100,000 people for every MP they might sometimes be better able to judge what is best for them. With 100,000 people there will probably be 10,000 opinions. That everyone is entitled to hold an opinion, and make it known at the ballot box, does not mean they are all equally valuable or even valid. Someone has to represent the people and that's our MPs.
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Teddy Eagle  27 Sep 19 12.18am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
With 100,000 people there will probably be 10,000 opinions. That everyone is entitled to hold an opinion, and make it known at the ballot box, does not mean they are all equally valuable or even valid. Someone has to represent the people and that's our MPs. Face it they’re not exactly the best and brightest are they? If they were voted out they’d be replaced by more of the same.
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| Mapletree Croydon 27 Sep 19 12.41am |
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Originally posted by Kermit8
You hard right pseudo-patriots still at it ? 😆 Yes of course Brexit led by a bunch of entitled buffoons taking the piss of you is still a good idea for the UK 😄 I see migration from African and Asian countries is up. Just what you’d hoped for, what ? Ah well - blind leading the blind Good grief you’re back Did ‘the other place’ start to bore you? Delighted to hear from you again.
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| W12 27 Sep 19 9.56am | |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Face it they’re not exactly the best and brightest are they? If they were voted out they’d be replaced by more of the same.
Who would ahve thought.
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| Wisbech Eagle Truro Cornwall 27 Sep 19 10.06am |
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Originally posted by Teddy Eagle
Face it they’re not exactly the best and brightest are they? If they were voted out they’d be replaced by more of the same. It's up to us to elect who we want to represent us. I would rather have 650 using their collective wisdom, access to specialists and ability to communicate with people in their constituencies than delegate it all to one person, who then becomes a dictator. You don't really want that do you? Especially someones as flawed as Trump! Trump wasn't elected "to take decisions for America" anymore than Johnson was for the UK. In other words not at all! He was elected to head the executive branch of government in the USA. This is just one of 3 equal branches, none more important than another. He needs to work with Congress and within the law. Just as Johnson needs to gain the approval of Parliament for every action he proposes and work within the law.
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| W12 27 Sep 19 10.48am | |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It's up to us to elect who we want to represent us. I would rather have 650 using their collective wisdom, access to specialists and ability to communicate with people in their constituencies than delegate it all to one person, who then becomes a dictator. You don't really want that do you? Especially someones as flawed as Trump! Trump wasn't elected "to take decisions for America" anymore than Johnson was for the UK. In other words not at all! He was elected to head the executive branch of government in the USA. This is just one of 3 equal branches, none more important than another. He needs to work with Congress and within the law. Just as Johnson needs to gain the approval of Parliament for every action he proposes and work within the law. "collective wisdom" "access to specialists" "ability to communicate with people" Don't make me laugh. We used to have politician's that would serve parliament after a lifetime of real work or service behind them. They understood the real world and real people because that's where they operated. Now we have ideogically driven people coming into politics straight from university or some quango, and housewives who think they are going to change the world armed only with their feelings. People like you will also defend a rich remain fanatic having fast tracked and direct access to Blairs unelected "supreme" court so that they can bypass the constitution, effectively pull a brand new law out of their own ass and say the government broke it in one stroke. Compare that to what's happened to the Tilbrook case that's been constantly blocked and delayed in the courts. The liberal elite don't want to leave the EU and are willing to cause massive constitutional problems and even potentially large scale civil unrest to get their way. People are not going to forget this and Brexiteers, like Trump suporters, are not going away. I fully expect this to go down a very dark path now and the fault will be squarly with those that refused to respect the vote. They will stop at nothing it seems. Trump is flawed but still 100x better than any of the democrat candidates.
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cryrst  The garden of England 27 Sep 19 10.50am |
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Originally posted by Wisbech Eagle
It's up to us to elect who we want to represent us. I would rather have 650 using their collective wisdom, access to specialists and ability to communicate with people in their constituencies than delegate it all to one person, who then becomes a dictator. You don't really want that do you? Especially someones as flawed as Trump! Trump wasn't elected "to take decisions for America" anymore than Johnson was for the UK. In other words not at all! He was elected to head the executive branch of government in the USA. This is just one of 3 equal branches, none more important than another. He needs to work with Congress and within the law. Just as Johnson needs to gain the approval of Parliament for every action he proposes and work within the law. So what does having a working majority actually allow you to do?
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| Matov 27 Sep 19 11.17am |
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Originally posted by W12
People are not going to forget this and Brexiteers, like Trump suporters, are not going away. I fully expect this to go down a very dark path now and the fault will be squarly with those that refused to respect the vote. They will stop at nothing it seems.
Makes no sense what so ever. Remain lost. That simple. And yet here we are, over three years later and still having this argument. Utterly fraudulent on every conceivable level. Varients of Leave, that I get. And even a Parliament that decides to revoke A50 because it claims it knows better than the rest of us. Once again, perfectly within its legitimate, if not moral, remit. But to want us to have to relieve the ghastly ordeal all over again with the losing option of 'Remain' on the ballot paper and then, with straight faces, tell us it will help 'heal' the nation? Simply beyond any logical or rational comprehension. All the t***s campaigning for a second referendum want it for is to maintain their own self-image as the good guys in all of this. The pretty bright young things. They love the planet, a large % of them are vegans, think Gay people are smashing and just LOVE a tranny along with Muslims (but only the cuddly ones. Not those nasty ones up in Birmingham and protesting outside of schools. Those we don't talk about because if we keep quiet they will just slink away). But above all else...DEMOCRATS. Passionate believers in the right of people to vote. Encouraging it in fact. Keen for more people to do so. Until 17.4 million of them do and you don't like the outcome. For any campaigner for a second referendum reading this then I urge you to find a mirror in your house (I suspect that for most of you this will not be a problem) and take a good hard look at what an utter f***ing w***er looks like. One who is, when all said and done, desperate to over-turn 17.4 million votes. To consign them to the dustbin of political history. You aint a democrat. You are a Nazi. A Communist. A person who believes that you vote should count for more than mine. Be honest about that. Celebrate it. Good luck to you. But don't ever kid yourself, anymore, that you are a democrat. Because you ain't. Oh. And Brexit does not go away until we leave the EU. Might take a few more weeks. Perhaps months. Even years. But we are leaving, come hell or high water. Only question is how much blood do you want on your hands before then?
"The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command." - 1984 - George Orwell. |
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